Are You a Highly Sensitive Person? Discover Your Potential Now!

1.2 to 1.6 billion people could be highly sensitive. Being told you're too

highly sensitive. Being told you're too sensitive. What it feels like is shame.

sensitive. What it feels like is shame.

Like I am too emotionally reactive. I

don't know how to interact. Everything

seems like it's bothering me or it is bothering me. You may have difficulty in

bothering me. You may have difficulty in school. You may have difficulty in work

school. You may have difficulty in work situations that are too open-ended and don't have enough structure. Other

people seem to have social stamina that highly sensitive people cannot tolerate or match. Because it's so socially

or match. Because it's so socially unacceptable to be a highly sensitive person, you end up sort of adapting and it can kind of feel like you don't know who you are. Just don't feel hold it

inside. What if we frame being a highly

inside. What if we frame being a highly sensitive person as a person who's able to feel and then also communicate that to other people as a superpower? Some of

these characteristics of being a highly sensitive person really make people remarkable in many ways. What I would tell parents of kids who might be displaying some of these qualities is

that you are potentially raising an exceptionally emotionally attuned human being. a child who may be a gifted

being. a child who may be a gifted creator.

[Music] Hi, I'm Balik. I'm Jonathan Cohen. And

welcome to a special MBB Explores. My

The real question everyone wants to know is, do you cry easily? Yes. Do you get overwhelmed in crowds? Yes. Do you feel exhausted after hanging out with people too long? I I get exhausted after

too long? I I get exhausted after hanging out with myself for too long.

Why do you ask, Jonathan? Well, you

might be something called a highly sensitive person, an HSP. And it isn't rare or on the fringes. If you've heard

of this term before, you are not alone because one in five people is estimated to be highly sensitive. That is more than the number of people who are

left-handed. You're left-handed. I know

left-handed. You're left-handed. I know

I might be a highly sensitive person, too, but I I don't know if I am actually. Well, we're going to find out

actually. Well, we're going to find out today. We're going to be talking about

today. We're going to be talking about the diagnostic criteria for a highly sensitive person. We're going to talk

sensitive person. We're going to talk about the science behind highly sensitive people. And we're also going

sensitive people. And we're also going to be talking about what it's not.

meaning what are the things that you might be experiencing that can overlap with HSPs but are actually distinct syndromes, disorders or just traits.

Now, you may have heard this term or you may have heard other things like you're being told you're too sensitive. What

are some of the indicators that people might be possibly on the highly sensitive person spectrum, Jonathan?

even if they've never heard the term, although it is floating around social media these days. Uh someone might have told you you're too sensitive. Yes, you

feel different in group settings. For

example, you're feel isolated. Uh you

you don't know how to navigate really.

You can feel overwhelmed in crowds. You

can feel overwhelmed in busy places. For

example, I've tried to take you to Costco.

Have we actually ever gone to I don't think we've ever gone to Costco. It's on

my dream bucket list of things to do.

It's not happening. Okay. So, too

sensitive. Um you feel different or or wrong in group settings. What else? You

can feel burnt out in certain situations. Now, there I think there's a

situations. Now, there I think there's a difference between introversion, extroversion, and being highly sensitive. Although many people who are

sensitive. Although many people who are very introverted can also be highly sensitive. So if you for example go out

sensitive. So if you for example go out and feel totally drained afterwards. I

think it is especially in group scenarios especially when there's a lot of lights, music when when the world is around you is very busy. The other thing that people begin to experience is that

they suppress their own needs and that can also lead to burnout. It

can lead to anxiety. We know that when you start to disconnect from either physiological needs or emotional needs, it can create this underlying stress in

the person and that can lead uh on a long-term basis to burnout and it can also lead to needing to manage and fix other people to try and make yourself feel better. Okay. So, you've just sort

feel better. Okay. So, you've just sort of given us some broad strokes of the emotional consequences of possibly being a highly sensitive person. Let's talk a little bit about how many people this

affects. This actually is a shocker.

affects. This actually is a shocker.

Okay, my if you were to guess Well, you told me one in five people, so I'm already doing the math. Okay, do the math. That's about 20%. Okay, 1.2 to 1.6

math. That's about 20%. Okay, 1.2 to 1.6 billion people could be highly sensitive. 20% of the world is useless

sensitive. 20% of the world is useless is what all the people who are not sensitive are thinking. Well, that's

maybe a label and it could speak to the way in which people who don't experience this sensitivity can feel cuz like when I

want to take you to Costco and you don't want to go, I'm like, why won't she go to Costco? I'm going to explain it

to Costco? I'm going to explain it today. I'm going to explain today's

today. I'm going to explain today's episode is about why I don't want to go to Costco. So, we know that this is

to Costco. So, we know that this is something that affects potentially millions of people. We know that it's it's not rare. Like it's a thing that's out there. And we're going to be talking

out there. And we're going to be talking a little bit more about the specificity of these broad categories that that you just described. So being told you're too

just described. So being told you're too sensitive. What it feels like is shame.

sensitive. What it feels like is shame.

Like I am too emotionally reactive. I

don't know how to interact. Everything

seems like it's bothering me or it is bothering me. Feeling different in group

bothering me. Feeling different in group settings leads to isolation. can lead to what we call masking, right? Constantly

sort of like pretending you need to be somebody else. Also, there's that shame.

somebody else. Also, there's that shame.

Again, a lot of shame can be involved in this because there's a tremendous amount of awareness when you're a highly sensitive person about like things are operating that are different. Also, you

may have difficulty in school. You may

have difficulty in certain kinds of uh work situations that are too open-ended and don't have enough structure. in

terms of uh what you were describing about kind of not being able to keep up with other people, other people seem to have social stamina that highly sensitive people cannot tolerate or match. So, what that can learn to is

match. So, what that can learn to is again like that kind of like shame, feeling uh defective, thinking maybe that you're lazy because you don't want to go out or don't feel motivated to go

out. And in terms of suppressing needs,

out. And in terms of suppressing needs, you mentioned burnout. A lot of times what happens is because it's so socially unacceptable to be a highly sensitive person. You end up sort of adapting and

person. You end up sort of adapting and it can kind of feel like you don't know who you are. Like I'm constantly doing what they want or maybe there's something wrong with me that I don't want to do that. I'll do it anyway. And

that can lead to a lot of well my favorite word resentment. So these are some of the categories of what happens when you are a highly sensitive person or you may be a highly sensitive person and we're going to help you figure it

out. We actually have a quiz that we're

out. We actually have a quiz that we're going to be taking in this episode. I

cannot wait for the quiz. But what was shocking to me is it's equally distributed between men and women. Yes. And I think a lot more women

women. Yes. And I think a lot more women may identify it or seek that out or have the experience of being aware of feeling drained in those social circumstances.

Well, I think I mean we're to talk about it. Women tend to be more verbal. We we

it. Women tend to be more verbal. We we

do tend to be more emotional. like

emotions live a little closer to the surface for for women generally speaking than men or for people who fall on the feminine spectrum. I guess we should say

feminine spectrum. I guess we should say that as well because I think that's maybe more accurate. But yes, the distribution uh seems to be equal but it's going to look different kind of when we talk about ADHD it looks different in men and women. Uh when we

talk about neurode divergence also looks different. And if you were already like

different. And if you were already like that sounds like neurode divergence or that sounds like ADHD, you're not wrong.

And we're going to talk about those overlapping ven diagrams of all this stuff. So, let's get into some

stuff. So, let's get into some diagnostic kind of nomenclature. Two of

my favorite words, diagnostic nomenclature. And what I'm kind of most

nomenclature. And what I'm kind of most excited about for this episode is beginning to give us a language to understand that so many people are just

built in different ways. That isn't to say abnormal versus normal. I don't

really like that classification. But in

the US alone, it's estimated that 50 to 66 million people may identify with this. So if you are listening and you're

this. So if you are listening and you're like, not me, probably you.

We haven't even taken the quiz. If

you're listening and you're like, I think that's me, it might be you. And if

it's not you, likelihood is you know someone, someone is in your friend group or in your family group. 20% of people in theory. So you should kind of really

in theory. So you should kind of really understand what is happening here because it impacts so much of how we interact and socialize and how we feel about ourselves. All right, so let's

about ourselves. All right, so let's talk about what actually is a highly sensitive person. We've talked about

sensitive person. We've talked about some of the emotional categories that often get thrown around when we talk about it. This is a term that was coined

about it. This is a term that was coined uh in the mid '9s by Dr. Elaine Aaron.

She's a clinical psychologist and a researcher and she published a book called the highly sensitive person. She

was like it's 1996. We're not very creative about titles. This book is called The Highly Sensitive Person 1996.

Let's just be straightforward. Yeah, it

was a very straightforward title. It was

based on years um of empirical research and also personal experience that she had and fun game. What would we title it now? Be like coming into your Phoenix

now? Be like coming into your Phoenix rising. What you don't know and they

rising. What you don't know and they haven't told you about how emotions really work. Be like the real reason

really work. Be like the real reason you're burnt out and don't know it. You

were made this way to excel and be written into a Lady Gaga song. I will

say right before we get into the criteria, we're not teasing. Also, like

I mean that's what it would be called.

Now I I'm thinking how would this be marketed on be called Born This Way.

Born This Way. You just want it to be Lady Gaga. The reason why I was saying

Lady Gaga. The reason why I was saying this is, you know, we'll talk a little bit more about this after we do what you're about to do and after we do the quiz. I love some foreshadowing. I'm

quiz. I love some foreshadowing. I'm

gonna just plant the seed that highly sensitive people could be an evolutionary advantage. Knew you were

evolutionary advantage. Knew you were going to say that cuz you're a highly sensitive person and you have extra sensory abilities. That's the

sensory abilities. That's the foreshadowing we need. Let's get back to the criteria. So about 15 to 20% of the

the criteria. So about 15 to 20% of the population seems to have sensory processing sensitivity, SPS. And this is a clinical term and there's a ton of medical literature and we'll get into

some of that. Um, it is a genetically inherited temperamental style. Jonathan,

when you hear genetically inherited temperamental style, what what do you think? Uh, I think that you've gotten it

think? Uh, I think that you've gotten it from a parent that there is a biological genetic expression of this. And like I said, I think temperament, which I know

it is not what I'm about to say, sounds like you're all over the map. You can't

be pinned down and you're a problem. I'm

going to take us on a little bit of a a detour, but then I promise I'll come right back. Um, so temperaments there

right back. Um, so temperaments there there are four main temperaments. There

you you can look at them by color or by kind of by season. Um, there's blue, there's red, there's yellow, and there's

green. The the four main temperaments um

green. The the four main temperaments um are known as melancholic, caleric, sanguin, and flaggmatic. What is

flegmatic?

Fllegmatic is people who are Sounds like a little flatulence. Too many beans. So

flaggmatic is people who are reasonable, principled controlled persistent steadfast, and calm. Really the opposite of what it sounds like. Right. Exactly.

That's flegmatic. Uh melancholic is anxious worried unhappy suspicious serious, and thoughtful. Those two tend to be more quote unchangeable. And then

there's the the more changeable temperaments, the ones that are going to kind of come and go. Sanguin is playful, easygoing sociable carefree hopeful and contented. That's me. And caleric is

and contented. That's me. And caleric is egocentric exhibitionist impulsive histrionic, active, and excitable.

Right? So these are temperaments. So

what those are, there are genetic components to all of the ways that we are. And what Dr. Aaron was identifying

are. And what Dr. Aaron was identifying is that there seems to be a temperament a temperamental style that is is sensitive in specific ways to sensory

input. Now sensory input is a very broad

input. Now sensory input is a very broad term but what she said is that you see about 15 to 20% of the population with this kind of genetically inherited temperament. Okay, slow down a little

temperament. Okay, slow down a little bit because this is important and I'm trying to process. I think people are also, you know, following along.

Say that part again.

Dr. Aaron identified that approximately 15 to 20% of the population has a temperamental style that has sensitivity.

So like one thing for example could be I like I hate linen sheets.

They're too rough. But you're not an HSP because you don't like linen sheets. I

think we need to talk a little more about the diagnostic criteria. This is a great place for us to take a break and hear from our sponsors. When we come back, we're going to get into the nitty-gritty of the brain science behind

highly sensitive people.

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[Music] We process stimuli in all sorts of different ways, right? We process

through all the all of our senses and and sensitivity is is a very very necessary component of life. I once knew a pregnant woman

whose smell, sense of smell got so heightened. Yes. That she like couldn't

heightened. Yes. That she like couldn't be around people.

She everyone smelled too much. Well, so

let's talk about evolutionarily why we are sensitive and why pregnant women in particular are sensitive. So what

happens during pregnancy? You're growing

a human inside of you and you have need all the smells around you to identify danger. You know what? you're being kind

danger. You know what? you're being kind of saucy, but what you're witnessing when a woman has an acute sense of smell, it doesn't happen for all women, but it it is one of the features of

pregnancy. What you're talking about is

pregnancy. What you're talking about is there are times in life as an organism when it is increasingly important for

you to understand information coming at you so that you can know if you should avoid it or embrace it. So, a pregnant woman is actually you know, operating in

a world of like computers and ice cream and cars and linen sheets, but her evolutionary system is designed to keep

that thing alive. So, the increased sensitivity increases the probability that she will avoid noxious, toxic

odors refrigerators people taking off their shoes, right?

But I think it's important you know this kind of sensitivity and this sort of processing has been documented in over 100 species. So it is evolutionarily

100 species. So it is evolutionarily advantageous for us to have an elaborate system of processing sensory stimuli and in certain environments let's talk about

pregnancy the the environment of pregnancy for us to upgrade the sensitivity so that we are you know placing ourselves in an advantageous

position. So what is it about roughly

position. So what is it about roughly 20% of the population that seems to be living in a suspended state of sensitivity? No, they're not all

sensitivity? No, they're not all pregnant, especially the men, but we are going to talk a little bit about some of these factors. The trait is considered

these factors. The trait is considered innate, meaning this is not a disorder.

Okay. Yeah. So this is where we're going to distinguish it from things like ADHD or when we talk about neurode divergence. There's overlap, but

neurode divergence. There's overlap, but this trait of of sensory processing sensitivity is considered an innate trait that is heritable. We have some really interesting twin studies because

how do you want to know if something's heritable? Find someone with exactly the

heritable? Find someone with exactly the same DNA. And um and in addition, so

same DNA. And um and in addition, so this is its own its own thing, but it can coexist

with things like introversion, neurode divergence, anxiety, or even a trauma response. So you're going to see all

response. So you're going to see all this overlap. It can be hard, but it is

this overlap. It can be hard, but it is distinct. So we're trying to to

distinct. So we're trying to to understand sensory processing disorder, which is what people with, you know, uh the diagnosis or the the the nomenclature of HSP have. It is distinct

from all these other traits. It's its

own beast. It's its own beast, but there are overlap in terms of the expression of the experience. A lot of times when we do these episodes, I just feel like

an because yes, there can be there can be different expressions, but I think what's important for us to stay on is that this is its own set of

diagnostic criteria. 100% the diagnostic

diagnostic criteria. 100% the diagnostic criteria. We let's focus on that first

criteria. We let's focus on that first and then we'll focus on the lived experience and then I will talk about the lived experience which has overlap.

There we go. Everyone is happy. There's

no right or wrong. Everything has

overlap. Everything has overlap. So it

is hard to use the way we talk about highly sensitive people without being like oh and also this. But let's just try and stick to diagnostic criteria.

I'm going to give everyone an acronym.

We love an acronym. Here we go. The

acronym is d o e s or doze if you want to go the bambi route. D O E S like do a deer. D stands for depth of processing.

deer. D stands for depth of processing.

O stands for over stimulation. E stands

for emotional responsiveness and empathy and S stands for sensory sensitivity. So

when we are talking about the core characteristics of highly sensitive people and of this sensory processing disorder, there's four things we look for. If you only have one of them,

for. If you only have one of them, Jonathan, do you get to Probably not.

What if you have two? I I don't know.

Probably not either. We're looking for at least three, if not four of these things in order for us to be for a bingo card, you need all four. You want a bingo card, all four depth of

processing. So, um, highly sensitive

processing. So, um, highly sensitive people often need a lot of time to reflect on things before acting. they

they they process more thoroughly, which can mean it looks like they're not focused, but actually the computer is operating. The computer is operating.

operating. The computer is operating.

That's right. And a lot of this processing may happen unconsciously, and there's ways that we can um measure that, and we're going to talk about that. Um but this greater depth of

that. Um but this greater depth of processing often comes because of the sensitivity at which information is coming in. So, it's a depth of

coming in. So, it's a depth of processing because of, you know, what many of us would just call like over stimulation, right? Um, but it looks

stimulation, right? Um, but it looks like a depth of processing. What about

the O? O is over stimulation. So, this

is kind of the one that a lot of us know about. The nervous system can be easily

about. The nervous system can be easily overwhelmed. Lights. Hate noises. Don't

overwhelmed. Lights. Hate noises. Don't

like noises. Crowds. Don't like crowds.

Deadlines. It's an emotional overstimulation. It's basically

overstimulation. It's basically describing Costco right there. Deadline.

We got to get out of the store. But

yeah, it feels like over stimulation. It

can feel like what we call flooding.

Everything's too much and you stop taking in more information or you start having an emotional reaction when other information is coming at you. Um, I

recently saw the movie Sinners and I was very overstimulated. It was a lot of

very overstimulated. It was a lot of visual information, a lot of emotional information, and a lot of auditory information. I can't do things like

information. I can't do things like IMAX. Uh, I once did one of those like

IMAX. Uh, I once did one of those like uh movie theaters where the picture was on the sidewalls too, which is like it's enough in front of me with earplugs in.

I don't want it on the walls. Anyway,

over stimulation. That's what it feels like. And some people will um have a

like. And some people will um have a stomach ache because of that or get a migraine or feel like crying and you don't know why. There's special HSP theaters where they only play black and

white movies from the 20s. You're

joking. But when when my kids were little, there were movie theaters that would have mom screenings where they would leave the lights up so kids wouldn't get scared and the volume would be down so that parents could see not a

sexy or interesting movie, but you know, a movie that you could in theory bring your kids to, but where Okay, let's talk about e emotional responsiveness and empathy. So some of this overlaps with

empathy. So some of this overlaps with the reaction to over stimulation um but higher emotional reactivity and stronger

emotional reactions both to positive and negative stimuli. So this is something

negative stimuli. So this is something that's interesting very easy to imagine like oh when something when someone's sad when someone's uh experiencing something tragic I'm feeling it or I'm

feeling that empathy um or I'm emotionally responsive when things are intense or when something scary happens.

This can also happen from positive stimuli. It can be it can be complicated

stimuli. It can be it can be complicated even when someone is super excited and happy. It's not that you're not um

happy. It's not that you're not um allowing them to be happy, but for people who are empathic, that can that can be a a case for emotional uh reactivity that can sometimes feel out

of control.

Not that long ago, we actually had a fascinating conversation on our Substack with Dan Harris and we were talking about your emotional register that you

feel things really intensely on both ends and actually that's what makes you a great actor that what makes you a creative person and really unique. So

some of these characteristics of being a highly sensitive person, you know, really make people remarkable in many ways. Yeah. And we're actually going to

ways. Yeah. And we're actually going to talk in a little bit um about some of that specificity. Yeah, we're not here

that specificity. Yeah, we're not here to shame people about falling into any of these categories. And in some cases, these are superpowers as Jonathan indicated. Yeah, I think it's important

indicated. Yeah, I think it's important to reiterate that because at the beginning it was like, do you feel burnt out? Do you feel overwhelmed? And people

out? Do you feel overwhelmed? And people

can feel like that. New intro. Do you

feel like you might be the next evolution of human that can tap into things that other people can't and process things in a way that other people can't? And do you feel like

people can't? And do you feel like you're getting a lot of information and wondering what's up with everyone else around you that seems to be oblivious to what you notice? Let's talk about the S

of our doze or does S is sensory sensitivity and this one is kind of the one that that gets tucked into sensory processing sensitivity disorder the

most. Um so this is environmental and

most. Um so this is environmental and social stimuli can be overwhelming. also

being more sensitive, like the pregnant ladies, to smells, more sensitive than other people, to lights, textures, even background noise that others ignore. I

can hear a clock ticking from clear across a room that some people are like, "I didn't even know that clock ticks."

So, there's a uh family joke amongst the Cohens um that every time we would walk into a restaurant, we would all be sort of in knots about what my dad was about

to do. And nine times out of 10, he

to do. And nine times out of 10, he would walk up to the manager and be like, "Can you please turn down the music? It's blaring. It's blasting in my

music? It's blaring. It's blasting in my head right now." And my sister would ask the lights to be turned down. It was

never fun going out with us. the notion

that things that other people don't pick up on but that you might can feel kind of isolating and you know for much of my life I never thought to say anything but

now it's much more acceptable. Um I

don't ask necessarily for like music to be turned on lights but I'm very aware of them and I I can be activated by them but background noise is something that if anyone's out there on the spectrum you might notice this as well. you may

also be a highly sensitive person, but this is something that we also do see um with certain parts of the autism spectrum um of being able to pick up on a refrigerator hum uh or you know a a a

truck in the distance that has a motor running, you know, things like that. Um

in addition for sensory sensitivity, there's a really sweet and and fascinating um observation which also has been um you know actually studied by researchers. more sensitivity to beauty

researchers. more sensitivity to beauty and to art, meaning literally your ability to take in that sensory information is processed in such a way

that your sensitivity carries with it a depth. Um, music is an example. People who uh often cry from

example. People who uh often cry from certain musical progressions. I'm one of these people. My younger son is one of

these people. My younger son is one of these people. That's a sensory

these people. That's a sensory sensitivity that we kind of maybe didn't think of. Um, but yeah, more sensitivity

think of. Um, but yeah, more sensitivity to beauty and art. I mean, how many artists or art lovers or art critics or art historians have an extra sensitivity that actually makes them more tuned into

certain aspects of art? So, that's the acronym DOS depth of processing, over stimulation, emotional responsiveness and empathy, and sensory sensitivity. It's visual and

it's auditory and it's tactile. And um

we we'll get into some of the science of that in a little bit. W although most people at home have already guessed that you're a highly sensitive person and you don't need the quiz.

Let's do the quiz and you are going to give us your score. People at home or are listening, if you're driving, please have someone else do your score for you.

We're going to see. And everyone in the comments of this episode, please let us know what you scored because we are fascinated to find out how many of our listeners are highly sensitive people.

And the original um quiz, which is more of a diagnostic tool, is a 27point quiz.

We're not going to do the full quiz.

We're going to do an abbreviated one built on the 27 points um where we've pulled out sort of the the 10 most prominent. And I believe this is a yes

prominent. And I believe this is a yes or no. I'm easily overwhelmed by strong

or no. I'm easily overwhelmed by strong sensory inputs, bright lights, loud noises. Okay. Yes, that's a yes for

noises. Okay. Yes, that's a yes for mime. Number two, I notice subtle

mime. Number two, I notice subtle details that others miss. Yep. Yeah.

What What kind of details do you notice?

Everything. I can tell if someone's had a haircut. Like I can tell if someone

a haircut. Like I can tell if someone who always has short hair has a haircut.

Like I can tell if a man who always keeps his hair like within an eighth of an inch. Like I can tell I just can tell

an inch. Like I can tell I just can tell everything. Some of it is also on the

everything. Some of it is also on the codependent spectrum. There's a

codependent spectrum. There's a tremendous amount of peopleleasing that I'm just inherently like I mean we're not talking about overlaps because this is our diagnostic criteria. I don't I'm just saying I don't know if it's because

I'm highly sensitive or because of wanting to sort of like tune in and lock into things, but I notice I mean it's hard for me not to notice a ridiculous level of detail about people, places,

things. Like I can tell if your eyeliner

things. Like I can tell if your eyeliner is a little bit too thick on one eye and it's very hard for me not to tell you that. Yeah, I'm just very very dialed

that. Yeah, I'm just very very dialed in. Go ahead. New segment. Listeners

in. Go ahead. New segment. Listeners

send in pictures to us. M gives her analysis of it. No hold bars. No, it's

like in the in the remember can you spot the difference? Like those things in the

the difference? Like those things in the back of magazines when you were a kid. I

was like yes I can. Number three. I am

deeply moved by music, art, and nature.

I mean if there was a scale that's like all the way to get two points for that one. You should get two points. So far

one. You should get two points. So far

you're three for three. Number four. I

need alone time to decompress after socializing. So, this is a a great one

socializing. So, this is a a great one because I I didn't know that was a thing, but apparent I I mean I need I need alone time during during social time. During social time, you go into

time. During social time, you go into the corner say I need a little alone time before you go back. Yeah. I don't

thrive in those environments. But yeah,

it my nervous system needs to calm down.

That's You did a hilarious Tik Tok.

Remember the the one What was the It was It was what introverts look like. Yeah.

After socializing, you get in your car, you're like, "Yeah, let's do it again.

Let's see each other every day. Let's

see each other three times a day. Then

you look like Exactly. Okay. Go ahead.

All right. Four for four. Number five. I

get rattled when I have a lot to do in a short amount of time. I mean I Yes.

Okay. Uh although you are quite good under a deadline, but it doesn't mean I'm not rattled. There's there's smoke coming off of us highly sensitive people are also high functioning highly sensitive people. This is not a

sensitive people. This is not a detriment all the time. Uh number six. I

avoid violent media because I it feels too intense. I really like a crime

too intense. I really like a crime documentary. I don't like it to be

documentary. I don't like it to be violent or gory, but because I like the story sometimes it is. And I think it's just like I just sort of do. But when I saw Sinners like that something it's too

it's too much for my I will say that there was a detox period for anyone who's new to the show where m stopped watching crime documentaries and it made

a very positive impact. So number seven, I often absorb other people's emotions as my own. Yes, the the veil is very thin between me and other people's emotions. Seven for seven. You're doing

emotions. Seven for seven. You're doing

great. Thanks. Number eight. I feel

uncomfortable in chaotic or cluttered environments. I I I can function very

environments. I I I can function very well, but um what would be described as chaotic though? Well, so in other

chaotic though? Well, so in other people's chaotic environments, very hard for me. Like when I know the chaos and

for me. Like when I know the chaos and it's mine, that's fine. But like you can tolerate for example like things out like sometimes when I go into other

people's kitchens who don't choose to put things away it's but you know again this is the overlap with like I'm also just like snikity and what we used to call just like anal retentive but it's

interesting because I'm wondering if there is a disregulation you know that I didn't understand is actually happening.

Keep going. dysregulation, eight for eight. But just to throw in a little

eight. But just to throw in a little story and increase the suspense as we get to our last two, uh we did a rapid fire with Jonathan a long time ago that we never used. Are you talking about yourself in the third? I am. I'm talking

about myself in the third person. And uh

one of the things the questions that we ask on these rapid fires, which we're releasing on Substack a lot, so if you haven't seen Substack, check it out, is what does your mother write about? And I

don't remember what I answered, but like it's very hard to narrow it down to one thing. What my mother was right about

thing. What my mother was right about was always clean the kitchen before you go to bed.

And always clean the kitchen before you leave for a vacation cuz you never want to come back to a dirty kitchen. Number

nine. I feel like this is almost unfair.

I startle easily. Oh yeah. Nine for

nine. Last one. Number 10. I was often told I was too sensitive as a child. Oh

yeah. I mean as an adult as well, but especially as a child. All right. So,

I'm 10 for 10. Would I know that people are like, "What are the other 17? Maybe

she only is 10 out of 27 and then I don't get the diagnosis." You know what?

Because we're having so much fun, I will rifle through quickly some of the other ones. One to four, you are mildly

ones. One to four, you are mildly sensitive. If you answer yes, if you

sensitive. If you answer yes, if you have four points in this game, one to four points, you are mildly sensitive.

I'm mildly sensitive. Uh if you have you are mildly sensitive because you have one to four but if you keep going five to seven you are highly sensitive.

I'm highly sensitive. And 8 to 10 if you get the full bingo card you are a strong HSB. I am a strong highly

strong HSB. I am a strong highly sensitive person. Um let's just go

sensitive person. Um let's just go through very briefly in case people are wondering other things that are on the full scale. uh very very sensitive to

full scale. uh very very sensitive to pain, needing to withdraw during busy days into bed or a darkened room to have relief from stimulation. Uh particularly

sensitive to the effects of caffeine.

It's very interesting. Um

I have a rich complex inner life. That's

one of the statements. Do you have a rich complex inner life? Uncomfortable

from loud noises. Uh nervous system gets so frazzled I have to go off by myself.

I'm conscientious.

Yes. Um, being very hungry creates a strong reaction in me, disturbing my concentration or mood. When people are uncomfortable in a physical environment,

I tend to know what needs to be done to make it more comfortable. That's very

interesting. I am annoyed when people try to get me to do too many things at once. I actually thrive under lots of

once. I actually thrive under lots of different uh multitasking, but I I get that. But look, that might be a no.

that. But look, that might be a no.

think we found I try hard to avoid making mistakes or forgetting things.

This is some of that conscientiousness that comes up. I just like the wording of this. I become unpleasantly aroused

of this. I become unpleasantly aroused when a lot is going on around me. That's

like the name of my memoir. Unpleasantly

aroused. Being hungry creates a strong reaction in me disrupting concentration or mood. When I must compete or be

or mood. When I must compete or be observed while performing a task, I become so nervous or shaky that I do much worse than I otherwise would have.

But that's not for you. I've got a couple experiences in my life that we will save for another time. Uh I sense other people's feelings without them saying a word. This is like the bane of

my existence. That was the quiz. That

my existence. That was the quiz. That

was the quiz. We are very curious to hear what your scores are. Do share it.

I think there's going to be some very interesting patterns emerging about the people who listen to this podcast and who also identify or are in partnership or in a family close family relationship

with a highly sensitive person. I think

depending on how many responses we get, we could run a little statistics. I

could do a little bit of statistics here because we know how many people listen to the show. Well, we're gonna Yeah. But

we don't know how many people will respond. Exactly. So, the statistics

respond. Exactly. So, the statistics would more be about of the people who respond. Are we only getting people who

respond. Are we only getting people who are sensitive responding, which is not actually a full um you know, a full appropriate assessment. But what would

appropriate assessment. But what would be interesting is just to be able to say for this episode 87% of the people who seem to want to comment on it were

highly sensitive people. Comment on the YouTube channel would be best. Let's

talk a little bit about the science. So

we talked about it being genetic that this is a a temperamental trait which at least in the original um criteria uh was designated as genetic and twin studies

do suggest a strong genetic basis. Um

however, however, what's different about twins? They have different experiences.

twins? They have different experiences.

They have different things, places they go and um so sensitivity can be different among twins based on other experiences. And sensitivity in general,

experiences. And sensitivity in general, you know, can be amplified or shifted uh because of trauma, because of any number of things. In one study, they found

of things. In one study, they found roughly 70% of HSPs had what we would call typical childhoods. And I'm like, what's a typical childhood? 30% of the

people in this study um may develop anxious tendencies due to environmental stressors. So certain stressors, this is

stressors. So certain stressors, this is not changing the heritability of it, it's changing the presentation of it um and and the way that we can um sort of identify it. And if we talk about the

identify it. And if we talk about the overlapping experience of the expression, that is where we get some of the similarities between traumatic

response and the adaptation that happens after a traumatic response or um developmental stressors, things like that where people become hypervigilant

and sort of may have a higher startle reflex, maybe they they may be oversensitive to different stimulation.

Mhm. There's been some really interesting imaging studies which lets us know where activation is in in in the actual brain. You know, the region that

actual brain. You know, the region that I automatically and sort of first think of is the phalamus. When we talk about the phalamus, which is um kind of like a

this sized on either side of your brain, the phalamus is kind of like a a processing center. It's like everything

processing center. It's like everything has to go through it. Everything you see here, you know, all these sensory systems are processed through the

phalamus. It's incredibly important. And

phalamus. It's incredibly important. And

you know, unfortunately, we know a lot about these structures from animal studies. And I won't go into those

studies. And I won't go into those details, but but besides the phalamus, which for me was just sort of like this sounds like a theamic processing, you know, uh, disorder or dysfunction,

there's a lot of attention paid to the insula and the insular cortex. So that's

I ns u l a r and the insular cortex. I'm

gonna throw a picture to Jonathan. It

looks like this. So if you peel back the cerebral cortex. So you have these two

cerebral cortex. So you have these two halves of the brain obviously. And what

most people think of when they think of the brain, it's usually like pink in your mind. It's actually gray, but it's

your mind. It's actually gray, but it's pink if we, you know, like try and dress it up a little bit. And it's like the part on the outside that looks kind of like worms, right? All connected

together. That's the cerebral cortex.

It's like the outside. It's the it's a separate distinct structure and then inside there's all these little structures when you hear about things like the hypothalamus and the globus paladus and

like the the phalamus and the hippocampus and all these different regions those are like deep inside and that's also where a lot of like emotional processing happens. That's the

lyic system. But the insular cortex is this this part of the again more of the outside regions of the brain. And what

it is is it's it's a place that integrates sensory information and emotion and also can regulate certain

aspects of taste and what things kind of feel like if that makes sense. So what we have is this region that seems to light up in in

these studies of highly sensitive people and indeed it's a region of the brain that we know is involved with kind of elaborate sensory and emotional processing. So makes sense. So a lot of

processing. So makes sense. So a lot of attention paid um to the insula or the insular cortex. Also, all the things

insular cortex. Also, all the things that you would expect based on descriptions of highly sensitive people shows up in studies that are published in all of the major, you know, peer-reviewed journals that you would

expect, uh, with all of the correct double blind, all these things. you

know, the regions of the brain associated with empathy, with, you know, deeper emotional processing, those all quote light up in a significantly in a

statistically significant way for people who are highly sensitive people and have the sensory processing uh sensitivity. I

mean, it's fascinating to see the physiological difference or to understand that their brains are really acting differently. Yeah. Yeah. And

acting differently. Yeah. Yeah. And

there was uh one study that was published in Nature that also looked to correlate uh highly sensitive people and people with sensory processing sensitivity with other aspects of personality. And what it correlated

personality. And what it correlated with, they would give them basically these kind of like the big five personality um you know questionnaires.

And um sensory processing sensitivity is closely linked to neuroticism and also openness which is kind of interesting. meaning taking in a lot of

interesting. meaning taking in a lot of information, being in theory open um but also neuroticism which is kind of more of a tendency to to fixate to focus um

and you know can be kind of pathized but uh those seem to be connected as well.

There's something very interesting about the idea of openness and we're going to talk about some of the coping strategies, management strategies

because as we said it can definitely have advantageous qualities in your life. You can use it to get ahead and to

life. You can use it to get ahead and to connect with people and to notice things. Um, based on your explanation of

things. Um, based on your explanation of how much you notice things, you could be a fantastic FBI agent if this uh podcasting thing gets boring for you.

Sometimes people can be overwhelmed by this and you may want to go to Costco.

You may want to go to a concert or feel like you can go to the social situations. Okay, so we've identified

situations. Okay, so we've identified what a highly sensitive person looks like. We've talked about sensory

like. We've talked about sensory processing sensitivity, which is the trait that was identified as prominent in people who are highly sensitive.

We've also talked about the science.

We've done a quiz to confirm that apparently I'm strongly possibly a highly sensitive person. Let's now move

into how you can either understand this for yourself or for someone you're living with or relating with or for someone you're living or relating with and if you are a

highly sensitive person how you can frame that so it feels a bit more like a superpower and less like a detriment. So

in childhood, people who are highly sensitive can often be labeled as like shy, dramatic,

difficult or interesting, old souls, mature for their age, precocious, right?

Because a lot of these features that can kind of be how it presents. Also, kids

who cry often, who are very, very worried or interested in animals, overwhelmed at birthday parties, that's a warning sign, right? Uh many of these

kids are misdiagnosed as anxious or oppositional and these days many of these kinds of kids are likely screened for neurode divergence which

they may also be um or they may be labeled ADHD if it looks like they kind of can't control themselves right in certain situations. What if you have a

certain situations. What if you have a child like this and you're a parent and you're like I notice that my child is withdrawing. I want them to I I have to

withdrawing. I want them to I I have to push them to have resilience. What do

you think the best strategy is to, you know, to address that to both honor where your kid is at, but you know, like how do you combat like I personally don't think you should be pushing them

and with the understanding or with the idea that you're like, "Oh, I want them to build resilience, so I'm going to not let them isolate because then they're not going to want to socialize." Like,

how would you approach it? I'm I'm gonna answer that by describing what this looks like in adulthood so that people can possibly understand what is this personality that your child may be

presenting with and what does it look like when allowed to thrive as it is. So

people who are highly sensitive often have jobs in healing spaces um caregiving helping professions we call it and many times they're are creatives

and yeah many of them may struggle with over stimulation or a different kind of you know stimulation in in the workplace um and social expectations. They may,

you know, be people who need to have different kinds of emotional boundaries and they can also be researchers or people who are just focused on less busy chaotic environments. And while these

chaotic environments. And while these people may be at higher risk for things like burnout or or overwhelm, right?

What I would tell parents of kids who might be displaying some of these qualities is that you are potentially raising an

exceptionally emotionally attuned human being. You are dealing with a child who

being. You are dealing with a child who may be genetically temperamentally predisposed to being a gifted creator or

an innovator, right? Or a healer. So,

with that in mind, what we don't want to do with these kinds of kids is say, "You're wrong. You're bad. There's

"You're wrong. You're bad. There's

something wrong with you that we need to fix." And I know a lot of people are

fix." And I know a lot of people are like, "Oh, but sometimes kids need medication for AD." I'm not going there.

I'm going to stick with this kind of like highly sensitive person categorization that we're talking about.

that child is likely experiencing things on a level that parents in previous generations were told to dismiss, right?

Kids were told there's something hold them in the deep end, get them into school, make sure they play sports, let him cry it out, he'll figure it out, right? Or like he's going to go to that

right? Or like he's going to go to that party and have a good time. The other

side of this is that a lot of the permissive parenting movement also has made room for in many cases an accommodation that many accuse parents of not being able to kind of build

resilience. So as a parent like that's

resilience. So as a parent like that's the challenge honestly as a friend, as a partner, that's the challenge. What's

the balance? And if you're that person, it's also that's what it looks like in adulthood too. Like what is that

adulthood too. Like what is that balance? Which I'm going to talk about

balance? Which I'm going to talk about next. You know what I hear? What? Got to

next. You know what I hear? What? Got to

drag you to Costco. It's for your own good that you overcome this fear. Let's

talk about some some practical tools, right? Like practically speaking, if

right? Like practically speaking, if you're experiencing this and you are new to understanding this kind of like diagnosis or this diagnostic

nomenclature, um what do you do? So,

we're going to talk about a few categories. uh nervous system

categories. uh nervous system regulation, emotional boundaries, um sensory awareness, and reframing sensitivity as a strength. So, let's

start with nervous system regulation. We

love nervous system regulation. So, if

you are a highly sensitive person, you're always going to be a highly sensitive person. That's the other thing

sensitive person. That's the other thing about heritable traits. They don't

change depending on if you had a bad day. They can shift in intensity, but

day. They can shift in intensity, but this isn't like something that you're going to make go away. You are a highly sensitive person, but there are things that you can do to feel more in control

of the things about you and perhaps not have it be as disruptive to your life.

But a lot of that, I think, is about expectations. So, for nervous system

expectations. So, for nervous system regulation, uh, guess what? You are a person who's going to benefit from things like breath work, learning about breath, learning about the physiological

ways to activate your sympathetic nervous system. Jonathan's taking a deep

nervous system. Jonathan's taking a deep breath right now. Right now, um, guess what? Baths, sitting in a warm bath can

what? Baths, sitting in a warm bath can be very calming and regulating. Um,

downtime, like structuring in unstructured time in your day. Um, in

addition, your nervous system is going to be really, really sensitive to uh things in the environment. I just wear

earplugs anytime I have to go on an airplane. I wear them the whole time.

airplane. I wear them the whole time.

Everything feels like too much sound.

Whether it's the clicking of the, you know, keys on the of the person next to me, uh, to the actual sound of the plane, like the ambient sound, it's too much. the person coming over the

much. the person coming over the loudspeaker. It's all so I just wear

loudspeaker. It's all so I just wear earplugs all the time. I can still hear, but it just kind of dampens it. Some

people wear noise cancelling headphones, but things like dim lighting. I was

going to say if you're at home, changing your lighting, changing your light bulbs to a soft orange light at night will change your life. It and these are things that are unconsciously being

processed by your nervous system. And if

you are an HSP, you may not even realize that's part of what's going on. So why

not stack the chips in your favor to have less dysregulation of your nervous system. Also, something that may not be

system. Also, something that may not be obvious, decluttering your space can have a huge impact. The other thing about nervous system regulation, you're not going to like this one. You you

cannot watch violent or emotionally disturbing content if you're a person who is very sensitive. media diet is the new diet there.

This guy, there may be times in your life like I've I will watch things if I want to watch like a crime documentary that I know is not bloody, I have to watch it in the day. I was going to say watch it early in the day, have some

decompression time because my my body will literally get kind of overstimulated. So that's nervous system

overstimulated. So that's nervous system regulation. Those are just the basic

regulation. Those are just the basic things that you can kind of do to start learning better how to kind of calm your body down.

Emotional boundaries is a huge one and a really hard one. Maybe like I don't know if it's the biggest. It's hard to have favorites here, but I mean it's hard because for people who are highly sensitive, you just want to fit in. You

just don't want to be different. And so

setting boundaries seems like oh my gosh, it's another thing and I want to be weird. Guess what? These are the

be weird. Guess what? These are the things that you can do to change the way you function as a highly sensitive person. Practice saying no. No. And no

person. Practice saying no. No. And no

is a complete sentence. It doesn't have to be like no, but this is why. The

acronym I've been taught, you don't have to justify, argue, defend, or explain anything. You can just say no. That Oh,

anything. You can just say no. That Oh,

sorry. The acronym is jade. You don't

have to jade it. You don't have to justify, argue, defend, explain. Just

say no. Would you like to do this? No,

thank you. You can say no thank you.

That's also nice. But saying no without feeling the need to get your nervous system revved up to explain your no.

Just no thank you. It's a full statement. When you learn to say no as a

statement. When you learn to say no as a full sentence, as a full statement, the amount of space, mental and emotional

space that you get is unbelievable. Yes.

So much of my life was spent well, it's no, but I have to think about how to make this understandable and and well, if I say it like this and if I angle it like that, they won't be upset. It's

exhausting. It is exhausting and people who are people pleasers um know this very well. But it's super important for

very well. But it's super important for highly sensitive people to learn the no.

Also, have you ever been with someone and after you spend time with them, you feel exceptionally rung out and your mind is racing about all the things they said and did and the things that they're planning and the things that they need

and what if they did this. If you find yourself unable to separate from sometimes those people are called energy vampires. Sometimes it's just an

vampires. Sometimes it's just an overstimulating person or even an overstimulating environment. Some I'm

overstimulating environment. Some I'm going to be honest, some contemporary museum exhibits can be really overstimulating because like a lot of like let's put you in a room with a ton of lights and static and see if you like

it and if you feel it's artistic, I don't know because I'm so overstimulated. You have to limit that

overstimulated. You have to limit that time in those kinds of spaces and with those kind of people. You just do. There

will be people in your life that are seemingly well we get along and but you feel badly afterwards or just over stimulating. Pay attention. Pay

stimulating. Pay attention. Pay

attention. Is your system revving? Is

someone calming or exciting to your system? Now, exciting is not necessarily

system? Now, exciting is not necessarily good. Um, one more thing from emotional

good. Um, one more thing from emotional boundaries. If you are a person who

boundaries. If you are a person who leans towards uh understanding energy or kind of into metaphysical conversations around these things, um, this would be a time to think about visualizing a

protective I love this a protective bubble around yourself. It's a

conceptual It's a conceptual bubble, but it can help create a sort of resonance in you that feels like you're giving yourself some resilience and some uh

protection. I'm going to spend time with

protection. I'm going to spend time with someone that I find very taxing. What

What What would you instruct me to do?

The first thing I would instruct you to do is have little mini check-ins during your time with them. When you before you are in close proximity, when you're just starting to be like, let's say you're

driving up and you're meeting at a coffee shop, okay, before you get out of your car, notice yourself, what it feels like in your body. How do your solar plexes feel? How does your heart feel?

plexes feel? How does your heart feel?

How does your throat feel? How does your sort of belly feel? Then when you get there, maybe there's a little nerves.

You're not sure how the conversation is going to go. That's totally normal. But

then sort of as you settle in, how do you feel? Do you feel like you're being

you feel? Do you feel like you're being pulled? Do you feel pushed? Do you feel

pulled? Do you feel pushed? Do you feel centered in yourself? Do you feel like your solar plexes are kind of like starting to fold in on themselves? Or do

you feel like you've you're expansive?

If you start to feel like you're being drained, and that can for me can feel like literally my solar plexus are kind of folding in or I get this feeling that I'm like, I'm not really hungry, but I feel it right now.

Well, take a breath and pull your energy into yourself. But but then Okay, keep

into yourself. But but then Okay, keep going because but this is the work is to either if you feel like that and you're being pulled like that, you you may be giving your energy away or it may be

pulled from you. So you have to either cut a cord, you have to set a visualization to reenter your own energy. And if that could mean taking a

energy. And if that could mean taking a deep breath, focus on your feet, pull energy up from the ground up through your entire body. Imagine it going up over your head, cascading down around

you, creating that little bubble. That

little bubble is your energetic body, and you want to feel protected, safe, secure in that little bubble. You can

also do that before you go see this person. Has to be something you do.

person. Has to be something you do.

Well, that's why I'm saying you should do it before, you should do it during, and definitely after. Tell yourself

you're saved. Ask yourself to be shown if there's anything that you need to be aware of. I had a a spiritual teacher

aware of. I had a a spiritual teacher who said especially when he would travel, he would go through the airport imagining himself floating in this little bubble protecting his energetic

space. That's very helpful. Thank you.

space. That's very helpful. Thank you.

Let's talk about sensory awareness practices. Um, so

we've talked about nervous system regulation, we've talked about emotional boundaries. What are some of the things

boundaries. What are some of the things we can do to kind of help us understand better the the sensory awareness that we have? Um, some people find writing about

have? Um, some people find writing about this helpful, meaning getting it out of your head, out of your body, and onto paper. Uh, what situations do you

paper. Uh, what situations do you identify and write about them? Write

about what it feels like, what you think about it. Writing can be a very good way

about it. Writing can be a very good way to, like I said, get it out of your head and out of your body. Um, Jonathan,

grounding techniques are really important for regulating um, sensory awareness, sensitivity. Um, some

awareness, sensitivity. Um, some grounding practices. Well, I love a

grounding practices. Well, I love a weighted blanket. Um, I even have a

weighted blanket. Um, I even have a small weighted blanket so it can travel with me. I have a weighted pillow. Uh,

with me. I have a weighted pillow. Uh,

walking barefoot, this is like a thing.

Putting your feet in the dirt like it's actually a thing and there's a really interesting science behind it which we don't have the ability to get into. Some

people do tapping. Um, which is I think what's it called? The emotional freedom technique where you tap different regions. What's another grounding

regions. What's another grounding activity? Lie on the ground anywhere. It

activity? Lie on the ground anywhere. It

doesn't have to be outside even.

Surrender to gravity. Go in your living room. Go, if you're in your bedroom, lay

room. Go, if you're in your bedroom, lay flat on a hard surface and if you want to get wild, put your feet up so that you're getting blood flow down. You mean

like straight up in the air? Could be

straight up, could be like on a chair, anything. So all of a sudden, you're

anything. So all of a sudden, you're just like, it is an unbelievable sensation how quickly we go from moving around, like as soon as we get that

level of stillness, things just slow down. Amazing. Another sensory awareness

down. Amazing. Another sensory awareness practice is uh before you get out of bed in the morning, before you pick up your phone, take two minutes, track your whole body. Start at the top of your

whole body. Start at the top of your head. Do you feel any sensation? It

head. Do you feel any sensation? It

could be tingling. It could be fullness.

Uh a lot of times I wake up with allergies and I'm like, I can't breathe through one nostril. Do a full scan.

Start at the top of your head. Go down.

What do you feel in your shoulders? Just

anything. Doesn't have to be negative.

Doesn't have to be positive. Could just

be neutral. What are you feeling in your chest, your belly? anything interesting

happening in your pelvis, your legs, your feet, any sensations. It literally

kind of primes your brain and you really can be doing this throughout the day.

Um, so those are some things for for sensory awareness. And finally, and kind

sensory awareness. And finally, and kind of to close out this episode, let's talk about the reframing sensitivity as a strength. Jonathan mentioned at the

strength. Jonathan mentioned at the start of this episode, what if people who are highly sensitive people are here to deliver messages, right, about what's

really going on? Uh, when I react deeply emotionally to a piece of art, to a piece of music, I kind of can't believe that everybody's not feeling it, right?

Like, I'm here to show you the depth of emotion that can be experienced. Doesn't

mean everybody has to be like that way.

And you know what? If everybody was like me, we'd have a very hard time. We need

all different kinds of people. But what

if we frame being a highly sensitive person as a person who's able to feel and then also communicate that to other people as a superpower? I 100% agree. Uh

people should see you react to a Knicks game. Sports, I mean, I'm very very

game. Sports, I mean, I'm very very excited by sports and wish I mean I do go in person, but it's very overstimulating. I love sports. I always

overstimulating. I love sports. I always

cry in sports games, even if it's not my team. Find yourself a highly sensitive

team. Find yourself a highly sensitive person and make them a good friend because yes, there are ups and downs. Yes,

sometimes they won't go to Costco. Yes,

they get overwhelmed at airports and in public settings, but they give us a glimpse of what is possible. And there

are so many people who are a little dead inside. I don't say this lightly. Life

inside. I don't say this lightly. Life

has beaten many people down and life is difficult and a lot of people have built up an armor. They don't get too high, they don't get too low, which look that has its own benefits, but to have an

infusion of someone who just feels extremely deeply is really a blessing.

Um, yes, and I I do appreciate that. Um,

but obviously the things beyond just quote quote unquote feeling deeply can feel oftentimes like an impediment because it does it can change it can

change social outings. It can change plans. You know, I think my kids I've

plans. You know, I think my kids I've never like given them this framework, but I think once they learn about this, especially my older son, he's going to be like, "Oh, that explains so much." I

mean, this was maybe five years ago already. Um, we were, it was like

already. Um, we were, it was like Christmas and your kids wanted to go shopping and we ended up going to the Grove, a very very large excited mall and they were so they're like, "Mom is

at the Grove on Christmas. This has

never happened before."

It's like the busiest like time and parking and the thing and like just everything. That's that's another way of

everything. That's that's another way of saying, you know, you went there, it was busy, but you weren't that overwhelmed.

And so I think it's important that even if you are a highly sensitive person, try not to shut yourself in. Know that

you can have grounding techniques. Don't

push yourself past what you can tolerate, but also don't be afraid to go out in the world and join, for example, your kids to have that experience or

your family or your friends. Choose your

moments. And I think using some of these managing techniques, whether that be grounding, whether that be body scans, whether that be creative visualization,

you know, don't allow it to isolate you.

Also, before we close, I do want to give special attention to the difference between highly sensitive people and neurode divergent people. Um, so I just want to kind of give that uh a little

bit of time because being an HSP and having sensory processing sensitivity is a trait, right? It's a specific um trait and it means that your nervous system is more sensitive to stimuli. You have a

different way of processing it. Right?

We went through this whole acronym. Um

neurodeiversity is is an explanation of a variation in cognitive functioning and cognitive processing that changes the

way you experience everything and is a term that is designed to include ADHD and dyslexia and different kinds of learning. many on the autism spectrum.

learning. many on the autism spectrum.

But I think it's important to not collapse these two. They can overlap and a lot of people who are highly sensitive people may be given that diagnosis. But

I think it's important to remember we're talking about a trait, right? A

heritable trait versus an umbrella term that is encompassing a description of of brain processing and functioning that usually reflects more of kind of cognitive and computational uh abilities

even on the emotional level. In our

conversations, you know, we've been speaking to a lot of highly sensitive people, people with extra sensory ability, and I'm not saying that highly sensitive and extrensory are the same,

but there is some overlap to them. And

Thomas Campbell, for example, was like, you can filter. Mh. With exercise, with experience, with training, you can learn to filter out. He's like, acknowledge it

and then use techniques to filter. And

so we don't cover as much the techniques, but there are ways that you can learn and request to limit and filter the type of information you're getting to feel less overwhelmed at any

given moment. Again, thinking about it

given moment. Again, thinking about it from a perspective of allow it to uh be what it is when you want it to be that way, but if it's becoming uh interfering

in your ability to go out in the world, there are tools and techniques for you.

And uh maybe for another time or maybe for the comment section, there is overlap between highly sensitive people and extrensory perception. This is

something that's a little harder to study obviously because of a lot of the things that we talk about here in terms of how do we study and understand extrensory perception. Um, but of course

extrensory perception. Um, but of course it makes sense to me, I guess, as a highly sensitive person that um there is this spectrum of being able to tap into

certain emotions and in many cases unconscious processing that um some people might more easily be able to uh extend to extrensory abilities. Final

request, if you've made it this far in the episode and you are a highly sensitive person who also has extrensory abilities, definitely let us know. We

hope that you have enjoyed um our exploration of highly sensitive people.

We know that there's so many more aspects to this and hopefully we'll be able to talk about it other times. I

know that a lot of people are probably wondering what's the role of trauma and we kind of mentioned adverse uh childhood experiences. ACEs um can

childhood experiences. ACEs um can contribute to to highly sensitive people's experiences and and processing.

But there's so much here and we really appreciate uh you all uh learning with us as we learned that I am a 10 out of 10 highly sensitive person. Don't forget

to follow us. Follow Miami Alex breakdown on Substack. We've got a ton of bonus content there. Our newsletter,

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please follow us on Substack on YMB Alex Breakdown and Jonathan Cohen at Jonathan Cohen from our breakdown, the one we hope you never have. We'll see you next time. It's my Alex breakdown. She's

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going to break it down for you. She's

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break down. She's going to break it down.