Hannah Einbinder on Rising Fame, Hacks, Teenage Sex and Death at Camp Miasma and More

- This is "The Run-Through."

I'm Chloe Malle, and I am here today with actor and comedian Hannah Einbinder.

Hannah is having her biggest year yet.

- Whoa. - Whoa.

- I'm scared.

- [Chloe] I got the chance to speak to her ahead of the premiere of "Teenage Sex and Death at Camp Miasma," which is the third film from director Jane Schoenbrun in which Hannah plays Kris, a young queer director who is working on a revival of a slasher horror franchise.

Opposite Hannah is none other than beloved friend of the pod, Gillian Anderson.

- Heard of her.

- It's one of my favorite Gillian roles I've ever seen.

It's a great Norma Desmond vibe. [laughing]

So you're fully, like identify as Los Angeleno.

- Of course. - There's no ambiguity.

- Oh, none at all.

Yeah. I don't identify as an American.

I identify as an Angelino.

Like I pledge allegiance to the United States of Los Angeles.

Like just to be clear, it's like I'm not with that whole thing.

I'm like LA till I die.

- Interesting. - Yeah.

- Is the rest of your family like that?

- My mom is second generation LA. I'm third.

- Interesting.

- My dad is from Philly, but he grew up Philly-California, 'cause my dad's mom came out as a lesbian when he was six months old in 1962, and she moved out to Cali, so he was Philly-Cali.

But the reason I'm an Eagles sports fan is because of the Philly aspect, so he could connect with his father through Philadelphia sports, and then that became a connection point for us, and so on and so forth.

But yes, LA is my shit.

- Wow.

Where do you live now? What neighborhood?

- I can't really disclose. No, I'm kidding.

I live on the East Side.

- That also has been a real... - I got ops.

We can't say specifically where.

- That's been a big difference for me, is like I feel like all of my friends growing up now fully live on the East Side.

Their entire world is on the East Side.

- [Hannah] For sure.

- And so to me, it does slightly feel like I visit a different LA when I go now.

- I love LA from the tip to the tail.

- I'm very happy to visit. - Yep.

- And then very happy to leave.

- And that's how I feel about New York, and I say that with respect, you know what I mean?

- What neighborhood do you like to stay in when you're in New York?

- You know what? Can I say something?

- None at all?

- Are you ready for this? Red Hook.

- Wow. - Yeah.

- You don't see that coming a lot from visitors.

- Red Hook is really cool. - It is really cool.

- Red Hook is really cool.

It's a bit hard to get to, obviously.

- It is, but I think that's kept it feeling separate.

- Well, that's why I like it as an Angelino, 'cause it's just not that crazy chaotic.

It's just a frequency thing energetically-wise.

Like I just, I'm low and slow. You know what I mean?

- I want to hear about what you're gonna wear to the premiere of...

By the way, all the producers wanna kill me because I cannot get the name of this movie right.

- You got this. You got this.

- "Teenage Sex and Death at Camp Miasma."

- You got it. - But I keep flipping words.

I keep saying it's "Sex and Miasma," and there's a lot happening.

But so I want to know what you're wearing for the premiere and if you're gonna method dress and wear something bloody.

- So that's really...

Thank you for asking.

I haven't nailed down the look exactly quite yet, but I am gonna get a manicure by this incredible artist, Instagram Claws by Joy, and Joy does like these really intricate artistic manicures, and I think my nails will be some sort of blooded...

- Ooh, I love that.

- Metal, like some crazy alternative like thing as a nod to the film.

So that I think I'm definitely...

I have my...

She lives in New York here, so I'm gonna go see her.

- Oh my God. Are you here until the premiere?

- I am not.

I'm gonna be here and then we're going to go to Portland, kind of like a fan screening.

We've just been kind of touring, Jane and I, across the nation and world, I guess.

And then LA and then...

- Wow. And then back here?. - Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

- Wow. - Yeah.

- What does a tour like that entail travel-wise for you?

Like, do you have things that...

Like what's on Hannah's rider for a nice travel experience?

- Oh shit. Water in glass.

- But I mean, if you're traveling a lot like that, like crisscrossing the country, are you doing certain things like health-wise?

- [Hannah] Oh, yeah.

- Are you wearing compression socks?

- [Hannah] Oh shit.

- Like what is getting you through that?

- Damn.

I'm realizing I should be doing that in this conversation, but that's good, 'cause there' still time.

- Yes, there is time. - And I can make a correction.

No, I actually I have a little lavender essential oil.

That's important for me.

Have a heating pad, okay, you know? Little soothing thing.

You know, I got- - These are the things I'm wondering about.

- aches and pains.

I do a little like eye patch.

I got my Tower 28. You know what I'm saying?

- What is that?

- That's like a hypochlorous acid spray.

It's just to kind of like hydrate, and, you know, take away the dirt from any of the various encounters with the dirt.

- The dirt. - The Dirt.

Capital T-D, the dirt.

I feel like I'm playing with fire, 'cause, you know, I've been on the pills like everybody else since I was like fuckin' 16 or whatever, and I'm just like, I've been smoking, and like it's just you're not supposed to do that.

You shouldn't do that.

- There's too many things we shouldn't be doing.

- Oh God, but then it's like you got a fuckin' microplastic credit card's worth of plastic in your brain every week or some shit they're fucking saying.

- I know. I saw that.

I wonder how they know, but I do trust the greater...

- I guess the autopsy, sort of the medical...

- The internet. - Yes. Me to the internet.

Totally.

- I want to know what your horror diet was before taking on this project.

Like, or are you a horror slasher girly?

- You know what I would say is that slasher was the only blind spot I had in the subgenre.

Like the slasher subgenre was the only blind spot that I had.

I really like kind of like the John Carpenter, Stephen King stuff.

Like those adaptations are cool to me.

I like comedy horror, so amazing.

You know, "What We Do in the Shadows," the original movie, and there's this movie "Housebound" I love, like the supernatural stuff, and then like the "Saw" stuff.

Like I do like a good variety of horror.

- What's the most scared you've ever been in a movie?

- Oh, gotta be "Silent Hill."

- [Chloe] Oh, I don't even know what that is.

- "Silent Hill" is from 2006.

I saw it when I was a kid and I revisited it recently.

It was, I think, the first horror movie that I saw, and the scariest, because it's based on a video game and it's a really beautiful adaptation and...

- Oof, not for me.

- Yeah. [laughing] Pass.

- Oh my God, I saw "The Odyssey" on Friday, and I was like so stressed the whole time.

- Oh my God. Yeah, that's...

- It's just a lot of the cyclops is getting stabbed, and I felt bad for the cyclops.

- Oh. That's cute.

- I had cyclops empathy, and then all the...

Yeah, it's just a lot of killing, a lot of blood.

- You're not into the...

You don't like that.

- No, I was watching a Scooby-Doo last night with my kids, and I was like screaming at these monsters.

- Really?

- I was like, "This is too much for me. "

- Oh my God. Okay, interesting.

- Shaggy got shocked by a monster who came out of nowhere.

I was like squealing.

- Do your kids mind it?

- My son is obsessed with horror.

He's six, so he's seen nothing, but he just knows it's an exciting thing he wants to be part of, and it shan't be with me.

- No, totally. - Is all I have.

- Okay. That's sweet.

- So yes, I was really watching this with my sweater over my head.

- Shit. Yeah.

I mean, I get that feeling too, but I think, I mean, like, I see a huge link between comedy and horror.

I think that it kind of creates like the same thing in the body.

- Oh, that's interesting.

- This buildup of tension with this like big release.

And so like I feel like I kind of connect to that.

Obviously like one can enjoy one without the other for sure, but I just see...

I think that's why you see so many comedians go in that direction.

Like you look at a Jordan Peele and you're like, "That to me makes so, so much sense."

- Interesting. - Yeah.

Like Jane has a comedy background.

- Really?

- Yeah, Jane did like sketch comedy in UCB like back back back in the day, and, I mean, to me, the movie is like comedic horror.

- [Chloe] Totally.

- It's more of a comedy than it is a horror film in my opinion.

I don't really spend time trying to like say what it is.

It's like kind of beyond genre.

- It is hard to describe it as a genre, 'cause I feel like some things I read described it as slasher horror and other described it as like horror comedy, and you can sort of make the argument for either.

Were you familiar with Jane Schoenbrun's, the director's work before this?

- Yeah, yeah.

I had seen "TV Glow" in the theater, and then when I found out that I was meeting with Jane I revisited it and the first feature, "World's Fair," and like very quickly I understood, like, oh, these stories are like, especially "TV Glow" and "Miasma," are like very deeply personal allegories for their experience in transness, transition,

and just like emotionally in a general sense, so.

- Well, you play Kris, who I feel like is a stand-in in some ways for Jane in this kind of, if we take an autofiction approach to it, and I feel like in some of the early screenings, Jane really owned that and said that that was very inspired by their experience.

Did you feel like you looked to Jane for working on that?

- Yeah, I definitely tried to absorb some of Jane's like mannerisms, and frankly like more so than just like the way that the character presents in their, you know, affects and the physicality and the wardrobe and all of these things that felt like they needed to be kind of like similar to Jane, but also like a third thing.

There are various like emotional themes explored in the film that are true to their experience, and I honestly found through our conversations true to mine.

We just had such extensive conversations while we were on set and beforehand about like very intimate things that, you know, you kind of don't talk about maybe.

- Interesting. Like what?

- You know, like sort of generally what the film explores is like the feeling of dissociation during sex, relative to sex, like kind of just, you know, coming into your body, leaving your mind, and just like the block that certain people have.

And like the journey of the film in many ways is like about like the liberation from shame.

And so like just having discussions about like what that meant to us in our personal lives, and Jane was very, you know, vulnerable with me, and I in turn, you know, was also vulnerable with them.

And now kind of like the way I'm talking about it is being like, yeah, like I definitely feel like, you know, many of us really have not taken the time to examine how true that is, and how universal it is, and how there should be an alternative, and there is an alternative, especially, I think, when...

And this is, you know, it doesn't matter, you know, what your gender is.

I think like there's definitely though like these performances that men and women are expected to play, you know, during sex, and so yeah, sometimes that performance overtakes like real presence, and you're not really like a part of it, and it's just this rote, you know, sort of thing.

But yeah, so we just had a lot of conversations that I had to kind of go like, "Wow, okay, a lot of this is true for me, and I'm gonna like kind of work through it alongside the character," you know, so.

- What was the experience of being at Cannes like?

Was that your first time going to Cannes?

- Yeah.

- Stressful dressing-wise. - Holy shit.

- A lot of rules, a lot of big moments.

- [Hannah] Yeah.

- I loved your Celine look. - Oh, thank you.

- Also, another mock turtleneck, the Eliya look had like a...

- Yeah. - Yeah. Okay.

How did you approach what you were gonna wear for Cannes?

- Well, I mean, I think that like what Jamie and I were talking about was...

- Jamie Mizrahi. - Yes.

And I think she was like, "I think you're so exposed in the film in this way, and so it's like nice to create this juxtaposition of something like more refined just to create like this more well-rounded, balanced image," and I think that that's like really interesting.

And also like we just wanted something that more than anything felt really classic.

- Did you go to camp as a kid?

'Cause I also liked this as a sort of creepy camp film.

- Yeah, I went to Ramah for like a two-week session, which is a Jewish summer camp, and then I went to this camp in New Milford, Connecticut called Buck's Rock.

- Oh my God. I know it well. - Okay. Wait, how?

- That's so fun.

We have a house near New Milford, and so I'm up there a lot, but also Diane von Furstenberg's granddaughter now runs it.

- Oh, wow.

- So yes, I hear a lot about Buck's Rock, and I feel like I might want to send my kids there at some point.

- Oh, Buck's Rock rocks hard.

It was so random, and I was so scared to go, but it was so cool.

It was kind of like this...

It felt kind of co-op-y in a way.

And there was like, you could work on the animal farm, there was like a clowning class, there was dance.

There was like, you know, all the sports you could want to, you know, ever want to do, metal shop, glass blowing, like theater.

It was so like wide-ranging, and there was something for everyone, and I really enjoyed it.

- Wow. - It was really cool. Yeah.

- I was also very intrigued that this was more of a romantic, erotic film than we'd seen from "Hacks," for sure.

- Totally.

- Well, the sex in "Hacks" is funny.

- It's so funny.

- It's always funny, which is great.

- The magician sex worker is one of my favorite storylines.

I talk about that all the time. [laughing]

- Thank you. We love it.

That shit is so funny.

- Because my son also wants to be a magician.

I'm like, "This isn't very good."

- You're like, "Please, horror. Please."

"Oh, actually, here's more blood, honey."

You're like, "Give me the cards. Back away from the wand."

- We stumbled upon an adult magician just like in the street, like doing tricks, and I was like, "We gotta go."

- Herding him away like it's a demon.

Oh my God. I want to say shout-out to a couple musicians.

Penn...

Musicians, totally. Penn and Teller, they're on the road.

No, magicians. Sorry. [laughing]

- I was like, "This is a hard pivot." [laughing]

- Imagine. Okay, sorry, one second.

I want to say shout-out to a couple musicians.

Paul McCartney, what is up out there?

Whoo, Ringo Starr, peace and love. No.

- Everyone at Taylor Swift's wedding.

- Yes, guest list. No.

Yeah, Penn and Teller.

- No, I'm into magic at a high level.

- Thank you. No, exactly.

By the way, it's like improv comedy.

It's like, "You better be amazing, doll, 'cause you're really upsetting me if you're not."

You know what I'm saying? Like standup comedy.

These are...

Standup, improv, magic, like, this is like a...

Yes, I'm putting magicians in with standup comedians.

Sorry guys.

- Who are magicians in their own way.

- Yeah, totally. Totally.

Yeah, I would just say you got to be on the highest, highest, highest level, or you're making me sad.

You're making me scared and you're making me sad.

- I think that's fair. Or scared.

- Yep, you're frightening me.

- Oh my gosh. And I just read about your Reiki session.

- Oh shit. - That allowed you to scream.

- Oh!

- And I'm like, "Do I need to do Reiki?"

- Yeah, yeah. Yes. - Really?

- You actually need to go to the specific person that I went to, yeah.

- Wow. - Yeah, yeah.

- What other weird healing things are you up to?

- Honestly, that, I don't even know if I'm...

I think that would be it.

Like honestly, I haven't...

I wouldn't say I'm like really like deep into that.

I just like, my friend Emma, she has like, she's eight hours away from her Reiki certification, and she...

and she...

- We love to hear that for Emma.

- Come on, Em. Let's get there, doll.

No, I'm kidding.

No, no, no. She can fully do it.

She did it on her girlfriend the other night, and she was like, "It worked."

So like she doesn't need those eight hours.

You know what I'm saying. - Amazing. Okay.

- Anyway, so she sent me to the girl, the woman, excuse me, who she studied under, and it was transformative.

It was unbelievable.

- Okay, someone actually invited me...

What do you call a Reiki practitioner? A Reikiist?

- A healer. - Okay, just a healer.

- I would say, not Reikiist. Yeah.

- Now I'm inspired.

- Yeah. I really, I have to say, like, I think I just was...

When I get angry, or in the past, like when I've been angry, like, I just like get very serious and low and...

Like, I wouldn't like let it out, you know what I mean?

Like, that was just like a block for me.

Or when I would get angry, I would just cry.

I would get sad. It would just turn right into sadness.

- [Chloe] Interesting.

- I wasn't exercising like volume, which is a really cathartic thing to feel moved through the body, yeah.

- Yeah, I feel like my colleagues and family would say I don't have a volume problem, but...

Nevertheless.

- No Reiki for you. Okay, we're good.

We're good over here.

- I'm sort of jealous, in awe, that two of your first co-stars are Jean Smart and Gillian Anderson.

- Yeah, this is my last life, for sure.

- Truly. - Yeah.

- What would you say is one lesson you've learned from each of them?

- You know, the thing that like sticks out for me with Jean is like, yeah, she's obviously like the best actress, she's the funniest woman alive, she's like incredibly talented, but the thing that I learned from her, and I think we share this, but like it really cemented that this is the only way to be, and like this is like how you like lead,

is that she's so warm, and she embraces everybody, and she literally has one of the grips in her arms. Like she's just like stroking the...

Like she's so loving, so maternal.

She cares about bringing everybody together and the vibe on set.

Like she just like...

- She sets the tone? - She does.

So Jean, like I've learned everything from her, you know?

- We had her on the podcast, and I asked her if she had learned about Gen Z culture from you and if she felt more culturally current, and she said, "I'm definitely more woke thanks to Ms. Einbinder."

- You know, I do what I can.

- Do people confuse you a lot or conflate you with Ava?

- Yeah, I think there's a ton of similarities between us.

- Okay. - For sure.

The ways in which we're different, like I think on paper we have a ton of similarities.

I think we just like have different levels of perhaps like self-awareness.

I also think Ava's kind of like a bulldozer.

Like she has like this kind of like intensity at times.

Like I feel like I'm a little more, yeah, just like low, slow, laid back, although I have definitely imbued her with that affect for sure.

We've become more similar.

Like I think we started in a place where I was like, "Oh gosh, like this is really hard to like find a way to..."

She was, you know, in Deborah's words, I think she just like kind of, you know, got plucked off the internet at like 24 and was just like kind of entitled a little.

She learned the value of hard work. You know what I mean?

I think like coming into that role I had been like grinding as a standup comedian on the road.

Like, you know what I mean?

Like I just was like so relentless in my work ethic, and I think Ava was just like a gifted person who like, you know, she just like, yeah, got a job really quick.

And so I think there is like kind of this level of like maybe, yeah, just humility that has like kind of grown in her over the course of, you know, her relationship with Deborah.

And so I think we've become more similar, but I think like it was less true initially perhaps.

- What was the biggest change for you?

Because I feel like you were really doing, as you say, sort of relentless standup comedy.

You were pushing, doing sort of the work that everyone was doing when they're a working standup comedian.

What has been the biggest shift to suddenly being at the Emmys and having people identify you as Ava Daniels?

Like has that fame switch changed the way that you feel like you have to navigate the world?

- So this is something I've been thinking about a lot lately because I'm doing a lot of press right now, and so I feel like the most visible that I ever have been.

I have been thinking about like being kind of like a music festival kid.

I was like early Coachella, before it was like two weekends, before it was like fuckin' the H&M tent or whatever.

You know what I mean?

It was like chill and like an art installation, a heavy festival.

It was independent, really cool.

- What was the first year you went to Coachella?

- I want to say 2008. - Wow.

- Yeah. - How old were you?

- I was in eighth grade. - Oh my God.

- Yeah, yeah. - Who'd you go with?

- My mom. My mom like loves electronic music.

So she was like, "I found this cool festival."

She's so cool.

She was like, "I found this cool festival.

Like it's like pretty new, but like, you know, there's like an EDM tent."

- Oh my God. So just the two of you went?

- It was me, my mom, and my brother, Spike.

- Oh my gosh. - Yeah.

- And so like I would then go on, like in high school, like my girlfriends and I would go, and I just like remember this feeling of like loving those spaces because I felt completely invisible.

Even like just back then I just identified that feeling of being like, we're running in the night, and we're just like linking arms and like running through the crowd, and it's like so, it's just like free, you know?

I think the thing that I have found difficult is feeling a self-consciousness and perhaps like a bit of paranoia that I'm being watched.

It's not offending me. People are so warm, so warm.

I have the great fortune of having like people who identify me mostly being like lovely women, you know?

I'm like very fortunate that the people who come up to me are so sweet, and I'm happy to say, "What's up?" always.

It's just for me internally, it has created a- - It's different. - a paranoia.

And like a kind of like what's going down a little bit, that I just, yeah, I've just always really loved being invisible, and as a standup comedian, like I just want to like be a watcher, and like absorb and not have to think of like myself.

- The shift from being observer to observed is tricky.

- Yeah, yeah, it's just different.

It's like not totally, yeah, human, like or something.

I don't know. - I know.

- [Hannah] It's all good. Very lucky.

- I had, obviously in a very different way, but I was like changing my shoes on the subway the other day, and this like FIT student was like, "Are you Chloe? I'm such a fan."

I was like, "This is mortifying."

I'm like truly putting on flip-flops, and this poor girl.

- [Hannah] They're just like us, baby.

- I've ruined any impression she had of me.

- No. You made it real. - On the 1 Train.

- Get them dogs out on the 1.

Get 'em on out. Yes.

- Is there anything you've decided or sort of given yourself new rules of, "I'm not gonna share this with people.

I'm gonna keep this to myself, or I am purposely going to share these things."

Like are there...

I feel like I've been encouraged to undergo some media training myself because of things like that.

- Sister!

- What's the plan for what you're giving and what you're keeping?

- Great question.

Figuring that out as we speak, literally on the fly at all times.

No, I'm like, it's very...

So I'm like happy to break the fourth wall in this moment, right, because like it's so weird.

Like I will sit across from anyone no matter who the fuck they are and be completely honest.

I'm like, I am an open book, and I'm realizing it's like, "But are you an open book for all of planet Earth in perpetuity?"

You know what I mean?

It's like, it's so bizarre to be like, we are...

Like I actually don't feel like I'm holding back anything in our conversation, but like also it's like it's not just us here.

- [Chloe] No, it's not.

- And so that is like genuinely something that is hard for me to wrap my head around.

Because I don't know how to like...

It's weird. It's strange.

You're like, I'm connecting with you and talking to you, and like literally in this case thus far, I feel like it's like totally 100 million percent real, however, like, yeah, I do have to make those decisions of like, "Oh wait, am I like..."

I also have to be like careful with language and like really precise, because I don't want to...

You know, you got to be careful. So yeah, I don't know.

Maybe because I'm a standup comedian, I'm just used to like presenting my views and my opinions and like my perspective so it makes it easier.

But yeah, I don't know. I'm kind of figuring that out.

- I think it's also, it's hard to be asked to figure that out in real time, and I think that unfortunately is often the way it goes, because that's happening in real time.

It's not something you're anticipating and can be planning ahead, Unless you like go to the K-Pop Academy.

- Oh my God, if they sent me there, hilarious.

That's really funny.

- I'd watch that show.

- That's really literally hilarious actually.

- Oh my God, can you and Jean go to K-Pop Academy?

[Hannah laughing] - Oh my God, that's genuinely so funny. What do they...

Oh my God. No, 'cause...

- They teach them what not to say and what to say.

- I would take it too serious.

I'm like, "The choreo. Come on, guys.

It's a five and six. Can we start it over?"

Like I would be so psycho.

I've always had this dream of returning to the mat as a cheerleader and being like...

- Oh, yes, I want to talk about this.

- Okay.

- But what would you returning to the mat look like?

- A lot of tears. It would be like so...

I would be...

'Cause, [sighs] you know, it's like I took cheerleading so seriously.

It was my identity.

And like when I stopped cheering, I was literally like, "Who am I?"

Like true...

- What years are you cheering? I just find this astounding.

Like growing up in Westwood, going to Coachella.

- No, it's so crazy. - And yet...

- This is the power of film.

I saw "Bring It On," and I said, "Well, that's all." - "Bring it on."

- Bring it on. My life is different.

My life is different starting right now. That is my life.

There was one gym in Marina Del Rey, a co-ed gym, and like...

- It wasn't at Beverly Hills High?

- No, well, yes, eventually, which was like towards the end of my career, LOL. [laughing]

It was like, it was a competitive team, Angel City Athletics, LOL, and then I moved to an all-girls competitive gym in Pasadena called Victory Cheer Company.

You kind of have to go to like the areas where there's not a lot of stuff, which is kind of true for cheer all over the country.

It's kind of like, okay, we have football and cheer 'cause there's not a ton of stuff around.

You know what I mean?

And so I was, yeah, on this like all-girls competitive team.

It was so crazy and specific and like kind of bizarre.

It was like a lot of like evangelical Christian girls.

- Okay. - And me, of course.

And it was so intense and really, really rewarding, and it instilled like everything that I...

- And you had most difficult position, which like everyone relies...

Like you can ruin it for everyone.

- Of course. I was in the center of everything, like flying.

Yeah.

- You're the one who goes up at the top.

- Yeah. - Wow.

- Yeah. Yeah.

- Do you think that that affected your personality?

- 100 million percent. I have such a high personal standard.

I am like, "I cannot let down the team."

Like with Paul, Jen, and Lucia, with Jane, like when I have a director, I'm like, "This is my coach.

Like, I will be the perfect girl. I will succeed.

I will deliver. I will be prepared."

Like I have this like coach/star athletes thing.

- Did you watch the like Dallas Cow cheerleaders show?

- Yes. - And what was the other one?

- "Cheer." - Yes.

- [groans] So Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders, to me those are dancers.

No worries. - Okay.

- I just wouldn't use that word. No offense.

All good. They're incredible athletes.

I love what they do. - Very fair. Thank you.

- To me, just in my definition, I'm not really using the word "cheerleader."

No problem. All good, all good.

- I respect that, and I appreciate that fact check.

- It's totally fine. It's all good.

To me, cheer involves tumbling and stunting.

But like to me, cheer is not something that I associate with being about a male sports team at all.

Like I understand that that's a version of cheering for sure.

I understand that that is something that goes down.

To me cheerleading is a completely independent thing.

- It's its own entity.

- About the girls, about the guys who are, you know, performing the two minute and 47 second routine on the mat.

Like that is what it is.

I don't see it as like relative to like a male operation or entity.

- I find this fascinating. I too loved "Bring It On."

[Hannah laughing] What was...

What was...

I mean, do you ever wear any cheer-inspired fashion?

- Oh my God, interesting. I don't know if...

- Like what's your first fashion memory?

Is it connected to cheer?

- Oh, for certain, for certain.

- For certain. - Oh, for certain.

Oh, for certain.

And spread that, guys. Go ahead and run with that.

We can all start saying it and then I won't be the only one.

Okay. Yeah, no, I was very...

I mean, this could be like gay or fashion, but I was very into the skirts.

Like it's like, was I being gay or was I being into the fashion?

We don't know. Probably both.

- We may never know. - No problem.

At my elementary school, there was no cheer team, so I wrote a letter to the principal, and I was like, "We need a cheer team, and this is what I think the uniforms would look like."

And I did like little drawings of the uniform.

- You did fashion drawings of the cheer outfits?

- Yes. - Wow.

- Yes, green and white pleat skirt, the like sort of mimicking the "Bring It On," the Toros uniform has like this...

- Yes, has the V. - The V.

So I wanted to kind of pay homage to that in my design.

Thank you so much. - Great for Kiki's abs.

- Yep, yep. Oh my God, 100%.

And then yeah, but we were green and black and white.

And so it was a little bit of a rip of the Toros uniform, but just with our color scheme, but yeah, I think it turned out pretty good, so.

We ended up getting T-shirts, but no worries.

It's all good. Yeah.

- What was your first fashion show?

- Vuitton.

- What's the most fun location of a show you've ever gone to?

- The LV Cruise Show on Isola Bella, the beautiful island in Italy.

It was so cool, and actually the show was meant to be outside, but it rained.

- Oh, I remember. - And they moved it inside.

And I saw the video of the models walking the outside path, and it was stunning, but I just thought the inside of the building was so beautiful.

And I also thought it was like this beautiful display of like quick, innovative, you know?

- I know.

Whenever I see that, I think about the production team.

- Yes, but they killed it.

And it was so... - Yeah, no, I know.

- It was so good.

And like, yeah, I just yeah, Nicola has like taken me to so many amazing places.

It's so awesome.

- It's like being on the Vuitton airline trajectory.

- It's so crazy.

- The brands that travel with shows, it becomes in a way like travel agencies, because they are taking you on tours of the world in this crazy way. - Totally.

- Yeah, I mean, Paris is obviously divine and I'm always...

- But yeah, what's your version of Ava and Deborah's trip to Paris?

Who, I mean, you don't have to assist a suicide, but what best friend are you going on a trip with and where are you going?

- And we don't have to kill ourselves?

- And you don't die. - Okay. Amazing, amazing.

My best friend Ellie, who's my best friend from college, we've been threatening to go to Japan for so long, but we haven't made it happen.

It's just such a...

It's an undertaking. She works.

- We need Vuitton Cruise to get to Tokyo.

- Come on. Let's go.

But yeah, yeah, she and I really wanna go to Japan.

She's like my best friend, and she was the one who introduced me to Miyazaki, and like we just have such like a strong feeling about like basically Japan.

Cute culture is of course huge in Japan, cute culture, and Ellie, and her twin brother, and myself, and Ellie's sister, and Ellie's sister's fiance, and Ellie's and her brother's best friend from growing up have a group chat called Chicky Dumpling, wherein we send very cute things.

- What's the last thing you guys sent in Chicky Dumpling?

- The last thing we sent would have to be Jay, Ellie's twin brother, has a cat that has...

It's the squishy, the Scottish Fold cat.

- [Chloe] Yeah. I love Scottish Folds.

- And just kind of that cat doing anything is really impressive to us.

We're loving it.

- I always worry about their nasal passages, but yeah.

- [Hannah] Of course. Sort of the pug of cats.

- Yes, it's totally.

- We pray for them, we do, but yeah.

- I want to know where your Emmy is.

You won your first Emmy, what, nine months ago?

- Sure. Yeah, sure. - More than that? Yeah.

Where does it live?

- Okay, so I'm not trying to be like, "It's not out," you know, whatever, but like it's not out because my grandfather fought the Nazis in World War II and he received a Purple Heart, and he was a decorated war hero.

When he passed, we found all of his medals in a manila envelope in his bottom drawer, and so I kind of figure if like that guy's not putting his stuff out, like...

- Oh my God, you're hiding it?

- I mean, it's just a little...

- Because his Purple Heart was in a manila folder, your Emmy is in a closet.

- I just think it's like a little bit like, I don't know.

I feel like it's a little like, "Look at me."

Like isn't it a little... - No, fair.

- Kind of.

I just feel like I thought he was so swag for doing that.

Like I was like, "You're so swag. You're just like..."

- Yeah, yeah, yeah.

- It's not about that. You know what I mean?

Can I be real with you?

My real award is the friends I made along the way.

- You can't put them on the shelf.

- [Hannah] Look at that. No, it's true.

- Can't put them in a manila envelope.

- You got to be...

I'm winning an award every time I'm texting Jean, she's sending me a meme, you know what I mean?

- What memes is Jean sending?

- Oh my God, she's absolutely out of control.

She is out of control.

I wake up to minimum four, minimum four, in the...

Yep, Instagram, she's sending me Reels.

She's addicted to Reels. She's addicted full-blown.

- So is my mom. It's so funny.

- Full-blown addicted to reels.

- Wow. - Yes. She's sending me..

- What's the last reel or meme Jean sent you?

- You know what we were revisiting the other day?

She sent me one that was...

You know the potato masher, the tool?

- Yes.

- The meme is, "Me: I'm just gonna open this drawer," and then it's a picture of that, and it says, "The fuck you will," 'cause you can never open the drawer when it's in there.

And she loves that freaking thing. "The fuck you will."

It's unreal. She's unreal.

- I want to know what your cultural diet is right now.

What are you reading? What are you watching?

Have you seen "The Odyssey"?

- Okay, so I'm reading a lot of nonfiction always.

Right now I'm trying to return to fiction desperately.

I have picked up a book called "Mating."

Right now, like the stuff that I'm watching is like, I've been seeing a lot of stuff at the Laemmle in Glendale, so like a lot of like Art House.

There's this film that I saw called "Bouchra."

It's like really far out.

It's an animated sapphic furry universe.

- Furry? - Furry.

- Okay.

- Furry universe featuring like a main character who is a French Moroccan lesbian wolf, and the conversation style is very casual.

It's not like, it doesn't feel scripted at all.

- Okay.

- But there are all of these elements that are very distinct, and like it's really cool, and it's actually funny and quite sweet.

It feels like kind of "Sentimental Value" a little bit.

- [Hannah] Interesting. Okay.

- There's like a family story at the center of it.

I just saw that recently.

It kind of blew my freaking socks off to be honest with you.

- Wow. What Book did you bring with you on this trip?

- Angela Davis, "Freedom Is a Constant Struggle."

There's also this book that I picked up that I'm almost through with.

It's about, the protagonist is a non-binary mountain lion, not dissimilar to P-22, if you're familiar.

- Oh, I'm very familiar. A big fan - Of course as an LA head. - As an Angelino, of course.

- Who lives in like the Hollywood Hills and is...

- Wait, I just read about this. It sounds fab.

It was reviewed, I think, in "The New York Times Book Review" this weekend, and I was like, "What a wackadoo."

- Yes. That's pretty cool.

I've seen all the movies that are out.

- "Odyssey"? - Besides that. [laughing]

I've seen like, you know, "Jackass Forever," freaking "Backrooms," "Obsession," "The Invite." - I love "The Invite."

"The Invite." - I love "The Invite."

- Which I love so much. - It's so fabulous.

- Like holy S-H-I-T, hilarious shit right there.

So sweet and amazing.

- It was really fun and not awkward seeing that with Anna.

- Oh my God, really? I love your guys' dynamics.

- We're just Deborah and Ava.

- [screams] Oh my God. Oh my God.

Wait, that's so real.

Well, Deborah and Ava, that's a great...

There's nothing to media train.

Oh, oh, you have an intimate love and understanding for one another?

You bond over your shared art form?

- Want to prevent assisted suicide?

- You're like, "Don't do it. Don't do it."

- [Chloe] That's it for "The Run-Through."

See you on Thursday.

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