$0.25 AI SEO: Rank Everywhere for the Price of a Stamp | INBOUND 2025

So, I now stand between you guys and and

lunch. I'll make it worth your while.

Um, so here's how we're going to do

this. I'm going to go for about probably

354 minutes or so, and I think we have

two mics up here. I'm going to leave

some time for for Q&A as well. Um, but

there's a lot to cover. I'm probably

going to overload you with a lot of

information. Um, we'll talk about the

practical use cases of around AI and

really how you can 10x yourself and and

100x yourself. So, um, let's get into

it. So, just quick background on myself.

Uh, my name is Eric Sue and main

business is an ad agency called Single

Grain and I have a LinkedIn adation

software called Carrot. And then I mess

around with my YouTube channel called

Leveling Up. And then yesterday, if you

were here, I was uh doing my little

podcast with another marketer named Neil

Patel and our podcast is called

Marketing School. Um, but enough about

me. Just some other housekeeping items,

too. That little orange box that you

see, that is if you want these slides.

So, hopefully it gets good and you want

to download them. Um, you'll see that

orange box continue to pop up throughout

the the presentation. Um, so you don't

have to, I guess, take a picture of

everything. Uh, so the first thing I

wanted to cover here is this slide,

which is insane to me. So, not even just

marketing. When you think about business

as a game, it it's changed quite a bit.

Those of you that have heard of Cursor,

you look at Cursor's monthly recurring

revenue, 0 to 100 million in about 21

months with 20 people. And then you look

at midjourney 0 to 200 million in two

years with 10 people lovable 0 to10

million took him about two months with

15 people or so. So I'm not going to go

down this entire list but this was just

a little while back. You look at it now

cursor

$500 million run rate midjourney $500

million with less than 100 people each

lovable on track for 100 million and

this is in July and they have 45 people

now. So they're all growing very

quickly. So what does this say? This is

telling us that you're able to build big

businesses with smaller teams now,

right? So we we all see these

efficiencies happening. Um, hey Thomas,

so the cost of intelligence is dropping.

You look at this this graph over here.

You look at Deep Seek versus 03 versus

03 Pro. So this is Deep Seek. This is

China's open model versus OpenAI's

model. And if you look at the very

right, just look at the yellow one.

That's 03 Pro, 80 bucks. And you have 40

bucks for for 03. And then look at this

drop down. drops from 80 to 40 and then

I think the other one dropped from 40 to

808 dollars or so. So, this is all just

saying that the cost per token is

dropping quite a bit when we're using

these when we're using OpenAI's APIs. Um

the cost of intelligence is dropping

which means we're going to do a lot more

for cheaper. That's what I'm really

saying at the end of the day. So, and by

the way guys, I I'm not technical at

all. I'm going to show you how I go

about um running these these marketing

workflows and these business workflows

really and and how I've built this this

business operating system. And I think

everyone here needs to take advantage of

it. Uh, but again, the game has changed

quite a bit. The cost of intelligence is

dropping. Um, but if we focus this back

on SEO, which is the premise of the

title, 25cent SEO. Um, I think the first

thing to call out that's worth calling

out here is the fact that traffic,

website traffic is coming down. So,

those of you that aren't too much in the

game of SEO right now, um, this is

what's happening in SEO. So, if you look

at your Google search console, your

website impressions are going up, but

your your website traffic is coming

down, right? Right? So website traffic

is coming down and we we call this the

alligator pattern. We we call this the

the great decoupling. Um I like to look

at this as uh if you think about Uncle

Warren Buffett, he likes to look at

businesses that are coming down as cigar

butt businesses, right? So I I'm not

saying that Google is dying. Google's

actually doing very well, $15 billion in

net income in the last 12 months or so.

Um number one of all companies. Uh but

website traffic itself, that game is

changing, but that doesn't mean you

should throw it away, right? Um and AI

overviews. This study was done by by

hrefs. This actually shows that um AI

overviews are ex are affecting website

clicks negatively by about 35% or so. So

I wanted to set the tone with these

stats in the beginning to show you how

the game is changing and and how we I I

think the only thing now is for sure

that we know is that the game is

changing but we we have to adapt right.

And so when we think about my company

the the people in my company there's

three types of people right now when it

comes to the world of AI or marketing in

general. You have a the anchors. Okay,

these are people that are resistant to

AI. I don't want to deal with it. I

don't believe in AI. It makes too many

mistakes. It hallucinates. Yeah, it does

all that. Sure. Um, and so you have the

anchors and then C, you have the

converts. So the converts, these are the

people that are open to learning. They

just need some guidance. Okay? And then

F, you have the fanatics. So the

fanatics, these are people that are

constantly ahead of the curve. They're

constantly testing new things, right?

And what I would encourage you, it

doesn't matter if you're a marketing

manager, a marketing director, a CMO, it

doesn't matter if you're a founder. I

would encourage you, each and every one

of you here, to set up dinners with

other people that are at your level,

similar to your level, maybe a few

clicks above your level, and set up

these dinners. And these go a long way.

I'll just share a story here before I I

start to get into the the stack. Um, I

think about two months ago, I hosted an

AI dinner with with one of my buddies,

and we we had a couple CTOs there, a

couple CEOs there. That led to someone

else inviting me to an AI lunch and that

had about 40 people or so and that lunch

you you people doing you know all these

different businesses some are doing

eight nine 10 figures or so doesn't

matter what matters is everyone's a

student right now and when we asked in

that room who here actually uses cursor

even the nontechnical people they're

using cursor right and and more on that

in a second but my point is you don't

necessarily need to have money to throw

to start throwing these lunches and

dinners if you can become the connector

you're everyone's going to remember you

one thing's going to lead to another

you're going to build your network And

nobody can ever take that network away

from you. And that's how you're gonna

build defensibility with whatever that

you decide to do in your career. And and

again, that brand that you build being

that connector that served me well. Um,

but we're not here to talk about

networking, but just a little thing that

you can do to to help you. So,

this is the main thing that I wanted to

talk talk about here. The way that we're

doing marketing is changing. And I

touched upon this a little bit yesterday

in our little marketing school session,

but I didn't have enough time. So, I

I've got a lot of time today. So, I'm

going to try to go a little deeper and

then tell you how I'm doing this. And

then hopefully during Q&A, maybe I can

because I talk really fast, maybe you

guys can ask some questions, some

clarifying questions, and maybe that

will help the entire audience here. Um,

but if you look at the very top, those

three icons over here, um, who here

actually uses cursor? Just quick show of

hands. Okay, so let's say it's like I

don't know, maybe five or 10% or so. And

then claude code. Anybody?

Okay, wow, that's actually more. And

then, uh, MCPs. Anybody familiar with

MCPS? Okay, so good chunk of people. So

I I'll explain MCPS real quick. So MCPs

are model context protocols. And just

think of it as you can have your apps

talk to each other. So you can have

cursor, which is your IDE or your your

coding editor. You could have it talk to

your HubSpot instance. You can have it

talk to your Gong instance. You can have

it talk to your Google Analytics

instance. Um when you combine cursor,

which is the coding the the coding

editor, and by the way, I'm not

technical at all. Again, um I can ask it

to create sub aents using claw code. So

think of these as sub employees and then

I can connect it with MCP so that the

sub aents these employees can call upon

the different tools here. So I'm going

to give you a couple of examples just to

get your your wheels turning here in

terms of how you might apply this to

your business. So one example might be I

want to hook in I I want to create an

SEO employee. So I'm going to create a

sub agent. I'll go into cloud code um

and I actually dictate this using a tool

called Super Whisper. So I'm not even

typing this out. I'm just saying, hey, I

want to create an SEO analyzer that will

look at my Google Analytics and look at

my Google search console and then also

connect with the hrefs MCP, which is an

SEO tool, and then tell me what content

I should be going after based on what's

converting on my website. So, if I had

to do that with my team, that would take

what, days, weeks, sometimes maybe even

a month or more to get that done. I no

longer have to wait for that. I can get

that analysis done very quickly. It'll

say, "Hey, these are the highest

converting sections for your site. These

are the pillars you should be looking

at. here are trending keywords related

to these pillars and uh oh by the way

here's content that's being uh

cannibalized on your website you should

think about you know combining deleting

you know consolidating all these things

right these are all SEO terms here but

my point here is that you can spin up

these these sub aents these little

employees within minutes I'm talking

three minutes at a pop okay um and then

afterwards you can connect it with your

CMS you can connect it with your

WordPress CMS and it will spin up a

draft for you and so doing these things

this was impossible for me a year ago.

And um it's to me it's extremely

exciting. I'm probably spending a couple

hours on this every single week. And now

what I'm doing is I'm actually for the

fanatics on my team that are into this

stuff. I'm hiring a coach for them to

tutor them on this and to set them up

with all this. Um I can go on and on

about the different use cases here. I

I'll just give you one more and then I

I'll move on. You can tell I'm pretty

excited about it. Um but connecting it

with your HubSpot and then your Gong

instance, show me the sales data from

the last six months or so versus the

last six months. What are the trends

that you're seeing with both Gong and

HubSpot? What should we be doing? Oh,

you can connect it with all your your

your Quickbooks. You can connect it with

whatever whatever else that you have.

But this to me is not just a marketing

operating system. It is a business

operating system. And the things that

you can do here and it's it's hard to

see, but on the right on the right side,

you can see that it's giving me the

keywords that based on keyword

difficulty that we should be going after

based on what's converting on our

website. Think about how that works for

you. And and this doesn't just apply to

SEO. This applies to all different

disciplines. You can take a look at your

competitor's ads. How are they running

ads? What is their strategy exactly?

What are the CRO tests that you should

be running on your site to increase your

conversion rates. All these things you

are now able to you as one person,

you're able to orchestrate all these sub

agents. So, a lot of people like to talk

about agents, but it seems like all pie

in the sky, but this to me is we're

getting a lot closer to it now. And

anybody I'm I'm pretty sure most of us

are not technical here, right? If I'm

not technical and I can do this, you can

do this, too. I'm going to show you how

in a in a couple slides. Um, so here's

another example. This is just a simple

example in terms of it pumping out a

blog post based on our writer

guidelines. So it will scan our blog

post and it'll look at how we write our

blog post and it'll kick it out here and

then what will happen is we'll have

people on our team. It's still very AI

assistant. So we have a human in a loop

here. Um, and when we have our team look

at it, they're like, "Yeah, this is

pretty damn good." Right? And so I'm not

saying you should go out there and use

AI to create a bunch of slop. That

doesn't work well. But it's already been

proven that Google does rank AI content

um many times over and HFS has a good a

couple good case studies on this. And so

this is the premise of this talk here.

Like we I was just asking Claude code

here and uh cursor. I was like, man,

you're generating all these these these

posts like how much is this costing

right now per post? And it it did an

estimate. It's actually 13 cents for one

of these. Um and it's going to get

cheaper and cheaper. You guys saw the

token uh the the drops earlier, right?

That's just going to continue to get

cheaper and cheaper. And so I just look

at all of this as if you and I can do

this, you're you become 10x, you become

you become 100x. And the way I like to

break this down is I look at money. And

I think money doesn't change most

people. I think money amplifies your

nature. I think AI amplifies your mind.

So if you're not a person who wants to

grow, which is everyone here wants to

grow. If you want to grow, it's going to

amplify you 10 100x down the road. If

you don't want to grow, I think it's

going to make you 10% of of of who you

are, right? and that's not what we want

to do. Um, so I actually think the

future of marketing, the future of

business in general is going to be

multi- instance. So I used to play

online poker in my college years and I

used to play I used to have 16 tables

open at once. This guy over here, he's a

pro player. His name's Eli and he would

have 48 tables open at once. But just

imagine it this way. Each little

instance that you have, one's an SEO

employee, one is an analytics employee,

one is a CRO employee, one is a finance

employee. you all these employees that

you have working with you, you and and

then if it tells you something's wrong

over here, oh, we we need you to review

this over here. Okay, boom, you're gonna

open up that instance, right? So, I

think what's going to happen is the

future of of marketing, the future of

business is going to look like a video

game. And to me, it's becoming really

fun. Like, I think everything's a video

game and and this is exactly how I want

to play it, right? And so, um you know,

this is interesting. I was watching um

there was a there was an Instagram reel

today with uh it was on dire of a CEO

Steven Bartlett and uh this investor

Monish Pbry who's known as the the

Indian Warren Buffett um he was like why

do you need free time you know running a

business it's like having an orgasm

every hour and I thought it was a little

cheeky um but but to me it's like you're

if you're playing a video I don't know

if it's orgasm every hour but like

playing a video game this is pretty fun

man so how am I doing this right now all

you need to

Literally, this is what I did. I I was

talking to a friend about this and he's

like, "Oh, yeah. I just hired a a coach,

a cursor coach." I was like, "Why do you

need a cursor coach?" He's like, "Well,

um, it it I'm not technical, so it

teaches me how I can use it from a

creative standpoint, from a design

standpoint." So, I was like, "Huh, how

do I use this for my life?" So, I went

on to Upwork, literally Upwork, that's

all you need to do. Just go to Upwork

and I put up a put out a job posting for

this. And I hired a guy from China. And

uh this guy from China, it cost me like

50 bucks an hour. And what what was he

doing? He was literally getting on Zoom

calls with me. And I was telling him

what I wanted to do. And the first Zoom

call it was a little messy. It was like

a little introduction, but Zoom calls

two through four, all we did was he

would do screen shares with me.

Sometimes I'd share access to my uh

control over my computer and he'd set

things up for me. And by the third or

fourth session, the third or fourth

hour, I was already humming on this and

uh I had all these different MCPS uh set

up. And so it's really not that bad. If

you're semi-technical, you can just set

this up yourself. But give this 3 4

hours and you'll become it. You've got

to become like a multiple of yourself at

the very least, right? Maybe 2x, 3x,

eventually 10x, eventually 100x. Um,

that is the premise of this talk. I have

a couple other things to to show you as

well as we go through this, but um I

think if you're to leave this talk with

anything, just understand the future of

marketing is going to look like a video

game. It's going to become

multi-instance. Um, and I think that's

very exciting.

Okay, so we talked about just how SEO is

changing, how business is changing, a

little more on how SEO is changing. So

people here like to call it AEO, they

like to call it GEO, they like to call

it LMO. Uh Neil and I, we call it search

everywhere optimization. And so 15 years

ago, you might be able to say the only

game in town, organic game in town, was

Google. There was no Instagram. YouTube

was still just very much getting

started. Snap wasn't there. uh meta

wasn't really there, right? So, but

nowadays, YouTube, second largest search

engine in the world. Uh Amazon, if

you're trying to optimize for for for

shopping, you got to do Amazon. App

store optimization. If you're if you're

doing mobile uh LLM, you got to optimize

for the LLM services, too. Um

communities like Reddit, for example,

these the graph that you're seeing

moving up to the right, these are all um

communities moving up and to the right

because Google is favoring those more.

And so that means that but besides the

things I just showed you, we all need to

become even though I'm pretty sure most

of us here aren't SEOs. My background is

in SEO, but as marketers, we we need to

become more generalist. And that's why

I'm even calling this out right now, the

search everywhere optimization thing,

because it can't just be one thing. Um,

even though for traditional SEO, yes,

you can still write transactional

content, bottom ofunnel content, um,

that that that converts well, that still

does really well for us, that can't just

be the only thing that you do. You're

gonna have to diversify. And so I spent

a lot of my time on on nerding out on

YouTube. And so this is a little

interview that I did with uh with Seth

Goden a while back about a year ago or

so. Um and YouTube to me because I think

YouTube is top three cited by by the LLM

services. I think Reddit's number one,

Wikipedia is number two, and then uh

YouTube is number three, and then

depending on what you're looking at,

sometimes LinkedIn even pops up as

number four. And so to spend time on

YouTube is going to be a nice investment

for the next decade or so. Um, and going

back to the MCPs that I showed you, the

cursor stack, the the cloud code stack.

This is what I'm doing with with uh with

YouTube. I'm like, okay, um, I want you

to look at my competitors over here. I

want you to look at the last 90 days.

What are their top performers? So, I can

look at their packaging because about

YouTube for for YouTube, it's about the

idea. It's about the packaging. Okay?

Um, and so it will, you can't see the

output here, but when you download the

slides, you should be able to see it.

Um, but it gives me the output on what's

performing well. It gives me a little

table here. Hey, here's what worked out

well for for Gary Vee. maybe you should

consider this format over here based on

the last uh 30 days of videos that you

did. And so now I have a strategist. Um

sure, we hire a lot of professionals um

from from YouTube jobs like ytjob.co um

for our YouTube channel, but sometimes I

just don't want to wait. And guess what?

I'll give you a little another nugget

here. Um by using Google Nano Banana, I

no longer have to wait for thumbnails.

We we have a we have a couple thumbnail

designers, but sometimes I just don't

want to wait. Sometimes you just want to

publish something if it if it's

newsworthy. Um so that's important. So,

you can use the stack that I showed you

to help you as your YouTube strategist,

all the other things that I mentioned.

Um, but just keep in mind when you're

playing on these other channels, whether

it's YouTube, whether it's Reddit, um, I

think the problem with SEOs, I'm really

kind of criticizing MySpace and the the

SEO world. Um, is people, whether you're

a paid media manager or SEO person, you

have to look at each channel with a

different lens. You have to post

natively for each channel. A lot of SEOs

are like, "Oh, yeah, you know, YouTube's

really about optimizing for the right

keyword and, you know, the the right uh

tags and all that stuff." That doesn't

matter nearly as much as the idea or the

packaging or the first 30 second

retention or your the open loops that

you have throughout the videos, right?

And so, just keep in mind every single

channel you look at, look at it from a

native lens. Don't look at it from, you

know, the the industry that you come

from. And that's how you're going to win

on these channels. And I I think um I

was talking to a guy yesterday a after

our session and he's like, "Man, you

know, you and Neil, you guys talk so

much about the AI stuff, I feel like I

have nothing to talk about." But I'm

like, "No, you know more than us about

um product marketing. You know way more

than us as a head of AI. Why don't you

start a head of AI podcast?" And so I

think anybody here um anybody here can

can can start creating content and uh

it's just going to compound over time.

And I actually um was talking to I was

talking to a friend and and we just

we're like man whatever we've seen

usually with business or or whether it's

uh business or or creating an audience

it always seems to take three years. And

then um someone else kind of chimed into

the conversation and was like why do you

think it takes three years? And my

immediate response was most people just

don't want to sit through the misery and

and not being able to see progress for

three years. But honestly, that for

whatever reason, every single business

I've started or every single channel

I've started, it's always three years.

And if you can sit through that, you're

going to be fine. And so, I guess that's

another takeaway for you. Um, so we

talked about YouTube. Um, this is this

is interesting to me because when you

look at the the the new game of Medium

now, especially with V3 from from

Google, which is their their video

model, um, and Google Nano Banana, um,

which allows you to have character

consistency, which is a AI. thing AIs

have struggled with. Um, but you can do

this now and and if you have the rights

from like a celebrity or a micro

influencer, uh, you can use something

like Midjourney to or not, sorry, not

Midjourney, but um, hey Jen, um, I guess

even Midjourney as well to make these

ads for you. And this ad in particular

from uh, Cody Schneider actually tweeted

this um, is getting like 69 cent leads

for a coffee shop. And so we're going to

see a lot more of this come into play

because pretty soon we're not going to

be able to tell what is AI versus what

isn't. Um, and this example here, this

is actually a naked grandpa skiing. Uh,

so this is from um the CEO of Mudwater.

So he used V3 and it looks like he used

11 Labs for um a Ryan Reynolds type

voice I think or Bert Reynolds it says.

Um and he scripted it using notion and

this cost him $100 to make it. It looked

pretty good. He had some B-roll from his

uh from his drink Mudwater. Um and he

had a bunch of um just older people

doing things that they want to do in

their life, right? Whether it's starting

a cult or skiing naked or something like

that. And he said that typically this

would have cost him like I don't know

six months six months of time uh but

maybe a couple hundred grand to to get

this done. So again costs of everything

are coming down. Um it's a matter of how

much are we willing to play with this

stuff. And again I'll say with these AI

dinners like we have another one

happening in LA um later this month. But

we're just constantly seeing who's on

top of this stuff. And it's it really

comes from the top. Like if you have

that power if you're the founder or

you're an executive that can influence

decisions it's really going to come from

you. That the excitement's got to come

from you. Otherwise, it's it's it's it's

it's not going to happen. Um, this is

also interesting to me, too. So, this

company is based in in SF, and they've

been getting a lot of press, maybe not

so much in the last couple months or so,

but this company is called Cluey, and

their whole model is cheat on

everything. So, it's like a heads-up

display that shows you how to, you know,

ace your interview or um maybe maybe

like a like a job interview that you're

doing, right? And so the top left one

here, I remember watching that video

that I think that video actually has

four million views now, but it was like

um this girl and this guy were on like

an online date, like a Zoom date. And um

the guy was trying to talk about

football, but the girl had no idea about

like who Neymar was and all these things

and and the guy was like, "Who's your

favorite player?" And then the heads-up

display was like, "You should talk about

Neymar because of X, Y, and Z." So she

did that and then everyone in the

comments like four million views on that

video. What what tool was that? What

what app is that? What app is that? So,

if you're in consumer SAS, this works,

right? But I I think um even in B2B SAS,

um you know, playing the organic short

form game, um for whatever reason,

because we're most of us here are in

B2B, um we're always 5 years behind of

of the DDC world. But I will tell you

that a lot of my B2B SAS uh founder

friends, um we are trying to explore

what we can do in in this world. So, I

think one of my friends um he does like

weapon screenings for for schools to

just keep schools safer for kids. And um

one of the crazy things he wanted to do

was just walk into like stores in

different states with a gun and see what

happens to him, right? And I'm not

saying you should do that, but he's

trying he's trying to go a little like

outside the box here. Um and so I don't

think enough people look at organic

short form because it doesn't convert

well. What I'll say is

sometimes when we do the marketing

school podcast, um I'll talk about

discounts and they'll get like seven to

eight million views. Like, oh, Shake

Shack has a free chicken sandwich, 8

million views. Um, oh, this Laurel Piana

store over here is like massive 90%

discount in Italy, like four million

views, right? And can I can I attribute

it to any conversions? No. But I can

tell you when I go to business

conferences, when a couple people walk

up to me, I can tell you that's a touch

point. And the way I look at marketing

now is is very much the rule of seven

was was, "Oh, seven touch points back in

the day." I think it's like the rule of

21 now. People have to look at your

stuff quite a bit. And if that's a touch

point, I'll take it. Um, I'll take it

any day. So, I think it's worth it to

study uh companies like Clo. I think

there's another company called Jenny. I

think it's Jenni. Um, take a look at all

these companies, look at what they're

doing, and figure out how you can apply

to to your company. So, again, I started

with MCPS, but I'm I'm just kind of

going down the practical here's what's

working today um in terms of what I've

seen. Um, and then I know this guy Rowan

Chung here. So, he's got an email list

um on AI called the rundown. And for

him,

this Instagram, he built it in a week

and got a 100,000 followers. But more

than anything, you can see some of these

these videos here. So, the the views 2.6

6 million 1.7 million 234K or so. He

used Hey Genen for this. This is just

going to get better over time and he

just covers the latest AI news and he

has an avatar doing it and he uses many

chat to collect the the emails. And so

if you want to grow email list quickly

again leveraging organic social,

leveraging short form um that's a way to

build your email list very quickly and

um as we mentioned yesterday I think

email is what like a 34x return on

investment. So it's still the highest

channel of of all the channels today.

Okay.

So, as I continue on here, let's talk

about how you can because we were

talking about SEO earlier, how you can

rank highly from an AI, SEO, and GEO

standpoint. And so, this is not to toot

our own horn, but whenever you search,

typically on most LLM services, what's

the best marketing podcast out there,

usually marketing school is going to pop

up number one or number two. And I'm not

necessarily going to say that Neil and I

are the best or whatever. But I think if

if anything, we've probably been the one

of the most consistent in the last nine

years or so. I think Gary Vee has been

very consistent. Um, we've been

consistent doing that podcast. every

single day there's a new episode and um

that's why it pops up. We we think about

citations. Citations matter, right? So,

it's not just links anymore. It's how

many reviews are you getting? Um how

often are you publishing? How consistent

are you are? Uh how consistent are you?

How how is the brand sentiment overall?

And so Neil publishes a ton of content.

I publish a lot. And it's like, oh,

these two that publish a lot of content

already are doing this marketing

podcast. That's why we're consistent.

Um, and so I think that's one of the key

things around ranking highly from a GEO

standpoint today or LMO, whatever you

want to call it. Um, and

but all of that ties back into, oh crap,

these LLMs also look at Reddit. They

also look at YouTube, too. And so, um,

those of you that saw the session

yesterday, apparently Neil runs a lot of

Reddit stuff for his personal brand, but

he wouldn't reveal it on stage. I'll get

it out of him on the podcast. So, um,

make sure you guys subscribe. So I'm

going to keep going here because I got a

couple more slides. So

these yesterday what we talked about was

these vibe coding tools. So Replet is

amazing. Lovable is amazing. Um you can

use all these to to build what you want.

And what we love in with with our

business is we love giving away free

tools. So this is one of our free tools

here called Clickflow. And um you know

one of our free offers is free you know

x amount of words. And these are agentic

workflows that we have for our team

because these are the issues that that

that they're struggling with. Um and so

you don't necessarily have to spend

engineering time on this, but can you go

go to replet and replet is is allowing

you to do a lot more now in terms of

deploying and um just driving things to

to to production. Um but if you can get

80 to 90% there and then hand it off to

developers, then you're going to have

something that you can give away. And I

will say that a lot of our free tools, a

lot of our calculators that we published

in the last 3 months or so, they're

ranking very highly and they're driving

a lot of visits. Um, so that strategy

still works today. And if I were to give

you another strategy, um, if you can

create custom GPTs, because Google is

actually ranking OpenAI's custom GPTs

really highly right now, um, if you can

do that, that'd be great. Even better

than that, if you guys have some budget,

go acquire some uh chat GPT plugins

because that's what one of my friends

did um in a certain niche and he uh he

drives a multiple on revenue in terms of

each month from the plugins that the

plug-in traffic that he gets. So you can

you can go buy plugins um or you can

create custom uh chat GPTs and just have

them rank higher or you can go create uh

different tools and just give them away

on your website. Um and you can vibe

code these things. Um I I think people

like to make vibe coding seem like it's

uh you can just create anything you

want. I I don't think it's that easy

right now. Um, but it's it's it's pretty

good.

This is just a screenshot of of of Manis

over here. Um, and the reason I like

Manis, these are two AI products that we

use. We use Manis and we use Gen Spark.

So, Manis and Gen Spark, they have these

super agents. And the beautiful piece

about these super agents is that I can

go to because Carrot is our LinkedIn

accountbased marketing software, right?

I I said, "Okay, I want you to create um

you know, longtail transactional

keywords that are high converting um for

for carrot." And using Madison's super

agent, it found 50 keywords. I picked 20

and I said, "Okay, you're going to have

to take a look at our our writer

guidelines to make sure that the the the

blog posts are high quality." And it

kicked out 21 blog posts um in about 25

minutes or so. And you guys might

thinking, "Oh man, that that's probably

crappy blog post. Probably crappy crappy

quality." But reality was maybe like 90%

quality and then we had to have a human

in the loop there. But that's still

pretty damn good for whatever we pay for

manness a month. I think it's like what

$50 or maybe $200 a month. Um and so

just keep these in mind. I I mean it's

people might say, "Oh my god, you know,

you don't want to just spam the

internet." Yeah, you don't want to spam

the internet, but if it's get 90% there

already, it's worth taking a look at. So

manage is great. GenSpark is great. Love

both of those. Um earlier I talked about

Replet. So now everyone here has has

developer skills. the the the

conversations I'm having behind the

scenes um with a lot of founders right

now is that man everyone kind of needs

to become a generalist which is what I

said earlier. So this is reinforcing the

fact that everyone here we're becoming

pseudo developers we're becoming pseudo

sales people pseudo marketers pseudo

customer success people um we have a lot

more power in our hands now and and I

guess that's why it feels like a video

game.

This is this is carrot over here. This

is just another one of our tools. But I

will say for for Carrot specifically, um

what we did was we created something

that wasn't available before. And so you

can vibe code these things, right? We we

heard from one of our customers, you

know, one of our challenges was that um

we can't create ads quickly enough.

Let's say we want to target a 100

companies on LinkedIn. It would take us

weeks to create personalized campaigns

for all of them. We're like, okay, we'll

just make a tool. Um so we made Carrot

and we weren't sure about it yet. That's

the thing. So, we're we're we're now on

search everywhere organic reach with

LinkedIn. So, I just took a screenshot

of one of our features. I threw it up on

LinkedIn and um 1300 comments now. I

think it's like 800 likes or so, but

maybe 150,000 views on this and probably

I would say 800 leads for a carrot and

maybe 150 to 200 of them were ultra

qualified. And so we're going to get to

a place, maybe not right now with vibe

coding, but we are going to get to a

place where you just listen to your

customers. Go to all your gong calls,

Otter, whatever it is that you're using.

Listen to what challenges. Hey, what

challenges do you have? Okay, that whole

magic wand question. If you can solve

anything with the magic wand, you can

actually solve a lot of these things

now. You can you can vibe code something

up. Um, and I have seen a lot of these

vibecoded products actually making money

now. Um, we engineered this from the

from the ground up. But, um, that that's

my point of showing you carrot here.

It's it's because it came from a

customer conversation. We built

something. We reinforced what we built

by putting it up on LinkedIn and then

LinkedIn LinkedIn proved it out. Um, so

we talked about manage here. Um, one

thing I do want to talk about, we talked

about Gen Spark, we talked about OpenAI,

but one product that's also really good

that's that's those of you that run a

business here, um, or even if you're a

leader, Lindy has been great for us in

terms of coaching our team. And what I

mean by that is what we do for our

companies, we we we want to help people

prioritize, right, correctly. And so

every single day, let's say I I'm I'm

I'm basically required to kind of report

in on, hey, here's the highest leverage

thing that I'm working on today. Here

are the three big things I got done

yesterday. Okay. Um and that's kind of

our our standup bot that that sits

inside of Slack. Now, what this coach

does, Lindy, it creates these agentic

workflows and then Lindy will go in

there and it will coach people based on

what our goals are and how they can work

on higher leverage uh opportunities. And

that happens every single day. And we're

going to continue to refine this agentic

workflow over time, but imagine having a

coach in all your meetings. We all sit

in probably way too many meetings. Um, a

lot of these meetings probably aren't

ran efficiently, but imagine if there's

a coach giving feedback on every single

meeting and then we can tweak and maybe

some people don't need to sit in a

meeting anymore. Maybe maybe if we just

tweak this meeting over here, maybe it's

going to be 10 times more efficient. Who

knows? But I'm sure we're all sick of

wasting time in meetings.

And as we get closer to wrapping here,

um, all the documentation that you have

in Dropbox, in Box, um, even all the

looms that you made, these are all

infinitely more useful now because

we need to context engineer how we're

working with these AIs. They need as

much context as possible. And you have

that within all the documentation. So

all that useless documentation that at

least for us that was collecting dust,

it's now infinitely more useful. And as

long as we keep it updated and we keep

feeding it into these custom GPTs or

these these projects, um we're going to

have a lot more of these a lot more

useful sub aents or a lot more useful

custom GPDs that we can use to do our

work better and faster.

So this is where I think we're heading.

I think a human AI operator at the top

and then you're going to have agents

running sub aents. Um and sub agents are

focused on ideally one task. Maybe one's

on SEO, internal linking, maybe one's on

creating an article, one's on updating

content, consolidating content. Um, but

this is how it's going to look. One of

you managing a hundred of these or a

thousand of these, um, and you doing

what you want to work on. Um, and not

having to do wrote boring work that

makes you want to, I don't know, not go

to work. So,

I think this is the way, this is one way

I like to look at this. So the the the

orange line over here where it's moving

up and to the right. Um that's where you

stack different agentic workflows. You

stack different agents. Um and you keep

compounding over time. And these only

work if you compound your own knowledge.

Okay. Um and the yellow is maybe if

you're doing a little bit, maybe it's

one single AI workflow. And then the

flat line here is if you don't do

anything at all. Um arguably that line

should probably go negative. So you

build your leverage today. And what I

would say is the bad news is that

marketing is getting harder. I think

it's very much a red ocean right now.

Um, but the good news is that you have a

golden opportunity right in front of

you. And most people aren't going to do

it, but you're not most people. So, take

advantage of this opportunity. Um, and

if you want the slides, um, up over

there in the I guess bottom right

orange. Um, and I guess we can take

questions now. Um, if there are any

questions.

So, here's a mic coming up over here.

And here's a mic coming up over here.

Okay, we got one over there.

>> So, you mentioned a lot of technologies.

If you had only three and no other

option, just had three to pick, who

would be your top three that you cannot

live without?

>> Top three that I can't live without

right now.

>> Yeah.

probably that stack, the cursor cloud

code MCP stack.

>> What are your thoughts on scaled content

and whether or not it's going to be

penalized by Google, other search

engines, chat GPTs?

I mean, it's it's everyone's using it.

It's spammy. What are your thoughts

there?

>> Yeah, I I don't think anyone has an

issue with quality. Um, as long as we're

scaling quality over time, there's not a

big issue with it. Um, and Google has

even said this themselves. And then HFS

did a study, I think it was on over

600,000 pieces and they compared it AI

versus non-AII and it was virtually the

same thing. And so that was my concern

in the very beginning. And just like

you, I'm sure I don't want to put slop

out on on their on the on the internet.

So any original research that you can

have is going to do a lot better than

just copying other people. So

right here.

>> Yeah. Um, so I run a services company.

Uh, I am technical. So I've got the

cloud code and MCPs all set up. But the

idea of like transferring that to my

team given sort of the complexity of it

seems really like daunting and scary. So

I was wondering if you could go into a

little bit more detail about like

lessons learned with that, how that

worked out, how much you had to support

them, like all of that.

>> Yeah. So I'm sure you can see with your

organization like who the fanatics are,

correct? So I I target the fanatics

first and then I just kind of float it

to them because I'm constantly showing

them what I'm doing. And part of the

reason why I make this stuff on YouTube

is to throw it out at them and say,

"Hey, what do you guys think about

this?" Right? And the ones who they're

when their eyes are lighting up, I'll

say, "Hey, what do you think if I got

you a coach for this?" And I paid for

the coach, would you dedicate some time

to this? And um some of my best people

right now in the evenings, they're

working with this coach. Um and I just

use the same coach that I that that I

hired originally. Um and what I'm going

to do eventually is I'm going to have it

become like cohorts. Um but right now

it's more one-on-one. So I think there's

a crawl walk run to all this. Does that

answer your question? Cool. right here.

>> How do you make time for content and get

leaders uh to also make that time

>> leaders to make time for content?

>> Yeah. Talking specifically about video,

podcasts,

>> those types of things.

>> Yeah. So, I so I probably spend around I

don't know 8 to 12 hours a week on

content. Um maybe a little less, but

there's a day that's dedicated to

content and then the rest is dedicated

to operating. But the thing for for

myself is like I'm working most of the

time. Like my mind's always working. So

I it's hard for me to break out. But I

would say there's one dedicated day to

content. Yeah.

>> I saw your process for using Manis to

crank out a whole bunch of blog posts.

And we hear a lot about

uh using AI to crank out tons of

hyperpersonalized content as part of the

the loop marketing. Uh, is there

anything that you need to do or that

you've learned to help get all of that

content visible to AI? Like what's the

submitting a robots.txt file for AI? Is

there something that you need to do to

make sure that AI sees all that?

>> Yeah, people like to talk about LLM.txt,

but there hasn't been any evidence that

it does much right now. I think there's

literally HRS has been publishing a lot

of great case studies on this. Um, so as

of right now, not really. Um, it's just

to me, and companies don't want to hear

this, but when companies come to us,

they're looking for GEO, AEO, all these

things. A lot of it's still very much

traditional SEO, and it's not that

different yet. It'll probably change in

the next 12 months or so,

>> right?

>> Yeah.

>> Hi, Eric. You mentioned we went from 8

to 21 touch points. Um, do you have any

experience with that? Is is something

happened recently? And then, uh, the

second part is are you using any intent

data to improve conversion and results?

Yeah. So the the first part is so I just

want to make sure I get the question

right. You're asking again the first

question.

>> Yeah. You said we went from eight touch

points to 21 I believe.

>> Yeah. So the rule of seven used to be

that you need to see something seven

times before taking an action. And now

it's much more I'm saying 21 because

attention is so disperate. And when you

think about the time spent on YouTube is

actually the highest time on video. And

then you I think LinkedIn's number two

with 26 seconds or so. Um but we're all

doing different things. We're all so

much more distractable. And that's why

my I haven't seen I would say yes I have

seen evidence because it's uh 99% of

people aren't ready to buy right and so

you just need to be in front of people

more which is why people are creating

content more. Yeah. And around intent

data. Yes. The short answer is yes.

Yeah.

>> You mentioned an MCP workflow with

WordPress and having it write drafts for

you from cursor and I use cloud code. Uh

can you speak a little bit more about

that?

>> Yeah. So with cursor when you create a

sub aent using cloud code um it will ask

you what what is it that you're trying

to do those of you that aren't familiar

with cloud code and so for me I just use

a dictating tool called super whisper

and I'll speak to it for about four to

five minutes or so saying hey here's

exactly what I want to do I want you to

use these MCPs over here I want you to

connect with WordPress but first I want

you to analyze um my Google Analytics

and my Google search console to see

what's performing and what isn't

performing um and then maybe in this

case I want you to create a blog post

for me based on our right writer

guidelines over here. So, I just dictate

out exactly what I'm looking for and

then it'll it'll pop up the prompt and

I'll look at it and I'll and I'll edit

the prompt and then I'll try running it

a couple times and we'll just continue

to refine it.

>> Well, and more so the MCP side of it

from WordPress. Is that a particular

plugin you're using or

>> Yeah, there's there's an MCP site um

that has all these MCPs that you can

just hook in with directly. It's pretty

easy. I just forgot what it's called,

but it's pretty easy to use.

>> That was okay. I'll look for that.

>> Yeah.

>> Thank yep.

>> Hello. I use uh Samrush to evaluate our

AI metrics uh like share a voice. Um

Samrush showed that we're ranking number

one for AI Google search compared to our

competitors, but we're in last place for

chat GPT. Uh do you know like the

different factors that influence each

LLM? Is that public information? Is

there anything we can reference to to

specifically rank higher for a specific

LLM?

>> Yeah. So, right now there's not enough

information. There's all these these

these tools out there like profound and

they help you like they show how you

rank and things like that but what I

would say is again it's not what you

want to hear but a lot of LLMO and GEO

stuff the reason why we rank it's still

a lot of traditional SEO it is citation

it is links um brand sentiment but the

this is why you have to take the search

everywhere approach where you are

hitting Reddit you are hitting YouTube

and maybe you nail down one first and

then you scale it out to the other ones

um I think if I were starting from

scratch day I'd probably lead off with

podcast and then do long form YouTube

and then cut it up in short form and

then go go try to make it um try to hit

the other channels like a lot of people

that you've seen. I'd probably do that

because I know LM are looking at 30 to

60 different sources whenever you're

searching for something. And when you do

deep research, it's it's way way deeper

than that. So, still very much

traditional SEO. It's not what you want

to hear, but it's it is time to play the

search everywhere game.

>> Okay. Thank you.

>> Cool. All right. One more.

>> Um what one really specific question.

You say show up everywhere and Amazon

was on your list. Do you mean sell on

like we we're an e-commerce. We don't

sell on Amazon.

>> Are there other ways to show up there

that I should know about?

>> Yeah. So, Amazon Amazon SEO versus like

Pinterest SEO versus Google SEO very

different. Amazon SEO is a little

easier. Pinterest is a little easier. Um

but I just what I my my whole premise of

saying that was that you have to think

about optimizing for the channels where

your customers are. It's just marketing

101. So, nothing nothing game changing

there. Yeah.

>> Okay. Yeah. One last question. Um, when

you're talking I'm at the very early

learning stage. So, um, when you're

talking about, um, the MCPS and bringing

all this information and I can hear

people in our company worrying about

having that private information uploaded

somewhere. Do you ever worry about that

or how can I respond to them?

>> Yeah, you can. I mean, you can imagine

running it. Uh, so you can you can run

this locally as well. Um, you can use

models. You know, some people are like,

"Oh, like can you trust a Chinese

model?" I'm Chinese, by the way, but

like DeepSeek, right? So Deepseek is is

a great model that you can use. You can

run it locally. Um, so a lot of these

things you can do locally without having

to worry about, you know, sharing your

information out there in public. Yeah.

All right, everyone. Thank you so much

for this.