专访Bryan Johnson：“换血富豪”的“不死”抗衰实验与商业版图

我们 正 在 见 证 人 类 历 史 上 第一 次 有人 用 极 端 透 明 精 密 量 化 的 方 式 公 开 挑 战 衰 老 本

身 这个 人 就是 Brian John son 大家好 欢 迎 来 到 硅 谷 11 1 我是 雨 珊 一个 新 的 长 度 是

这里 我们 已经 有 能 力 从 30 岁 到 0 岁 我 认 为 我们 将 会 有 我们 的 第一 次 长 度 的 短 剂 或 疾

病 在 未 来 的 年 代 当 这 事 件 事 世界 会 变 化 过 夜 追 求 长 度 和 成 功 是 一个 厉 害 他 称

自己 是 世界 上 最 被 精 密 量 化 的人 每 天 轮 流 追 踪 上 千 项 健 康 数 据 家 中 配 备 各 种 监 测

和 治 疗 设 备 并 由 一个 医 生 团 队 协 助 管 理 健 康 这 些 尝 试 曾 让 他的 抗 衰 成 本 高 达 每

年 200 万 美元 他 表示 自己 的 代 谢 健 康 达 到 18 岁 年 轻 人 中 排 名 前 1.

5 % 体 内 炎 症 指 标 比 普 通 10 岁 儿 童 还 比 66 % 根 据 他的 测 量 他 把 自己 的 生 物 衰 老

速 度 拉 回 了 31 年 而 仅 仅 5 年前 他 还 受 到 肥 胖 系 统 性 炎 症 以及 抑 郁 的 困 扰 最近 我 们

在 Brian 来 中国 举 办 东 代 峰 会 期 间 不 仅 到 现 场 感 受 了 他的 抗 衰 体 系 也 有 机 会 与

Brian 面 对 面 聊 了 聊 他的 抗 衰 事 业 翻 看 Brian 在 You Tube 上 的 记 录

你 会 看到 一个 把 日 常 生活 拆 解 成 无 数 可 测 量 步 骤 的人 清 晨 4 点 半 起 床 红 光 照 射 光

疗 灯 调 整 生 物 钟 吃 健 康 配 方 早 餐 力 量 训 练 香 拿 红 光 治 疗 冲 击 波 疗 法 进 入 高

压 养 仓 边 吸 氧 边 工作 并 在 上 午 11 点 结 束 全 天 的 进 食 在 网 站 上 他 公 开 了 各 类 健

康 建 议 和 自 我 实 验 的 记 录 其 中 也 包括 更 激 进 的 前 沿 尝 试 例 如 通 过 健 充 治 干 细

胞 注 射 修 复 受 损 组 织 和 改 善 细 胞 功 能 利 用 F all est atin 基 因 疗 法 促 进

肌 肉 生 成 提 升 运 动 能 力 等 需要 强 调 的是 这 些 前 沿 抗 衰 方 法 大 多 处 于 探 索 阶 段 目前

还 没有 足 够 大 规 模 长 期 的 临 床 试 验 正 是 其 有 效 性 和 安全 性 Brian 本 人 也 多 次 提

到 他 把 自己 当 成 试 验 对 象 尝 试 前 沿 疗 法 并 基 于 监 测 数 据 持 续 调 整 方 案 这 些 前

沿 抗 衰 尝 试 并 不 总 是 带 来 积 极 结 果 以 雷 帕 霉 素 为 例 他 最 初 是 一 种 免 疫 抑 制

药 物 在 多 种 动 物 模 型 中 被 反 复 证 明 可以 延 长 寿 命 因 此 被 视 为 最 有 潜 力 的 抗 衰

分 子 之 一 然 而 在 Brian 的 个 人 尝 试 中 并 未 观 察 到 明 确 的 正 面 收 益 反 而 使 他

持 续 口 腔 溃 疡 代 谢 指 标 异 常 心 率 增 加 在 停 药 后 这 些 变 化 逐 渐 恢 复 Brian 表示 几

年的 雷 帕 霉 素 使 用 可能 反 而 加 速 了 他的 衰 老 并 提 升 了 他的 患 癌 风 险 此 外 为 了 改 善 面

部 因为 胶 原 流 失 而 呈 现 出 衰 老 的 特 征 他 接 受 了 来 自 供 体 的 面 部 脂 肪 填 充 但 出

现 了 严 重 过 敏 反 应 面 部 肿 胀 甚 至 威 胁 到 视 力 而 他 最 为 人 所 知 的 换 血 试 验 其

中 一次 来 自 他的 儿 子 经 过 六 次 每 次 一 生 的 年 轻 血 浆 置 换 常 试 后 相 关 的 生 物 标 志

物 影 像 学 检 查 和 设 备 监 测 结 果 并 未 显 示 出 明 确 的 改 善 他的 这 些 不 成 功 的 尝 试

也 再 次 提 醒 我们 前 沿 抗 衰 并 不 等 于 成 熟 医 学 在 缺 乏 长 期 安全 性 与 明 确 收 益 之前 盲

目 追 逐 突 破 性 疗 法 往 往 比 衰 老 本 身 更 危 险 自 一 生 的 年 轻 血 浆 致 患 尝 试 后 相

关 的 生 物 标 志 物 影 像 学 检 查 和 设 备 监 测 结 果 并 未 显 示 出 明 确 的 改 善。

他的 这 些 不 成 功 的 尝 试 也 再 次 提 醒 我们, 前 沿 抗 衰 并 不 等 于 成 熟 医 学。

在 缺 乏 长 期 安全 性 与 明 确 收 益 之前, 盲 目 追 逐 突 破 性 疗 法 往 往 比 衰 老 本 身 更 危

险。

如果 有 三 个 最 重要 的 biom ark ers that matter the most to you, what would

they be, and what do you reco mmend to actu ally impr ove them?

Prob ably infl amma tion, blood pres sure, and chol este rol.

For infl amma tion, it 'd be HS CR P, and that 's just a gene

ral syst ematic infl amma tion of where is your body, how are you doing.

There 's more gran ular leve ls, but that gives you a nice system level of

is your body infl amed and unha ppy, or is your body happy.

Ch ol este rol, I mean, depe nds on how, you could do a very rich prof

ile look ing at part icle size.

So you can do basic things like chol este rol and LD L.

You can also do a much more robust look ing at L PA and like the part icle

size, AP O B.

So it depe nds on how robust of the panel, but I mean, obvi ously the

more mark ers the bett er.

So blood pres sure, so basic things like syst olic and di ast olic, syst olic,

di ast olic, and then cent ral blood pres sure, then AP X, and so

like the five mark ers for cent ral blood pres sure.

I 've been doing it daily beca use we 've been doing sauna, and that ther

apy has a lot of chan ges for v ascu lar func tions.

You 're look ing at how the blood vess els are resp onding to the heat

as expa nding.

On the infl amma tion, maybe once every few weeks.

And what can people do to impr ove these three most impo rtant biom ark ers?

So the easi est thing to do is to get rid of the bad things in

your life.

So the things like smok ing, drin king, fast food, junk food, not slee ping well,

fried foods, those are the ones that are the imme diate obvi ous ones.

And once you bypass that, it gets into more nuan ced, for exam ple, air qual

ity, toxins in food, stress can do that.

So there 's easy wins, which we all know about, than the more gran ular ones,

which take a little bit of inve stig ative work.

So you have also desc ribed some of your more expe rime ntal ther apies as

punc hing thro ugh the ceil ing.

So I wond er, what do you mean by that?

And how do you choose what are the ther apies that you are going to try

and expe rime nt?

For exam ple, we just comp leted with sauna.

And so if you ask most people in the health world about sauna, they may cite

that it 's good for v ascu lar func tion, like end oth el ial func

tion, like your blood vess els are expa nding, you 're pump ing blood, you 're

rele asing heat shock prot eins, which are these prot eins that roll around and they

pick up garb age and you 're like mist ful of prot eins.

But what we did is we, I think we did the most meas ured sauna expe

riment in hist ory.

And so we looked not just at v ascu lar func tion, but we looked at, for

exam ple, micro pl asti cs, and not just my blood, but also in my ej

ac ulate, which is the, there was a Chin ese study that showed that of 100

% of the samp les taken from men, 100 % of the people had micro pl astics in

both their test icles and their ej ac ulate.

Now that 's not good beca use it has nega tive effe cts for test oste

rone, for fert ility, all these follow - on effe cts.

And when the world has basi cally lost 50 % of fert ility over the past 50

years, it 's good to get to a source of a prob lem.

So in our sauna meas urem ent, we were meas uring, does sauna change micro pl

astic leve ls?

And nobody in the world had ever done that befo re.

And it showed that it lowe red mine by 87 %.

We make these disc over ies all the time beca use we comb ine ther apies,

we do meas urem ent.

And so it leads us to insi ghts that you just can 't find anyw here

in the scie ntific lite ratu re.

What 's the rati onale for sauna to help you erad icate or reduce the micro

pl astic level?

Yeah, we don 't know.

Okay.

So this is, yeah, so this is the thing is we, we typi cally will go

into an expe riment and we start it and we say, we 're going to cast

a really wide net.

So in one of our recent expe rime nts, we did 24 9 biom ark ers.

So we just say, we 're going to meas ure ever ythi ng, the brain and

the heart and the lungs, the micr obi ome, eyes, like we just meas ure ever

ything and then we just see what happ ens.

And some times in doing that, you find false posi tives.

So you 'll find an effect that it 's not really an effe ct.

You have to then do furt her expe rime ntat ion.

But the value of what we 're doing is we 're just trying to create And

we 're perf ect.

This one is perf ect, but if you know I 'm bett er.

or like reduce the micr opla stic level?

Yeah, we don't know.

Okay.

So this is, yeah, so this is the thing is we typi cally will go into

an expe riment and we start it and we say we're going to cast a really

wide net.

So in one of our recent expe rime nts, we did 249 biom arke rs.

So we just say we're going to meas ure ever ythi ng, the brain and the

heart and the lungs, the micr obio me, eyes, like we just meas ure ever ything

and then we just see what happ ens.

And some times in doing that, you find false posi tives.

So you'll find an effect that it's not really an effe ct.

You have to then do furt her expe rime ntat ion.

But the value of what we're doing is we're just trying to create intu itio ns,

like where should we point our atte ntion?

And then once we make this obse rvat ion, now that we've shown that sauna was

effe ctive in redu cing my micr opla stics, I'm sure others will do follow -on

expe rime ntat ion and prob ably do it more robu stly, which is the ideal

scen ario.

How many times of sauna or like how long of the sess ions have you made

you able to achi eve that resu lt?

Listen to these sess ions.

Yeah.

We had also, there was a subs tant ial drop in envi ronm ental toxi ns.

So we had like 15 toxins we meas ured and there was a subs tant ial

drop in those after 15 sess ions.

And then more on the micro, we did more sess ions in the micr opla stics.

And then we found other thin gs, for exam ple, like there were vasc ular impr

ovem ents, which were also good.

We also found out that I did an expe riment where men need to ice their

grow ing area.

If they don't, that heat has a nega tive effect and it will knock out their

fert ility mark ers by about 50%.

It's not just, and a lot of men will say, well, I don't care beca use

I'm not trying to have a baby.

But the prob lem is it has nega tive feed back loops on test oste rone,

on horm ones, and a bunch of other impo rtant proc esses.

So again, that's like some thing where people unde rstand gene rally sauna is good, but

they don't unde rstand it needs to be done in a dry sauna with ice and the

grow ing, and it's going to addr ess envi ronm ental toxins and micr opla stics

and vasc ular func tion.

And so we just pulled all these vari ables in and now it's the most comp

rehe nsive unde rsta nding we've ever had of sauna.

So are you trying any new ther apies right now and any plans for the next

like three, five mont hs?

You know, one fun ther apy we're plan ning right now is spicy foods.

So we found some evid ence that spice has a number of posi tive health effe

cts.

And so we've tried to acqu ire cert ain spicy mole cules and we are

now doing lab test ing to find out which one we can take.

So it's low in toxins and we'll prob ably start that in the next month or

so.

But surp risi ngly, it has pretty inte rest ing effe cts on slow ing down

aging and reve rsing some aging dama ge.

So we'll see.

I mean, this is the kinds of stuff we find are, it always really surp rises

me.

They sit in these little pock ets that are unex pect ed.

But like sauna, maybe we can figure out what kind of spice in what conc entr

ations or what dura tion.

So that's a fun one.

I think a common unde rsta nding of taking spicy foods is prob ably it will

incr ease your infl amma tion and make you have like little like pimp les on

your face.

How do you take that?

Why do you think spicy food, does it like actu ally cont ribute to these issu

es?

Well, so I guess it depe nds on what the source is.

So ther e's many things that you can prob ably do for spice.

So we just star ted this last week.

So I'm not up to speed yet on the enti rety of the prot ocol.

But just know ing that that's coming up, let me think of anot her one.

We rece ntly comp leted hype rbaric oxygen ther apy.

That's where you sit in that cham ber.

The air is conc entr ated very dens ely.

It's like being unde rwater by 10 mete rs.

And same thing with sauna.

We did prob ably the most meas ured sauna prot ocol or HBOT prot ocol in

the world.

We looked at there were bene fits we saw in my brain, my DNA, my micr

obio me, skin.

It was just like a whole body reset, which was really surp rising to see.

It really is a syst ematic whole body trea tment.

So that was neat.

The prob lem is that one's not very acce ssib le.

You said yest erday that you're basi cally using 2039 as your goal to achi eve

don't die, right?

And I think a lot of people will think purs uing long evity and achi eving

don't die is a priv ilege.

So what do you think the gene ral popu lation can real isti cally take away

from these ende avors?

A lot of people think this is about me.

They think I'm doing this for immo rtal ity.

I'm really doing this for huma nity, beca use nobody can achi eve good health with

out the help of huma nity.

So when some body has high blood pres sure, they 're not the person that crea

tes the drug.

They take the drug some body else made.

And when you drink clean water, to achi eve don't die, right?

And I think a lot of people will think purs uing long evity and achi eving

don't die is a priv ilege.

So what do you think the gene ral popu lation can real isti cally take away

from these ende avors?

A lot of people think this is about me.

They think I'm doing this for immo rtal ity.

I'm really doing this for huma nity beca use nobody can achi eve good health with

out the help of huma nity.

So when some body has high blood pres sure, they 're not the person that crea

tes the drug.

They take the drug some body else made.

And when you drink clean water, some one else built the water puri fica tion system

to make the water clean.

And so we all depend upon each other to build syst ems of heal th.

Now it's also true that if some body poll utes the water, ever ybody is nega

tively affe cted.

And so health is actu ally a shared reso urce.

It's some thing that all of huma nity has to part icip ate in.

And so what I'm trying to do is I'm trying to change our cult ure to

say, hey, ever ybody, we have n't been as mind ful as we could be about

our health and well ness.

And that incl udes the toxins in our envi ronm ent.

It incl udes our cult ure of scro lling all the time.

It incl udes cult ure of porn and bett ing and junk foods and all these

bad habits we have.

It's not good for any one of us or not good for anyb ody.

And so my goal of 2039 is to create a focu sed point of atte ntion

to say, we have a new goal.

And in giving people that goal, I think they have moti vation to say, I want

to also work towa rds that goal.

It does n't mean that they are going to do a bunch of expe nsive ther apies.

It does mean they will say, I'm going to bed on time.

And I'm not going to smoke.

And I'm not going to drink.

And I'm not going to eat the fried food.

So I think it's really giving people moti vation and a spec ific thing they can focus

on that moti vates them to try to record it .除了自

.除了自 我试验, Bria n也把这 套方法论 发展成了 自己的东 代事业 ,并创立 了公司B luep rint .如今

.如今 ,这家公 司已经从 最初Br ian的 个人实验 拓展到包 括健康餐饮 ,补剂 ,护肤与 护发产品 ,配餐订 阅以及周 边商品在 内的完整 产品线

.今年1

.今年1 0月底 ,Blu epri nt获得 了600 0万美金 的新融资 ,投资人 名单跨越 科技, 娱乐与风 险投资界 ,Andre Carp athy,

Kim Kard ashi an, Joshua Kush ner, Naval Ravi kant ,这些名 字本身就 足以说明 市场正在 关注什么 。然而

。然而 ,Blu epri nt的发 展并非一 帆风顺。

纽约时报 报道称 ,尽管公 司在20 24年实 现了约4 000万 美元的年收入 ,拥有约 4万名消费者 ,但仍面 临不小的 财务压力 ,每月亏 损超过1 00万美

元。我们

元。我们 与Blu epri nt团队求证 ,Blu epri nt团队 表示财务 数据并不 出现, 但不可否 认的是 ,过去1 0年里 ,硅谷对 于延长寿

命这件事 的兴趣不 断上升。

早在20 13年 ,谷歌就 成立Ca lico ,研究衰 老相关疾 病。20

病。20 22年 ,Altos Labs 获得约3 0亿美金 启动资金 ,把细胞 重编程与 再生医学 推向新的 高度。由

高度。由 Sam Altm an支持 的Ret roBi osci ences ,在成立 之初就融资1 .8亿美金。

.8亿美金。

如今正在 筹集高达 10亿美 金的新一 轮融资 ,目标是 让人类健 康寿命增 加10年 。与此同时

。与此同时 ,抗衰也 越来越多 地出现在 主流公共 议程里。

11月在 华盛顿举 行的Make Amer ica Heal thy Agai n峰会 ,由美国 卫生部长 Robert Kenn edy Jr .和副总统J

.和副总统J .D.

.D.

Vanc e领衔, 议题从健 康饮食一 路延伸到 逆转衰老 、AI医 疗、脑机 接口等前 沿方向。

Brian John son也 受邀出席 ,与Ne ural ink联 合创始人 以及专注 细胞重编 程的New Limi t联合创 始人同台 ,讨论长 寿与脑机

接口的未 来。在资

来。在资 本和产业层面 ,大型药 企也开始 把衰老生 物学视为 下一条创 新管线。

例如 ,意外L ily旗 下创投 ,近期领 投了细胞 重编程公 司New Limi t的新一 轮融资 ,希望推 动针对细 胞衰老的 表观遗传 疗法进入

临床。而

临床。而 Nova rtis 与专注长 寿数据的 平台型公 司Bel age Labs ,达成最高5 .5亿美

.5亿美 金规模的合作 ,一起寻 找针对衰 老相关疾 病的新把 点。可以看到

点。可以看到 ,从科技 富豪到传 统药企 ,再到政 策制定者 ,如何延 长健康寿命, 正在被越 来越多严 肃的参与 者纳入议程。

近 期 领 投 了 细 胞 重 编 程 公 司 New Lim it 的 新 一 轮 融 资 希望 推 动 针 对 细 胞 衰 老

的 表 观 遗 传 疗 法 进 入 临 床 而 No v art is 与 专 注 长 寿 数 据 的 平 台 型 公 司 B el

age Labs 达 成 最 高 5. 5

5. 5 亿 美 金 规 模 的 合 作 一起 寻 找 针 对 衰 老 相 关 疾 病 的 新 打 点 可以 看到 从 科 技 富 豪

到 传 统 药 企 再 到 政 策 制 定 者 如何 延 长 健 康 寿 命 正 在 被 越 来 越 多 严 肃 的 参 与 者

纳 入 议 程 作 为 当 下 最 受 公 众 关 注 的 抗 筛 实 验 者 之 一 Brian 如何 看 待 政 界 资

本 与 医 疗 产 业 对 长 寿 领 域 日 益 升 温 的 投 入 而 B lu ep rint 又 是 如何 拿 下 6

000 万 美元 融 资 又 打 算 如何 拓 展 自己 的 商 业 版 图 呢 Now I 'd like to zoom out

to the grea ter long evity field I think it really feels like we 're in a

para digm shift And by that I 'm saying it 's not just the tech bill ion

aires It 's not just like all those labs But rather global priv ate equity Like

the ones in Sili con Valley And like even in the Middle East And also the

heal thcare inve stors T rad itio nal heal thcare inve stors Like corp orate vent

ures And also even policy makers I think they 're lean ing They 're really lean

ing into long evity And you were just on a panel At the M aha Summit with

RF K Jr. And also the CEO of Ne ural ink So I 'm curi ous from

your pers pect ive What is driv ing this shift And what do you think look

ing ahead three to five years What kind of inno vation or brea kthr ough Would

happen in the long evity field So what I like that 's happ ening is H

um ans have a ra ven ous appe tite To be heal thy To look great And

to feel great Right But they find it very hard To look great and feel great

Beca use They feel tempt ations to Do bad things To smoke and drink And not

exer cise And it 's very hard to do those things Right And so I think If

you look at what happ ened rece ntly With these GL P - 1 s That is I think

the first C ateg or ically succ essful Ant i - aging drug Right Okay Ant i -

aging It is Ex plain it Beca use people asso ciated with weight L oss And

appe tite supp ress ion And those are true Al so it has a lot of

bene fits For meta bolic health For lower infl amma tion It 's neuro prot ective

And there 's more things coming out Right And so I micro d ose a GL P - 1

now I micro d ose towa rds appe tite Wow You don 't seem to need

it Right Not from like cont roll ing your appe tite Your food Ex actly So I

have no need for appe tite cont rol I have no need to lose weight My

body fat and my muscle Are top 99 perc ent ile opti mal For all men

So I do it for the long evity bene fits For lower blood gluc ose L ower

infl amma tion B etter meta bolic health And so this one I think Is a These

GL P - 1 s Are an exam ple Of how fast L onge vity is going to

sweep the world What I 'm bull ish on Is There 's a few tech nolo gies In

the pipe line right now That could have Real Tr ue Ant i - aging E ffect

s Not like Right now if I 'm doing sauna It 's good for me Like defi

nitely good for me In a whole bunch of areas But it 's an incr emen tal

And I have to work at it A GL P - 1 You take a shot And you lose

30 - 40 pounds And you just feel like a diff erent person And I think we

're going to have Our first long evity drugs Or ther apies In the coming years

And when that happ ens The world is going to snap over night And huma nity

is going to shift It 's focus to say We want life Like I want to

be heal thy And so I think we really are On the c usp Of a change That

is far bigger Th an anyone 's anti cipa ting Beca use it 's going to

coinc ide With AI prog ress Or AI is going to Ch ange soci ety In

ways we can 't anti cipate So I think we really is It 's a para digm shift

That is prob ably the bigg est one H app ening right now And it 's

just star ting to emerge And you think in the next 3 to 5 years Maybe A

new L onge vity Dr ug Could emerge Like the ones Like GL P - 1 Yeah And

even if it 's not Even if the drug is not G ener ally avai lable

I think in the next couple years We will see AI led disc over ies Wh

ether it be in anim als Or whet her it be In small trials That will

show dram atic effe cts And so even though It 's not A mass market prod

uct It will be very clear From the stud ies And the evid ence That a

new E ra of long evity is here And you think in the next three to five

years maybe a new long evity drug could emerge like the ones like GLP -1?

Yeah, and even if the drug is not gene rally avai lable, I think in

the next couple years we will see AI -led disc over ies, whet her it be

in anim als or whet her it be in small tria ls, that will show dram

atic effe cts.

And so even though it's not a mass market prod uct, it will be very clear

from the stud ies and the evid ence that a new era of long evity is

here.

Have you seen or have you obse rved any new prom ising mole cules?

The bigg est ones happ ening right now are, for exam ple, the tran scri ptome

fact ors, the OSK, the Yelman -Akin fact ors.

Yeah.

So this is like the idea for most peop le.

So if you have a man and a woman that are each 30 years of age

and they create the man's sperm and the woma n's egg come toge ther, the 30

-year -old sperm and the 30 -year -old egg comb ine and then it beco mes

zero.

It goes back to a baby, right?

The embryo beco mes day zero.

And so in our biol ogy, we alre ady have the abil ity to go from

30 years of age to zero.

And that happ ens every gene ration as we make new babi es.

And so that tech nology exists in our body to take old cells and make them

young cells.

And so the same things have been shown in the labs with the Yelman -Akin fact

ors.

You can take an adult cell and make it a plur ipot ent stem cell.

You take it back to an embryo stage.

Yeah.

Now, it's not there yet where ther e's still some off -tar get effe cts.

It can still become canc erous.

So ther e's work that needs to be done to make sure it's robu st.

But in the lab, we're show ing you can actu ally reve rse age all the

way back.

And so that's prom ising beca use you can start with things like take a liver

and take your liver back.

You can do so with your panc reas and other orga ns.

It takes some effort to do a whole body.

But yes, the tech nology is there.

And it's being refi ned.

It's being built.

And the AI tools we have now are just making that proc ess so much faster

to figure out what tran scri ption fact ors we use and what way and how

we stru cture them.

And then there was a study out of China rece ntly where they took the prot

ein FOXO3.

They did a CRISPR edit.

They put it in a mese nchy mal stem cell.

They inje cted it in the vein.

And then it showed over 50 % of tiss ues had an equi valent of 10 to

13 years age reve rsal in huma ns.

So that was one of the most robust demo nstr atio ns.

So that study needs to be repl icated again.

Like first stud ies, good proof of conc ept, but some body needs to repl icate

it.

That was extr emely robu st, one of the best expe rime nts ever done.

So that would give people hope.

So I want to ask you about Blue print.

So you rece ntly raised a round of fina ncing from really a wide range of

inve stors.

What do you think these people saw in you and Blue print?

And can you share any stor ies behind the inve stme nt?

Basi cally, it was a round of frie nds.

So they all have a keen inte rest in health and well ness.

And we're always having conv ersa tions.

They 're asking me about this and that.

And I'm shar ing what I'm lear ning.

So it was just brin ging people toge ther that care a lot about long evity,

who really enjoy this as a sand box to play in.

And what's your plan for Blue print?

What's your long -term vision for it?

I'd like us to become the best health prov ider in the entire world.

So right now, if some body says they want to be heal thy or if some

body has a health issue, trying to either solve your health prob lem or gett ing

robust care is really hard.

So if you're rich, you can go to a high -end conc ierge and they typi cally

want to sell you expe nsive stuff.

And not all stuff works.

So the game is buy stuff.

But they don't addr ess the unde rlying prob lem of beha vioral change of, you

know, can you stop this bad habit?

Can you adopt this good habit?

And then on the gene ral prac titi oner side, most doct ors just don't know

how to deal with heal th.

Or they 're good at some basic thin gs, but they don't unde rstand nutr ition

very well.

They don't unde rstand long evity ther apies very well.

And then you go to a long evity doct or, they just don't typi cally have the

brea dth and depth to addr ess the pers on's all their needs of nutr ition,

exer cise, pres crip tions, all of the above.

So we've done this with my prot ocol over the past five years.

We basi cally have built the best health prot ocol in the entire world.

And so if we can take what I've done, what my team has done with me,

and we can take that and we can pack age it up and give it to

other peop le, then we could comp ete for best in world.

So now if some one says, I'm in, I want to be.

They 're good at some basic thin gs, but they don't unde rstand nutr ition very

well.

They don't unde rstand long evity ther apies very well.

And then you go to a long evity doct or, they just don't typi cally have the

brea dth and depth to addr ess the pers on's, all their needs of nutr ition,

exer cise, pres crip tions, all of the above.

So we've done this with my prot ocol over the past five years.

We basi cally have built the best health prot ocol in the entire world.

And so if we can take what I've done, what my team has done with me,

and we can take that and we can pack age it up and give it to

other peop le, then we could comp ete for best in world.

So now if some one says, I'm in, I want to be heal thy, we just

say, come on in, we'll take care of you.

We'll tell you what to eat, when to sleep, what pres crip tions to take, how

to meas ure it, how to focus on areas of conc ern.

But we just build out a comp rehe nsive full stack solu tion where our moti

vation is not to sell them stuff.

Our moti vation is to get their body to be in pris tine health so that

the person knows that our genu ine intent is there in spec tacu lar heal th.

So if that's my goal is that people say it's easy, it's great, they 've never

felt bett er, they 've never looked bett er, they 've never slept bett er.

So I think we can do it.

requ ires us to stand up eight or nine busi nesses at the same time.

Beca use most comp anies will say, I'm just going to build this green juice or

this supp lement or this ther apy or this serv ice.

And we have to do ever ything all at once.

So it's a very big lift.

It's ambi tious.

But I think we can do it.

So I wonder what could the busi ness model look like?

So it's going to be like an annual subs crip tion serv ice?

Or how do you charge people for that?

So one is we have nutr ition pack aged up.

So prot ein and extra virgin olive oil and your basic supp leme nts.

We have skin care, hair care.

So all of your basic things you need on a mont hly basis of just cons umab

les.

Then we have biom arke rs, which is get meas ured, find out if you have

any prob lem, areas of conc ern.

Then othe rwise, let's keep your biom arkers on a meas urem ent rout ine so we

can see if things are impr oving or what we need to focus on.

Then we have pres crip tions.

So if you want to start micr odos ing a GLP -1, if you have a

blood pres sure medi cati on, if you're on a stat in, like what ever that may

be.

We have tele heal th.

So you have a doctor who's enga ged, be like, all right, let's look at the

data.

Let's go over what you're doing now.

The prot ocols.

So in the cont ext of a comm unity where a lot of people stru ggle to

do things on their own, but they 're empo wered to do things when others are

doing them.

So if you go to bed on time and we're frie nds, I may go to

bed on time as well.

So you're embe dded in a comm unity where good beha vior is the norm and you

feel more moti vated to do it.

So basi cally, we're just taking some one's budget that they allo cate towa rds life.

We're saying inst ead of spen ding it on these sour ces, come over and spend

the same money with us.

So we're hoping to do it in an econ omical way where people are just shif

ting where they 're spen ding money on food today.

Send it to us, skin care, hair care, pres crip tions, and we bring it all

toge ther in a way that helps them make sense of all the data and keeps them

in a stru ctured rout ine where they feel like they 're at home, they 're being

watc hed over, they 're being cared for.

They 're gett ing the best evid ence -based care.

And I think you once ment ioned that all of doing these meas urem ents, they

're the most expe nsive part of your long evity pack age.

So in the serv ices that will be prov ided thro ugh Blue print, do you

think the meas urem ents, the cost could come down or it's still going to be?

Yeah.

So even with mine, the first couple of years, we spent a couple of mill ion

doll ars.

Like, for exam ple, when we did our first whole body MRI, we prob ably spent

maybe $200 ,000 or $300 ,000.

We did all the rese arch on all the scie ntific pape rs.

We built our own cust omer prot ocol.

We had to find an MRI faci lity to change all their sett ings, get it

done.

We had to do it three times.

And so now the prot ocol we've built is just comm only out there.

And you can get it for $1 ,000 or $2 ,000.

So the price has dram atic ally drop ped.

That's like 10 times decr eased.

Exac tly.

Right?

Yeah.

And like the same when we star ted meas uring micr opla stics, you know, in

both blood and ejac ulate, it was the first time anyb ody in the world had

done that.

And to do that, you have to have a lab that is non -pla stic.

Like most labs, like most of the things are built in plas tic.

So you have to rebu ild an entire lab with out plas tics.

That's very expe nsive.

But now you can bring it down dram atic ally.

So we've taken all of our tests and prot ocols and meas urem ents and made

them all very econ omic al.

So, yeah, it's alre ady drop ped like dram atic ally.

I think in the Blue print, like busi ness scope, you also have like clinic here

in China.

And I think they 're prob ably like one of your first clin ics in China.

too.

China too.

both blood and ejac ulate it was the first time anyb ody in the world had

done that and to do that you have to have a lab that is non -pla

stic like most labs like most of things are built in plas tic beca use you

have to rebu ild an entire lab with out plas tics that's very expe nsive but

now you can bring it down dram atic ally so we've taken all of our tests

and prot ocols and meas urem ents and made them all very econ omical so yeah

it's alre ady drop ped like dram atic ally I think in the blue print like

busi ness scope you also have like clinic here in China and I think they are

prob ably like one of your first clin ics in China so I wonder like why do

you choose China to be the first stop of your clinic busi ness yeah and yeah

any stor ies that you can share if you basi cally just look at coun tries

on planet Earth and you say what group of humans do we think would be most

exci ted mm -hmm about the pote ntial of health long evity mm -hmm China is

right there at the very very top China is yout hful and ener getic and

hungry you know the Chin ese have a fant astic work ethic you know nine nine

six is no joke right like that that is a tough work ethic right and people are

hungry for succ ess they want to climb the ladder they want to be so I think

it's a really good match for the where China is at as a coun try that China

is an ambi tious coun try right and ambi tion coin cides very well of long

evity so that match for us it's just perf ect where we are part nered with

China we want to grow with China and just it's a really fresh place to be

from a prac tice level do you obse rve any diff eren ces betw een China

and the US very simi lar we can basi cally achi eve the same qual ity

the same comp rehe nsiv eness in a single expe rience and so yeah I think China

is China is prob ably the best market we could see this in in terms

of repl icat ing the model we built us it fits with the the expe rtise

here the ther apies avai lable the the you know the size of the cities

and you could actu ally conc entr ate this and get people to come in so

it's a good it's a good match for us so I wonder like how has your team

use AI to change the way that you do things yeah I mean when when you're

a doctor and you look at one marker like infl amma tion then it's easy for

the doctor to say it's high or low and based upon that here's what I sugg

est you do right when you have you know 10 ,000 biom arkers it's much harder

for a doctor to say here's what I think you should do and why abso lutely

and espe cially when some of those mark ers are not well known they 're up

and coming if they 're like prot eomics or meth ylat ion mark ers or you're

comb ining a whole bunch of data points from imag ing plus biom arkers and so

what the AI has done for us is it helps us find the patt erns

in these big data sets that you othe rwise can't have a human do and so

we've been able to be succ essful in find ing these patt erns like we've we've

you know we talked about sauna and other things we've been able to stitch toge ther

evid ence and new prot ocols and new insi ghts and new meas urem ent stru

ctures beca use we're seeing such a broad view and we can find these conn ecti

ons so we're just gett ing warmed up I mean these tools are brand new we're gett

ing our first wins but I think it's very prom ising that we're no longer limi

ted by the number of biom arkers that you can get and they make sense of

it and then if we have to look ahead a little bit what do you think

AI could do in addi tion to what you just said I mean Google just showed

the first AI based brea kthr ough so a lot of people said the LLMs are cool

but they 're not doing brea kthr oughs okay and Google just did their first brea

kthr ough they showed how to tell how to turn a cold cancer into hot so

you could have the body iden tify it work on it and so AI is now

a disc overy tool for long evity and so not only is it useful for unde

rsta nding very large data sets it's now in the disc overy mode help ing us

actu ally find new path ways for trea ting dise ase and also reve rsing age

and I think that comb inat ion this is why I think it's that the rise

of long evity will be faster and more robust than anyo ne's anti cipa ting beca

use we saw this the the first go -round with GLP -1s it's going to happen

again with long evity and AI is going to be the fuel source for it blue

prin t产品推 出后迅速 引发了广 泛关注与讨论 部分用户 表示在经 历水平睡 眠质量和 健康指标 等方面有 所改善也 有不少人 指出产品 价格较高 体验差异

较大个别 情况下还 出现胃肠 不适等不 良反应与 此同时 and also reve rsing age, and I think that comb

inat ion, this is why I think it's that the rise of long evity will be

faster and more robust than anyo ne's anti cipa ting, beca use we saw this, the

first go -round with GLP -1s, it's going to happen again with long evity, and AI

is going to be the fuel source for it.

Blue print 产品推出后 ,迅速引 发了广泛 关注与讨论 ,部分用 户表示在 经历水平 、睡眠质 量和健康 指标等方 面有所改善 ,也有不 少人指出 产品价格较高

,体验差 异较大 ,个别情 况下还出 现胃肠不 适等不良 反应。

与此同时 ,部分医 学专家指出 ,目前B luep rint 产品的成 分组合尚 缺乏成熟 的人体循 证医学证 据。总体来看

据。总体来看 ,Blu eprint 展现了一 种极具探 索性的抗 衰路径 ,但其有 效性与可 复制性仍 有待更系 统长期的 科学验证 。Bri

。Bri ent 曾提到 ,在他的 抗衰事业背后 ,有一个 庞大且高 度专业化 的医学团 队之称。

自Blu eprint 启动以来 ,他邀请 了超过3 0名医生 和健康专 家参与这 项逆龄实 验。Br

验。Br ient 的医疗团 队在发展 过程中也 经历过人 员调整 ,曾在其 纪录片中 出现的核 心医生之 一Oli ver Zolm an已于 去年离开

团队。纽

团队。纽 约时报报 道指出 ,知情人 士称Zo lman 对Blu eprint 的部分研 究方向和 结果表达 过担忧 ,而Bl uepr int 团队成员表示

,Zol man的 离开与个 人健康原 因有关。

那么到底 Blue print 的种种抗 衰尝试有 多少科学依据 ?他背后

?他背后 的医生团 队又是什 么组成 ?我们也

?我们也 跟Blu eprint 的医生K arl 聊了聊 ,现在就 来为大家 揭秘Bl uepr int 抗衰事业 背后的医 生团队。

It makes sense to actu ally have a smal ler team that then brings in other

indi vidu als who are expe rts in spec ific areas.

So if we're focu sing on hype rbar ic, let's talk to an expert in that.

But who's over seeing that also?

Mike Mallon has been invo lved.

Ther e's other phys icia ns.

Ther e's anot her phys ician in Ali who's out of Germ any who's really heavy

data scie ntist.

We have other data scie ntists invo lved, but Mike Mall on, myse lf, and Ali

are the main phys icia ns.

And then we're brin ging in other people depe nding on what we're talk ing about.

So the team has shrunk down sign ific antly beca use we've really tried out a

lot of things in the long evity space and figu red out what really works.

And now we can focus on brin ging in indi vidual tests as we need them

while we're still focu sed on the main things that we know are the most effe

ctive.

So Brian said yest erday at the summit that he wants to achi eve don't die

by 2039.

As a doct or, do you think that's actu ally achi evab le?

And how can that be real ized?

Yeah, it's funny beca use if you would have said that to me cert ainly five

years ago, maybe even two, three years ago, I prob ably would have said it's not

poss ible.

That has chan ged.

Ther e's some hurd les that are being over come that are that I'm in.

How fast AI is going and how it's chan ging has really chan ged my opin

ion about that.

And it's it's made it more where we can see that we've been able to slow

down Bria n's rate of aging.

Ther e's a lot of cool tech nolo gies and stuff we've used, but a lot

of it has really been the basi cs, really honing in nutr ition, really honing in

sleep, redu cing risk around diff erent dise ase proc esses.

And that has slowed things at such a rate that if you can see, imag ine

in the futu re, if we get that a little bit slower and we're able to

bring in these other tech nolo gies that actu ally then reve rse that rate at

which we're aging, it beco mes a real ity pretty quick.

And so some of the tech nolo gies that have star ted to happen are

being able to reset cells into a state of youth.

So that's all repr ogra mming.

Yeah.

Brian talked about.

Yeah.

So that's happ ened.

at such a rate that if you can see, imag ine in the futu re, if

we get that a little bit slower and we're able to bring in these other tech

nolo gies that actu ally then reve rse that rate at which we're aging, it beco

mes a real ity pretty quick.

And so some of the tech nolo gies that have star ted to happen are

being able to reset cells into a state of youth.

The cell repr ogra mming, as Brian talked about.

Yeah.

So that's happ ened.

But also one of the limi ting fact ors has been cogn itive decl ine.

We can only right now do so much, but ther e's been some newer adva nces

and stud ies that have shown that maybe we can do a lot more.

And those things are using like nano tech nolo gies to repair the blood barr ier.

So the barr ier that exists betw een your brain and your blood.

And that breaks down over time and resu lts in down stre am, prob ably some

cogn itive decl ine.

And how to do that was how to addr ess that has always been an issue.

But now we're seeing these brea kthr oughs happen in this space that really have made

me kind of stand back and be like, oh, these prob lems that I didn't five

years ago see is really for us as huma nity be able to over come now

seem more than doab le.

I'll push you a little bit on that.

Sure.

So, um, I guess in order to achi eve don't die, you prob ably have to,

uh, reduce your rate of aging from, I think curr ently Brian is at 0 .5,

.5, right?

Yeah, he's about 0 .5,

.5, 0 .48,

.48, I think was his best ever.

Yeah.

And you have to reduce that to zero.

Is that right?

No, no, that's not what I'm sayi ng.

So I think we're going to be able to reduce it down to like maybe 0 .4.

.4.

Uh, let's, but let's say we keep it at 0 .5.

.5.

And, um, at this point, what happ ens then is the tech nolo gies to reve

rse that six months of aging that happ ens every year become the point where they

can reve rse six months of aging every year.

And that's long evity escape velo city.

So where you can reduce the rate at which you're aging, but then what ever you

are aging, we can reve rse in addi tion to all the things that you're doing

on a daily basis to slow the rate of all your cells aging.

Does that make sense?

It's kind of a hard conc ept.

So these kind of reve rse aging, um, I don't know, like ther apies appr oach

es, are those the ones like, uh, cell repr ogra mming appr oach es?

Yes, that's what we're talk ing about.

Do you think that's like the magic switch where ther e's like, um, uh, like other

swit ches?

Ther e's other things too.

So I think one of the things is, uh, addr essi ng, um, immune dysf unct ion.

So as you age, you get cell ular cells, immune cells become dysf unct ional and,

um, rege nera ting your thym us.

I think the repr ogra mming, the epig enetic chan ges and repr ogra mming is

prob ably going to be the bigg est thing.

In my opin ion, ther e's going to be other things that I don't fore see

and other people don't even fore see, but those couple of, uh, hurd les are alre

ady being jumped over.

And that makes it where I see in, you know, 10, 14, 15 years as poss

ible.

So addr essing the immune dysf unct ion, uh, is there any prom ising meth ods

like ther apies out there that could achi eve that?

Ther e's rese arch right now around addr essing T cell dysf unct ion spec ific

ally.

Um, I, none of that is, is real ly, um, comm erci ally avai lable or

avai lable for indi vidual people there.

It's really mouse models and cell, cell mode ls.

Um, which is anot her exam ple is what we're able to do now.

And Bria n's actu ally doing this now is to take cells from diff erent organs

and grow them and then test on those cells.

So one of the risks that I have seen is as humans are, as we're going

along this jour ney, being able to test diff erent, how you resp ond to diff

erent trea tmen ts, ever ybod y's going to resp ond a little diff eren tly.

Ther e's risk with trea tmen ts.

And so you could have adve rse effe cts from, from these trea tments that we're

trying out on each indi vidu al.

But if we can test that in a way, then that actu ally chan ges the game

a fair amou nt.

So we're not test ing and gues sing as much on trea tment.

diff erent organs and grow them and then test on those cells.

So one of the risks that I have seen is as humans are, as we're going

along this jour ney, being able to test diff erent, how you resp ond to diff

erent trea tmen ts, ever ybod y's going to resp ond a little diff eren tly.

Ther e's risk with trea tmen ts.

And so you could have adve rse effe cts from these trea tments that we're trying

out on each indi vidu al.

But if we can test that in a way, then that actu ally chan ges the game

a fair amou nt.

So we're not test ing and gues sing as much on trea tmen ts, and we

don't have risk of aging and things going hayw ire and wrong.

We can actu ally grow out cells, test how you're going to resp ond, and then

feel that it's safe.

Are we gett ing the appr opri ate resp onse?

Then let's try this in you, as oppo sed to just kind of gues sing or

in with pote ntial cata stro phic even ts.

Yeah.

So you're saying that the appr oach has to be pers onal.

It has to adapt to one's meas urem ents.

So then brings to a next ques tion.

So Naval or Rapp icant calls Brian one -man FDA, famo usly calls him one -man

FDA.

So I wond er, that impl ies that these, the expe rime ntal appr oaches that he's

taken is based on data on his own body, right?

Yep.

And prob ably only appl ies to his situ ation, right?

Given the pers onal diff eren ces.

So how do you think people should take away from these appr oach es?

Should people follow them with this N equals one data poin ts?

How do you, how do you inte grate that?

Yeah, ther e's, ther e's cert ain things that are real ly, and actu ally the

majo rity of inte rven tions that Brian does are actu ally really low risk.

The ones that make the most diff erence are really low risk.

Going to bed on time is pretty low risk.

And, and it's been shown in mult iple popu lati ons and, and diff erent, uh,

in so many ways it's been proven and repr oven.

And those are the things that are really comp ress ing Bria n's rate of aging

the most, right?

Ther e's other things that are not as big of outc omes, right?

Thou gh, but as far as the next level of how pers onal ized we're going

to get, that 's, that's going to happ en.

We need to get to the point where all these other tech nolo gies that Brian

is tryi ng, we can indi vidu alize them and we can also make the cost

of them decr ease to where it is more scal able to ever yone.

But in the mean time, how do we get ever yone's rate of aging down so

that when we're able to achi eve long evity, uh, escape velo city, that we can

then lower that cost for ever yone and make it appl icable to ever yone.

So what are those thin gs?

So that, that really invo lves, okay, how do we reduce rates of basi cally obli

terate card iova scular dise ase?

How do we really get good at dete cting cancer early?

Not just from a mort ality rate bene fit, but from a func tional bene fit.

If you catch cancer later, it's more chem othe rapy you have, that's more radi ation,

more bigger surg ical inte rven tion.

So how do we lower those?

Um, how do we impr ove peop le's meta bolic heal th?

How do we decr ease peop le's syst emic infl amma tion?

How do we make sure that people aren't atro phyi ng, that their bone dens ity

is good, that their muscle mass is good?

Um, and how do we help people with mental heal th?

Beca use it's rela ted to all of those other dise ase proc esses that, that

most of those things are what Bria n's talk ing about.

It's, it's the sleep, the nutr ition, the exer cise really comp resses the, the rate

at which people are aging.

It's not just about the rate at which you're aging thou gh.

It's about your func tional capa city beca use living a long time or long evity

is just living a long time.

Yeah.

Right.

But it's living a long time.

Well, doing the things that you want to do late into your life.

And that means it, the more func tional you are, the longer you're going to live.

Right.

And so how do we do that and make that atta inable for ever yone while

Brian is plan ning on land ing on the moon?

Yeah.

Right.

And so once we can get him to the point where he's land ing on the

moon, then, okay, let's look back as a soci ety, as huma nity and say, we, about

your func tional capa city beca use living a long time or long evity is just

living a long time yeah right but it's living a long time well doing the things

that you want to do late into your life and that means it the more func

tional you are the longer you're gonna live right and so how do we do that

and make that atta inable for ever yone while brian is plan ning on land ing

on the moon yeah right and so once we can get him to the point where

he's land ing on the moon then okay let's look back as a soci ety as huma

nity and say we've achi eved this now how do we make it go to ever

ybody yeah let's talk about land ing on the moon so how do you decide uh

what next for brian in terms of like the reve rsing uh aging ther apies yeah

that's hard um beca use ther e's a lot of things avai lable and i think

it is slowly um this is happ ening so fast yeah um and ther e's

people that are it's really inte rest ing beca use i have pati ents still

that i spec ific ally take care of outs ide of brian and we people are

brin ging me stuff cons tantly it's sift ing thro ugh all that of what where

the evid ence is good and where it's not so good ai is actu ally really

help ful for this like on what the next steps are we can list out ideas

and then have data scie ntists help us say like okay is the evid ence for

what ever bench inte rven tion so spicy foods right what's the evid ence right now

like i can know some of that i can't know all of it mike mallon can't

know all of it we come up with lists we say okay this looks like a

good inte rven tion people bring us stuff i read stuff other doct ors do we

get a list we boil it down and say okay let's try this let's look at

all the data around what ever inte rven tion is so we'll use spicy food let's

look at all the data that exists and then what are the mark ers we can

check okay what it was what can we look at pre and post inte rven tion

and are there other things that we're not thin king of well what are the other

risks and and then do the expe riment the grea test end of one expe riment

in human hist ory and and then let's let's see what happ ens um and ther

e's always pote ntial down sides but like how do we miti gate those down sides

to make it towa rds very low risk okay great uh thank you so much for

your time uh dr sager uh it's great uh talk ing to you yes it's wond

erful thank you this 就是我與 bria nt以及 他的醫生 訪談的全 部內容了 正如br iant 多次強調 的那樣在 所有抗衰 路径中真

正被反复 驗證也最 具普世性 的仍然是 良好的睡 眠饮食與 運動習慣 以及稳定 而健康的 人際關係 與此同時 一些更為 激進尚未 經過大規模 长期安全 性验证的

抗衰尝试 ,也伴随 着明显的 不确定性。

Bria n自身的 一些探索 案例恰恰 提醒我们 ,这些前 沿手段并 非没有代价 ,也并不 适合被简 单复制。

至于Bl uepr int所 描述的未来 ,一个融 合生活方 式管理 ,生物标 志物监测 ,医学干 预与个性 化健康方 案的系统 ,其科学 性与可复 制性仍有

待时间和 更多验证。

它究竟能 否推动人 类健康边界 ,还需要 持续观察。

但可以确 定的是 ,随着A I技术和 生命科学 的快速发展 ,关于衰 老的理解 正在被重塑。

这场探索 仍在进行中 ,而真正 成熟可靠 的突破 ,或许正 是在这样 的尝试与 质疑中逐 渐成型。

这就是本 期视频的 全部内容了。

听完Br ian John son的 抗衰实践 和商业规划 ,不知道 你有什么 想法?

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