Inside Revolut’s Audi F1 Deal: “It’s Not Just Putting A Sticker On The Car” | Antoine Le Nel

F1 is a big commitment. It's not just putting a sticker on the car. The Audi

and Revolute brand identity, it felt very natural. If you look at Audi brand,

very natural. If you look at Audi brand, it's premium but relatable. Ferrari is

very premium. Aston Martin is very premium. But can you actually relate to

premium. But can you actually relate to Ferrari while Audi, it's an accessible luxury. We are very committed to design.

luxury. We are very committed to design.

It needs to fit. No offense, but what HP and Ferrari have done to their cars is not good from a design perspective. How

can you put blue on a red car? You know,

like this is not good. I think PSG is an amazing case study of how you build a brand. What they've done is quite

brand. What they've done is quite remarkable. They first brought a lot of

remarkable. They first brought a lot of very famous players. The players were bigger than the brand. And then they made a switch. They've just won the Champions League with assets that are not as marketable as what they were.

Even Dembele, who just got the Balandor, is nowhere near as marketable as Neymar, and Neymar never won the Balonor. From a

brand perspective, you were probably partnering with PSG for the players while you would partner today for the team.

Business of sport. Fascinating.

>> Antoine, thank you so much for joining us. Welcome to Business of Sport.

us. Welcome to Business of Sport.

>> Thank you for having me. Well,

>> it's so exciting for a couple of reasons. First, is this my first uh show

reasons. First, is this my first uh show in this new studio, which hopefully you will recognize and see is a massive upgrade of what we had before. Uh but

secondly, this is such a different show to something we've done before because we always sit on rights holder side or we speak to athletes and owners, but today we're going brand side. We're

going to where some of the big money is funneling into sport, helping a lot of these properties actually develop their propositions on the pitch. So it's it's the perfect place to start I guess just

to to go into the world of Revolute and the involvement in sport that you're increasingly having. Can you tell us a

increasingly having. Can you tell us a little bit about that >> on the journey? So,

so basically the way the way we've worked on our um marketing and growth journey probably started somewhere like five years ago uh where we started to

invest into uh into marketing where we realized that we had to invest more in the upper funnel on on the brand uh to help position the brand and help us open

the funnel uh grow grow into more more segments and build um credibility.

in in the market and associating ourselves to big IPs was important. So

the starting point was the uh NBA sponsorship where we were the presenting partner early in 24 and that was really

the moment where we realized what sport could do to revolute and um and from there we started to invest more and more into sport and we could see the

return on the investment that we were making and that was the starting point and the rest is history. What what was that first partnership like when you made that move and how did you reflect on that first relationship?

>> Yeah, so it was the NBA approaching us first. So we looked at it, it was we had

first. So we looked at it, it was we had never done anything of that scale and so on. So we were a bit hesitant at first.

on. So we were a bit hesitant at first.

Um but then we looked at what the opportunity would be, how we could um integrate our product, you know, into it, how we could associate our brand and

so on. We worked really hard in making

so on. We worked really hard in making it uh in making it work. um because it worked on so many layers. So first of all, we had the opportunity to manage more ticketing. you know, I think the

more ticketing. you know, I think the ticketing aspect and the product integration that we could offer um proved that this model between brand and

product was actually a great a great platform and then just the brand association was was was crazy, you know, because there's hardly any bigger brand

in sport than the NBA, you know, and and I think that really opened the door as well to more uh sponsorship because the day you demonstrate that you are able to

work with a franchise as big as the NBA where you can pretty much deliver anything you know after after that which which I think has been has been super powerful >> but if we're going to put a canvas down of sport I mean there's so much on there

how do you even start >> so no so it's not like this it's not like this so we didn't say we want to go into sport we said we have the NBA but like like the way we do a lot at

Revolute we had the NBA opportunity and we said okay let's give it a try let's see how it works let's see how the platform works and how we can build

around it. And then it worked and then

around it. And then it worked and then we said like okay now let's look at sport a little bit closer because it is actually a platform that can work for

us. So we did not come from a feeling

us. So we did not come from a feeling that we got to do sport. That was not that was never the plan. The plan was more to say we need to invest more in the brand. How do we invest more in the

the brand. How do we invest more in the brand? and and and and today we still

brand? and and and and today we still diversify a lot of our portfolio you know because we're talking about sport but we do a lot of music festivals as well we do a lot of airports that you may have seen and so on you know we do a

lot of TV out of home etc etc so we diversify our um our portfolio but sport is really a place where we are anchoring more and more our positioning at the

moment true >> how do you look at um evaluating the kind of success of some of these partnerships compared to maybe some of your other opport ounities that you can work with across the business.

>> So we're looking at it from there are two tiers if you want of two type of of of sponsorship that we're looking at. We

have the global ones and we have the local ones.

I think one of the big uh advantage of um of Revolute is that we are a global brand which means that we can invest into

global sports because it's really tricky you know global sport you know like all those Premier League clubs coming to me I have a huge audience in China and so it's like well good for you I mean like I'm not going to do anything with the

audience in China you know so and it's the same for many sports you know they always come with like oh we have two billion followers viewers and all of that.

>> It's my least favorite thing. It's like,

"Oh, we got so many social followers."

Like, doesn't mean they're fans.

>> Exactly. I mean, not only fans, but are they are they even my audience? And so,

it's like, well, good for you, you know, but if I only operate in France or in Italy and so on, like, well, I'm not going to do anything, you know, about it. So, I think one of the key

it. So, I think one of the key competitive advantage that Revolute has is that we are present in 39 markets and expanding quickly, you know. So that

gives us the opportunity to actually work with global IP and that is the core of the strategy saying that we versus our competitors because if you look at

our competitors whether they are traditional banks or fintech and so on the vast majority of them are super local you know I mean like in the UK we have very local competitors in France we

have very local competitors in Germany and so on. So they wouldn't be able to go into a global sport because if I mean we'll probably talk again about about

F1, but F1 is in 20 markets and out of those 20 markets I'm in 17 of them. So

that means I take the sponsorship and I can divide the sponsorship by 17. Well,

if you're only in the UK, why you divide it by one and suddenly it's a lot more expensive. And so that is really the the

expensive. And so that is really the the layer number one is being global to suddenly position ourselves to a completely different level compared to our competitors that can't afford uh to

be in that in that sport. So step one position ourselves as big brand global.

The other strategy is the local play because what I was saying is that yes all our competitors are local. So on one side I want to appear global to suddenly

appear in a different league but I still need to be locally culturally relevant and sport is a great way for us to be

super relevant at a local level and that you need to go a level below. You need

to go into some IPs and properties that are fundamentally local that can really deliver something that really speaks to the audience that is not just like

flying super high that is not necessarily super relatable because it's so the distance with me is is so high and so on you know and that's how for example we have this great sponsorship

with the statula you know the rugby club you know because then people can relate to that in in France and so on especially as well in the southwest with the region of France, you know, and then

you connect and that's that's how when the strategy we've had with sport um happened really with those those two layers, the global ones to differentiate ourselves and the local ones to localize.

>> So before we go on, what are you partnered with at the moment?

>> Yeah. So just give them a quick list.

>> All right. So if we start from the more the more global one, so the big one is obviously the Audi Revolute F1 team. Uh

so we are the naming partner. Uh so uh that means the team is uh is Audi Audi revolute. Uh so that is the big one.

revolute. Uh so that is the big one.

Then we have we're investing as well into football. So we have a Manchester

into football. So we have a Manchester City uh partnership that helps us both locally in in the UK as well as globally uh with with the footprint that

obviously the Man City brand has. We

have Komo uh which is the football club in uh in Italy you know that is is working really well both from a B2B and

B2C side. Uh we have the statuluza uh as

B2C side. Uh we have the statuluza uh as I was mentioning with um with the rugby team. We have the NBA. So this year the

team. We have the NBA. So this year the NBA is happening in London and Berlin.

So it used to be in France. Now it's

helping us to target as well different markets and there will be more announcement coming in the in the next few months.

>> Perfect. Just sets it up nicely and it also leads us into the big thing, right?

The biggest thing probably, you know, if you're talking about the rise of the sport over the last 10 years, one of the biggest sponsorship assets, one of the biggest cultural assets across sport, which is Formula 1, the fight I can only

imagine to be at the level that you've managed to get to now with the cars and the associations with the teams. this title sponsorship of Audi, how did it even come about when you are doing a

deal like this for a title sponsorship of a team? Can you tell us how it works?

>> Yeah, sure. So, it works in multiple ways. It starts with Audi reaching out

ways. It starts with Audi reaching out to us and us looking at the opportunity.

The thing is um it's you need to really quickly understand internally whether you want to enter the sport or

not because F1 is a big commitment.

Okay, F1 is not just putting a sticker on the car. It's a lot of activation.

It's a lot of work uh to be done to be done around it. So I think when when Audi reached out, it was really the moment where we were seriously looking at more opportunities and potentially go

tier one.

Um when we looked a little bit at um at at F1, you have so many levels of sponsorship that you can be in and it

became quite obvious to us that either you go very big or you go very small.

Being in the middle is very difficult.

is the it's a bit the death zone uh in in some ways that is that we believe for our brand was probably not appropriate.

>> Why is that? Because you don't end up being >> because either because when you're right at the top you get a lot of visibility that you can then really benefit from um while at the bottom you probably can get

some good product integration. So it's

easier to get the ROI from a smaller cost. Okay. So while when you're in the

cost. Okay. So while when you're in the middle you get high cost but you don't necessarily get the visibility that you might have at at the title partner level

you know. So then it was do we go very

you know. So then it was do we go very small or do we go very big. Then we did we did a bit um I mean we did extensive research and so on. We said now is the

moment especially when I looked at the coverage of F1 you know because now we I mean we launched just recently in Mexico you know for example we're in Brazil you know when the US which is a big priority

for us now there are three GPS in the US we know it's flying we're in Singapore we're in Japan we're in Australia uh we have plans to expand in the Middle East and so on. So I mean you look at the map

of F1 it overlaps almost perfectly with the map of with the map of Revolute um which is uh super important as well the home of F1 is Europe and the home of

Revolute is Europe you know so so the match was really really strong but then once you once you get into uh into the ideas of like okay I think I think we need to explore further this thing

there's there's something there you know there's something that potentially makes sense then you need to do your homework work saying okay so we want to go big we want to go big in F1 Audi is a great

opportunity but we got to understand the full uh landscape you need to be to we need to become knowledgeable you know about it it's not because you watch F1 every weekend that you're knowledgeable

about the world of F1 it's a very complex very complex world to uh to understand especially for for a brand to to activate so we spent months

understanding everything that was u that that was out there. We've done

everything without any agency by the way. We've done everything ourselves.

way. We've done everything ourselves.

You know, everything was only in direct discussions between us and the teams. It was which I think is very important to really grasp the opportunity to to the

higher extent. You need to be committed.

higher extent. You need to be committed.

You know, you need to talk to people whether it's within the teams, whether it's within the F1 organization, Liberty, etc., etc. You need to be across across across everything. Then

you start the conversations and then you look a little bit at where the teams are and where they want and where they want to go and how it matches with what we want what we want to be and

that's when the discussion with Audi got um got to a to a better place. Tell us

about what you and I were just talking about before we came on and the value of actually Audi as the brand being that like premium but relatable brand also having the history that it has in

broader automotive industry but also kind of being a challenger brand if you want in the world of Formula 1 coming in. Why why was that important and why

in. Why why was that important and why was that a really good relationship for you to build in F1?

>> Yeah, I mean that's why I mean Audi became the favorite choice very quickly. you know the the the the

very quickly. you know the the the the alignment uh happen um super quickly um first from a brand perspective if you

look at Audi brand it's premium but relatable Ferrari is very premium Aston Martin is very premium McLaren is very premium you know and so on but can you actually

relate to Ferrari it's very different while Audi you can really access it it's an accessible luxury in many ways I think there The brand identity, the

brand identity is very important. I

think Revolute, we are very committed to design. We are very committed to the

design. We are very committed to the user experience and so on. And it needs to fit, you know, with it. Uh no

offense, but I think what HP and Ferrari have done to their cars is not good from a design perspective. How can you put blue on a red car? You know, like this

is not good. Uh while I'd say big kudos to Mastercard and McLaren, I think that is a great branding thing, you know, >> Chrome as well.

>> Yeah, Chrome as well. I think what they've done with the wheel and so on, you know, so I think there are brands that are doing a really good job and I think that works well, you know, that works really well. And then when I look

at the Audi and Revolute brand identity, it felt very natural, you know. So, so

that's the first element. The second

element is the narrative. The narrative

is super important. Um, we at Revolute are here to disrupt banking and to win against uh incumbents and Audi is this, you know, Audi is

amazing from that perspective because they are entering a sport that is arguably the hardest sport uh on on the planet at the moment. They come from

uh from zero and they are building their car themselves, you know. It's not like Kadia who's buying the whole car and so on. Audi is building everything. The

on. Audi is building everything. The

whole chassis, the whole engine, the gearbox, the power unit, everything is made by themselves. Exactly like

Revolute. We build everything ourselves.

And we go from the ground and we build and we build up. And that's exactly what what Audi what Audi is doing. And then

when you look at it, they have a strong track record of winning as well. I mean

that's the way they won lemon that's the way they won in the world rally that's the way they won in Dakar and so on with a high level of innovation and they won against the incumbents that's what they

are trying to do today and that's what we are doing in our space so the the alignment was supernatural you know for us and then I think the important part as well is talking to the team I think

the team that we've been in touch with with Audi I mean like the stars were aligned you know we were working towards the same goal And it felt like such a natural sponsorship.

>> I'm guessing you can't tell me how expensive it is to >> nocome become a tit sponsor. I have to channel my inner Harry at some point. Um

>> no but like but you see the cost just I mean we can talk about the cost you know but like >> for us our as I was saying our competitive advantage is that I divide

the cost by 20.

So, so if you you can take the numbers, divide it by 20, and you see how much it's costing my UK team.

>> So, because I I I I basically distribute the cost across all my different markets and then I'm asking every market, you got to pay for that sponsorship. So,

everyone is paying a little bit, but then I mean like some markets, I mean, they're ready to put couple of millions, you know, here or there, you know, like imagine you're you're on the you'll be in Silverstone all over the thing, you

know, and so on. So you're ready to pay for that.

>> So once you've done the deal, what happens then? What's activation like?

happens then? What's activation like?

How are you integrating this into Audi as a brand and then obviously directly seeing the feedback for you as a business?

>> That's the depth of F1. The F1 is so deep. We talked about the depth from um

deep. We talked about the depth from um uh a geographic perspective. So I need to integrate everything at a local level, but as well from a product line

perspective because it's both a B2C and a B2B platform. And you can see it from the nature of the sponsors. You have

AWS, Workday, eta. You have a lot at you, you know, you have a lot of very B2B brands because it's a great B2B platform.

So at Revolute, we need to work on both those aspects. On the B2C side, it's

those aspects. On the B2C side, it's about how do I activate beyond the GP? So it's how do you put more media, you know, into it?

How do I uh manage some ticketing you know and offer perks to my customers money by experience in uh in in many ways we have um ref points which is um

the space where we manage all our lifestyle offering so we're going to put a lot of F1 into into this space so that people can actually access this which

was what um when I was discussing to the teams and telling them that we were unfortunately not working with us they thanked me for entering the support because that's the power of um of of

Revolute. In the same way that Netflix

Revolute. In the same way that Netflix is bringing F1 to hundreds of millions of people, we're bringing to 70 million people because that's our audience.

>> That's fascinating. So,

>> so we are a platform, you know, we're not we are we're a media platform in some ways, you know.

>> So, other teams that you were speaking to when you had that conversation, there was still that gratitude for the value that it brings. smart

>> because from you know because obviously a company like Revolute will activate probably a lot more the sport than Aramco >> you know like for the sport itself

having Revolute which is a very tech company super innovative et with a huge audience we are bringing the sport to to to the audience which is great >> and of course you know formula 1 is

something because of it system it fits more the American model where there's this kind of collective empowerment we all do better everyone does better um rather than if you look at something like an English football I want my

greatest rivals to do terribly. So being

a part of this collective group where it is the rising tide conversation.

>> Yeah.

>> But interestingly on that this has been something that has developed so much over the last 10 years. If we talk about the marketability and and the global exposure of Formula 1, >> if I had offered you a similar

opportunity 10 years ago, >> whether it was when you were king or let's say Revolute even now, >> would you have the same appetite or is this something that's been born out of the incredible work and and greater

exposure that Liberty's managed to drive through their ownership of Formula 1?

>> So, I think Liberty is doing a fantastic job. I think the sport has grown a lot.

job. I think the sport has grown a lot.

But let's remember that F1 has always been big. All right. Everyone remembers,

been big. All right. Everyone remembers,

you know, everyone remembers Malbor sponsor on whether it was a Ferrari or or a McLaren, you know, like still, you know, there are memories, you know, from

from before even from a sponsorship perspective. So it's not like it was so

perspective. So it's not like it was so it was a lot of tobacco brands. Yes. you

know, but like we do remember them, you know, and and they still benefiting today. The brand equity of those tobacco

today. The brand equity of those tobacco brands is coming from that past. So, it

was not a small sport, you know, and that's why I think the the the incredible um thing with this sport is that I think we're doing a great job in modernizing it, but it's still building

a lot on its legacy because it's really hard to take an IP from scratch and develop it without any legacy. And I

think that's what uh F1 has done really well. They've promoted their history,

well. They've promoted their history, you know, and their legacy a lot in keeping it evergreen, you know, it's evergreen while not denying what's in what's in the past. You know,

>> it was huge, but it was focused a little bit more focused than it was now. Your

fans your and for example, uh Louis Vuitton, >> right, LVMH as a whole, >> y >> I don't think would have invested in Formula 1 10 years ago.

>> Yeah, they would now.

>> Yep. and they're the ones that we're seeing across all the tracks is premium sponsorship, premium inventory.

>> I think what what has changed if I may is this sport and I think that's why as well Revolute has entered it is that

it's it's somehow at the border between sport and lifestyle. I think it's probably the sport that has the biggest lifestyle component and you can see it.

Um I mean I mean obviously Netflix is a big one but I mean when they film the the the driver's girlfriends and all of that. I mean there's a lot in the Daily

that. I mean there's a lot in the Daily Mail about Louis Hamilton and all of that. So whether you like it or not,

that. So whether you like it or not, it's it's part of the sport. It's

definitely part of the sport. And while

football is a little bit like that as well, I don't think it's to the extent of of Formula 1, you know, in the same way and I think the great example is

going to a GP. If you've attending the GP, you realize that you see nothing on the race. So you don't go to

the race. So you don't go to >> Yeah. you I mean because basically

>> Yeah. you I mean because basically you're either on one straight line or in a corner and so on and you just see the same thing and you anyway you got to see the screen to know who's first, who's not. I mean because you have no clue by

not. I mean because you have no clue by watching it. If you want to watch the

watching it. If you want to watch the sport, better be at home. It's much

better. You know, you you see much much better. But still, you have 400,000

better. But still, you have 400,000 people on every single GP to come and see it. Why? Because they want to feel

see it. Why? Because they want to feel the experience.

While when you go and watch football football game, yes, you can see the football game while you don't really see a GP when you go there. Because it's

part of this whole thing, you know, that F1 has managed to to build very much on lifestyle and experience. And one thing that the increased exposure Netflix as you said more entertainment product has

built really well is more access to the drivers. I mean I I think I was probably

drivers. I mean I I think I was probably like 10 before I realized what Michael Schumacker looked like because my relationship was with the helmet and the car and now you you know you can't I I know what they all look like. You

mention any driver's name and you can picture them if you follow it even even briefly. So that development has has

briefly. So that development has has given them a new opportunity. But we

were talking again briefly about the value of individuals and athletes as part of um as part of sports teams and their value then to brands. So when

you're looking at a Formula 1 team, >> we've this year I think next year it's still going to be um Gary Balletto and Nico Hulenberg as the drivers.

>> Yep. Absolutely.

>> What access do you get? Is that part of the deal where you can then work with them across the product? Are they

included in any package?

>> Yeah. Yeah. So what Yeah. So obviously I mean like Nikico being German uh and Germany being a market where uh we're probably uh have the most room to grow

in uh in uh in Europe and Brazil being a huge market for us. You know we have a tough competitor there and it's going to offer us a great platform you know for us to grow. I mean and as well F1 is a

huge thing in Brazil and Gabi is the only Brazilian on the grid. So that's

obviously a huge uh a huge asset uh for for us and we will leverage that asset to uh to its full to its full potential.

What is very interesting you see between F1 and the other sports is because of the stability in the grid uh both from a

team perspective and from a driver perspective you have a compounding effect of how the brand is building up

because in let's say football you have a lot of reshuffle all the time new I mean new players coming in new teams qualifying for Champions League and some not qualifying for Champions League and

so on. So you always have a little bit

so on. So you always have a little bit of a reset. you have a lot less reset in F1 which means you have this compounding effect year after year where you make

brands bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger which is very unique compared to any other sports because he's not being refreshed uh that that that often you know and if you see like

I mean Niko has been in the sport for I mean for more than like 10 15 years um Gabi now is is going to be here for the third for the third year and so on so so it's going to be it's going to be a big thing yeah

>> and tell Tell me about the importance in general of athletes and brand athletes when you're making some of these decisions. How do you look at it? Yeah.

decisions. How do you look at it? Yeah.

So, it's the combination of both. So, I

think the um the the badge, so the team IP is what gives you the stability and the and the reputation. I think it's very

important because it has more usually there's more authority in in the badge than in uh than in the player or the or or the driver. I think the I use more I

use the IP uh of the team more to set things at a global level um and the drivers or the players more at a local level. So to play more from a

local perspective and so on. So that's

more the way I look at it.

>> Can you give me the PSG analogy? It was

a really interesting look at the tussle that we see in lots of sports between brand and performance and if they come into conflict, how do you prioritize?

>> Yeah, I think PSD is I mean is an amazing case study of how you build a brand. I think what they've done is what

brand. I think what they've done is what they've done is quite remarkable in the sense that if you look at basically they

started 101 15 years ago uh when uh when QIA came into PSG they first brought a lot of very famous players I mean

whether it was Latam whether it was Beckham Salamos bit later was Messi Neymar and obviously Mbappe so what they

started to do is by building the brand through the players. the players were bigger than the brand and they kept on building this because little by little the brand started to catch up with the

players and then they make they made a switch not so long ago where the brand became bigger than the players and then

they kind of refocused the uh into team efficiency and you can see that they've just won the Champions League, they've just won the Balonor with assets that

are not as marketable as what what what they were, you know, like even Dembele um who just got the Bondor is nowhere near as marketable as what

Neymar and Neymar never won the Bondor.

Still Neymar a lot more marketable. So

if you look at from a brand perspective as a partner, you were probably partnering 5 10 years ago with PSG for the players while you would partner

today for the team. and the shift that they've made in building the brand through the players and then making that swap into then suddenly having the PSG

brand above uh the the player brand. I

think it's quite it's quite remarkable and now they've established an IP that is going to last for a very long time.

>> Is this a challenging environment then for a lot of sports organizations? We

can look at something like football. We

now have to maybe make a a decision between do we make the most money and make ourselves the most appealing from from a value perspective or do we win?

>> Yeah, it is a challenge. It all depends on what you want to do from from a brand perspective, but obviously what you're looking for is reach. You want to have reach and you want to have brand

alignment. It's as well how do you

alignment. It's as well how do you manage your risk? So when you build your business case and let's say you assume no one wins well you want the marketable one you know at least you know because

otherwise you get you get into the gambling business because as a brand am I here to gamble and bet on a team that is probably not as marketable but has a

chance to win. So of course if you win it's going to be great you know but like that's a that's a bet and we as a business we are not in the betting uh in the betting area you know so we can't

really do that. But do you think so it's interesting then do you think being a well having a direct association with Hamilton right now let's say versus having a relationship with McLaren using

this season as an example do you think it's >> I would rather be with McLaren you'd rather be with McLaren >> I would rather be with McLaren yeah I mean because they're winning and so on for for the brand I think it's much better as well I mean I think there's a

bit of drama around around Ferrari happening at the moment which is not very good for for the brands that are that that are there so you don't like noise you know when for when you're a brand, you know, you want you want very

um you want to take calculated risk and you want to control a little bit some of the things and you want don't want to have your brand been exposed.

>> How much do you have to consider risk when looking at something like Audi coming into the sport for all the good things about it?

>> We you know we don't know how >> exactly happens and how it performs and your brand closely tied to it. I mean

you know title sponsor now. Um how much of that decision-m process is is incorporating that risk? What what do you think are the biggest risks?

>> Yeah, it's a calculated risk. Obviously,

when you come with a brand new car, you don't know what the performance is going to be, but at the same time, you need to manage expectations, especially in the first seasons that we're building everything from scratch. And I think

expectations from the from the public is that F1 is super hard. So, you probably don't expect Audi to win uh to win next year. You know, I don't think we're

year. You know, I don't think we're going to win we're going to win next year. But then you look at the at the

year. But then you look at the at the plan, the road map we have and so on.

And the idea is to fight for for championship by 2030. And I think that's that's a good time horizon, you know, for for for us by by saying because

that's what we want to do as well, you know, we want to dominate the world of banking in the next uh in the next five years. you know, it's it's it's we have

years. you know, it's it's it's we have the same time frame and we know it's going to be hard for us, it's going to be hard for Audi and and that's what I mean by calculated risk is that you bet

into something that is extremely hard because the worst is imagine you decide to sponsor uh Real Madrid and then the next three season they win nothing.

That's an absolute disaster.

>> How long therefore do you look for if you're doing one of these deals? What do

you think is the optimal time to be able to achieve that and go I hate using the word but it's a bit of a journey right you got you got to grow with this team >> yeah because I mean I mean I think if

you and this is what I think is quite new as well for for Revolute um if you exit too early you will not

capture the benefit of of it so I think depending on the type of of sponsorship and obviously I mean with Audi because we're building everything. You got to be

a long-term uh partnership. Uh because

you don't want to be here, let's say, for the first two years where everything is just being built and there's no there's no performance, which makes sense and then suddenly the performance

comes later. Well, you've paid for

comes later. Well, you've paid for everything to build up, but you're not collecting the um the dividends in a way from from it. So I think depending on

what the road map of the team is I think justifies how long the um the uh the commitment is.

>> And with that then does your measurement of what success actually looks like?

Does that change? If you you have the scale of success, you have the betting in period and then you have hopefully full optimization. You win a world

full optimization. You win a world championship and in 2030 obviously you're getting the the McLaren exposure hopefully now.

>> Yeah. Yeah. So I mean you obviously focus on this compounding effect that you're expecting from the repetition. I

mean the repetition of the exposure and the association you know from from it will be will be super super important because we'll be there from day one.

we have the opportunity to become a generational sponsor because if we manage to really take the team to the top for a certain a long

period of time and so on, Revolute would have been there from day one. I think

this idea of building generational sponsorship, the ones that kids have on their in their room, you know, that's what we're aiming for and that requires

long-term commitment.

Tell us about then how you look at football. You mentioned Manchester City

football. You mentioned Manchester City being the partnership. I'd imagine now that you're in market and people know you're in market, you are inundated with people trying to access the Revolute brand.

>> How did you decide on Manchester City and Manchester City women in particular as that point for you to enter the market with?

>> Yeah. So, I mean, of course, we talked to a lot of uh football teams and so on.

I mean trying to understand uh you need to understand the market, you need to understand the opportunities uh and so on. I think with Manchester City uh first of all it's a great brand.

I think uh we're looking for some level of um uh innovation, some level of um forward looking and so on. And women

football in uh in in the UK is a huge thing. It's a huge thing. I mean you saw

thing. It's a huge thing. I mean you saw the Euro uh this this summer was absolutely fantastic. uh I mean the the

absolutely fantastic. uh I mean the the the the enthusiasm that all the fans were having and so on is showing that uh woman football has great great future

and and Man City is one of the best team from a woman football perspective. So I

think for us it's a great sponsorship because you get you get both worlds at once. You get Man City as a great brand

once. You get Man City as a great brand and you get women football which is a very progressive and uh and and sport

that is on the rise. So you get really the best of both worlds great IP and great and great sport which is uh very

um inspiring in in so many uh in so many ways. So for us it was a really great

ways. So for us it was a really great sponsorship which was quite unique. In

the same way, Komo is very unique at the same time, you know, because Komo is a new club uh in Italy, super lifestyle. The stadium is

by the Kumo Lake and so on. You got a lot of celebrity coming in. Um it's

really well managed and everything is makes it like such a a unique sponsorship in this in the world.

>> Why would tribal not be great for a brand like you?

You don't want to be divisive.

Uh I think you want to be um you want to be super inclusive in everything that you are uh that you that you're doing.

Um and and ultimately I don't think the uh I think you just need to be uh to be uh to be super careful with with those things. It's probably a conservative

things. It's probably a conservative approach that we have at the moment.

We've never really tried anything like that. So I think right now we just

that. So I think right now we just we just try to be as inclusive as possible.

>> So almost answering this question and therefore asking it backwards. Do you

think that's the value that women's football has over men's football from a brand perspective?

>> I mean honestly so I mean I go a lot with my kids uh in Barcelona. I mean we have an amazing team in in Barcelona. We

went to see the the classicalico the other day. Uh it's lovely. I mean

other day. Uh it's lovely. I mean

honestly it's lovely. It's the the quality of football is really strong. I

mean when you see Aitana playing and so on it's >> bad injury this >> yeah I mean but Alexa is is super strong as well but like I mean honestly the

quality of the show is is is is strong the experience is is is really good you know at at the moment. So you just got

to experience it. I mean, well, men football, I think there's nothing like men football in terms of getting you like really really I mean, it's amazing.

It's I love I love football, you know. I

love football. It's just that maybe for a brand, you need to be very selective and very careful about what you do.

>> And similar to the brand value that we've talked about for the male athletes, what about the brand value now that we have for the female athletes?

Um, I know you have, don't you Alex Greenwood as part of the Yep.

>> Man City deal as one of partners. How do

they um build that value? Where have you seen the the great work that they can do for you alongside? Obviously,

>> they are great ambassadors, you know, for us. So, we've leveraged we've

for us. So, we've leveraged we've leveraged the team and uh and and the players uh the level of uh recognition that those athletes have uh currently in

in the market is uh is astonishing. uh

and uh honestly the the gap the gap between uh uh men and women is uh is uh I mean is closing as we speak so it's really really exciting really exciting

>> what about the different kind of like assets I guess when you're going into these deals >> front of shirt is so well known let's say for football right but there's so much more now particularly as the game's developed and digitalization and media

and all of this >> what are the types of assets that you have the opportunities to >> so so for us it's what is very important. So, of course, you want um

important. So, of course, you want um the logo I mean as uh I mean being as present as possible, but I think for us where we've uh put a lot of emphasis is

on the product integration. Product

integration is critical. We've realized

that in in airports, you know, when we've took all the jet bridges in 18 airports, what we've done, we've put the logos, but then you have vending machines in the terminals where you can get the cards. That is a product

integration. And we're doing the same in

integration. And we're doing the same in sport. So we talked about the ticketing

sport. So we talked about the ticketing obviously I mean doing stuff on ticketing is important. Co-branded cards

as well is is super important. Um the

B2B integration you know is super important. For example we manage FX for

important. For example we manage FX for for KOMO you know. So when the transfers are processed through Revolute, you know, so so because we have great FX,

you know, so at the end of the day, we make them save money and so on and and you do this um we process payments as well. Ref pay is is integrated into uh

well. Ref pay is is integrated into uh into into this. So for example, with with Audi, all the Adidas merch, uh when you buy Adidas merch with Audi and so

on, it's processed through ref. So, so

you manage to integrate the product as deep as possible, you know, because not only you get some return investment, but as well people can experience Revolute

firsthand, you know, so so they're experiencing their um the the sport they're watching, but at the same time, Revolute is just here, and I think that's critical.

>> How do how do the ways that fans convert through your relationship with football assets changed to how you foresee them converting through Formula 1? Yeah, it's

pure well I mean you have a lot of hospitality you know so I think we're going to do a lot of uh B2B hospitality and so on and take that opportunity as

well to uh engage with some of our best B2B and enterprise clients you know and try to uh close as many deals as we as we can. I think that's uh that's on the

we can. I think that's uh that's on the B2B side >> on F1 >> on F1. Yeah. Yeah. Which is really powerful you know that's what all the big brands are are all are all doing. So

I think that's going to be very very I mean that's what all the big AWS and so on they're all activating you know through through through that. So we will demonstrate that Revolute as a product

has the ability to run an F1 team. So

once you can run an F1 team and you are you are a business here and so on like can probably run my business too you know and and using this this again

product integration if the whole team is is running on rival business well I mean then we can probably run a lot of businesses in a highly highly efficient way.

>> What do you think about something like stadium sponsorships and naming rights with the value they can bring especially when it comes down to product integration? Yeah, I think naming is uh

integration? Yeah, I think naming is uh naming is interesting. So, first of all, when you look at naming, you need to look at the the legacy of

the stadium. So, you probably need to

the stadium. So, you probably need to have a stadium that doesn't have too much legacy because that legacy will always be well at least at the beginning will be

stronger than your brand. So, you will struggle to overtake that that that legacy. You know, for example, if you

legacy. You know, for example, if you look at comp now, the comp now Spotify, is it going to be comp now Spotify or is it going to be comp now? It's tricky.

You know what I mean? While Emirates

Stadium, there's no there's no legacy in the Emirates Stadium. It was Emirates Stadium. It will always be the Emirates

Stadium. It will always be the Emirates Stadium, you know. Um so, so I think that's the first thing that you need to that you need to look at. Then as a

bank, you need to see how you can um run your product integration. So if you can manage payment across the whole stadium, if you can manage some some ticketing

etc etc I think is important. I think

the other thing you need to look at is how much the audience is being refreshed event after event.

So that's where football is not so good in some ways because you tend to have the same audience coming every weekend uh to the place while if you look at the

O2 Arena it's different audience when it's a Metallica concert or Lady Ga concert you know so it's very um you reshuffle a lot more the audience if

it's a concert venue versus if it's a if it's a sport venue but then you have sport venue that are that bring a lot of concert at the same time or that are

multisport and so on. So that can so it's uh uh I don't think you can just put a price on a stadium of 50,000 is

that much a stadium of I think it really it's really a case by case thing but why not? I'm I have nothing against it.

not? I'm I have nothing against it.

We've not we haven't done it uh yet. Uh

but um I can see where the business case is. I can see it. It's interesting

is. I can see it. It's interesting

because Tottenham, you know, have been in market, they have that incredible new stadium. I don't know if you've been,

stadium. I don't know if you've been, and I haven't pains me to say it as a Chelsea fan, but it is so impressive when you go in there. Um, and

>> it incorporates so many different businesses in one.

>> It's amazing experiential. Uh, they

have, you know, Formula 1 carting under the pitch. It's obviously an NFL stadium

the pitch. It's obviously an NFL stadium as well. They host concerts there. So,

as well. They host concerts there. So,

in my head, I'm looking at it and I'm going, you know, it's so interesting they actually haven't managed to nail that down because from what you said, you get a relatively good refreshing of people coming through the door because you got multi- >> Yeah.

>> entertainment properties that that do use it. You've got a brand new stadium,

use it. You've got a brand new stadium, so no one has an association with anything. You know, it's not it's not

anything. You know, it's not it's not White Hot Lane to the extent of the old one.

>> The Yeah. The challenge you have is that at that price point, you don't have that many brands that can afford it. Okay.

and uh because the price point is really high.

So uh the selection of brands that can afford going there is limited and many of them are getting more and more equipped because naming brand I mean

naming rights to you have more and more naming rights because if you add up all the front of shirt of football all the F1 sponsorship all the big all the big

um the big sponsors you know it's already a lot of properties uh and uh and brands that can afford that price tag, you don't have like a

hundred of them, you know. So, so I think I think at some point there's a high level of competition between all those properties to actually bring uh bring bring a partner. So, I think

that's a little bit the struggle you have.

>> You look at America, the biggest teams across those sports in general.

I Dodgers or Giants or you know pick any of those those top teams. >> Yep.

>> They will brand their stadiums. >> Yep.

>> Now you apply that here into the market.

Spotify camp. Now that's a unique example. If you're looking at, you know,

example. If you're looking at, you know, the the teams with heritage, you can I can only imagine what would happen if you turned around to Anfield and put a brand on it or Old Traffic.

>> Yeah. You can't you can't.

>> And that's again, you know, that's the interesting difference here. It almost

comes back to that revenue, commercialization, total value recognition versus the importance of heritage and legacy. Would

that be valuable for Liverpool and Man United? Absolutely. Man City, as you

United? Absolutely. Man City, as you said, you know, they're a different brand and they stand for different things. The Eti had is now synonymous.

things. The Eti had is now synonymous.

Airlines have been the big thing here.

I'm trying to, you'll know better than me, but even just trying to think a tech business, i.e. Spotify coming into

business, i.e. Spotify coming into Barcelona, that's that's very progressive.

>> Yep.

>> For Europe.

>> Yep. Yep. So,

>> it'll be interesting to see if there's a little bit more of that type of involvement from what we would class as tech brands, not >> legacy heritage brands that that are like airlines, that are like banks.

>> And I think the teams in Europe, they realize that they are very much aware of that. And I think that's why as well

that. And I think that's why as well they are very interested. That's why I talked to a lot of different teams. They are very interested in working with Revolute. You know, a brand like

Revolute. You know, a brand like Revolute is really good for them. It's

really, really good. you know, I mean, I think the work that Spotify is doing with um with with Barcelona is amazing.

I think the activations that they are doing, it's it's really world class. I

think >> what what about it is really >> So, so they use the front of shirt for example for a new release of new albums and stuff and so on. I think it's just

super cool. It's really it's it's

super cool. It's really it's it's there's no it's not rocket science, you know, but suddenly it makes as well every jersey collector because then they

sell them, you know. So people are now buying jersey for the sponsor.

>> We have the Rolling Stones one in the office. It's so it gets more comments

office. It's so it gets more comments than anything else.

>> Exactly. So they become collectibles and they become collectibles not because of the team but because of I think it's uh it's it's genius. Uh and and I think

that's what that's and I think it's it has a halo effect on Barca itself because suddenly it makes Barca a lot

more modern, a lot more innovative etc etc. And now they just signed Uber as um as as a sponsor as well. So suddenly you

get into a place with Basa that has big tech. The big tech are are working with

tech. The big tech are are working with are working with Basa which I think is is going to help and then they're having the super innovative comp now which hopefully will be finished at some point. It looks like it's taking a bit

point. It looks like it's taking a bit of time.

>> Yeah.

>> But like they're really repositioning the team. They have a super young team.

the team. They have a super young team.

they have tech sponsors, they will have best stadium in the world and so on. I

think they are doing a great job at that. They just need to fix their

that. They just need to fix their finance and all of that and then they'll be in an amazing place, you know, when you look at when you look in the future.

Um so so so you see this is where um teams don't select the sponsors only just for the money. they are really working. It's really working hand in

working. It's really working hand in hand and that's how we are working with all our um all our different teams. That's why we'd rather call it as a partnership rather than a sponsorship

because we actually help as well the team because it's the way you activate because when you work with oil companies etc etc yes they bring a lot of they bring a lot of money but how are they

going to really help the brand and the IP in making the IP even bigger and so on and that's where companies like Revolute will really help in doing that.

So it's a win-win thing. So so we work with them to leverage their IP. work

with us to leverage our IP.

>> Yeah, I was just thinking as you were saying that about what we've got now in Formula 1 for example because you do that shift you can actually see happening. You got Airwalks, you know,

happening. You got Airwalks, you know, involved with McLaren. We obviously

mentioned Google Chrome, the wheels, um you have Atlassian with Williams, you now will be Audi, >> you know, the the Petronises of the world and Mercedes where that may have

used to dominate along with booze and cigarettes.

>> Yeah.

>> You know, it's it's now moving into this side of >> Yep. of the world which is great because

>> Yep. of the world which is great because it does bring again the total value of the proposition up. It's not just a cash transaction. Exactly. Um which

transaction. Exactly. Um which

>> which is great. We just need some sports to follow.

>> Football is a little bit stuck at the moment with like Middle Eastern airlines. It's a lot of Middle Eastern

airlines. It's a lot of Middle Eastern airlines. The Paris is Kataw Bara I mean

airlines. The Paris is Kataw Bara I mean Real Madrid is Emirates. Um now Atletico Madrid is Riyad there and so on. So it's

like uh it's very u I think I I think the the the fans they probably want to see something else. They probably want to see something else.

>> But how do you break those cycles?

Because that is the hard bit, right? You

need to get people into those organizations that understand how to speak to a business like Revolute, not a team like Emirates.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Because I mean at the end of the day when you present um when you present a deal uh to to a team you have the money aspect but you have the

partnership aspect and the teams are looking at both. They're looking at okay fine this is the money okay I need the money you know to run to run my team but at the same time I have a long-term

strategy into developing my IP and each time they have a deal on the table they will compare the deals not just money to money they will look at the bigger

picture and try to understand okay how is that actually helping me um as well as you know the the sponsors the

partners have um have their say as uh in the sense when you are when you're the front of shirt of a team, you do have a say into who the team is going to

put on the sleeve because the the the best place is when those two brands between the front of shirt and the sleeves are complimementaryary and therefore are willing to work together

to build activations together and so on rather than being completely disconnected with nothing and nothing at all and so on. You know, in the same way, we are super excited to work with

Adidas on on on Audi F1. It's really

good. You know, I think there's a lot of uh of things that we can do that we can do together, which is great.

>> Being a bank, how important is age and that profile capturing people at the right time?

>> Yeah, I mean, of course, you need to look at your segment, at your audience.

Each sport has its own u own audience.

um whether it's more male focused or female focused that's why we liked as well F1 it's actually very balanced I think there is it's very spread by age

and by gender uh which is which is really strong but that but you can you can do different things you know like you should not have every partnership to

cover all your segments it's more how you build your portfolio in order to address your wide audience but that's why we look that I just don't look at sport to do that. That's why I do sport

and music festivals, you know, whether it's Premier Vera Sound, whether it's Seget, etc., etc., where we are the main the main the main partner there. But so

it's a portfolio strategy to make sure that when you put all the Lego together, you're actually spot on covering your whole your whole audience.

>> So is that where the value of rugby is?

>> Exactly. So rugby is great. So we are with with the with the statuluza um which is really helpful because it's a different it's a different audience.

It's a bit more B2B. It's a great B2B platform for example uh uh rugby a lot more a lot more than football.

>> Um >> in in one way just the fact that people you can give a really good experience on a >> Yeah. uh and as well the audience is

>> Yeah. uh and as well the audience is quite B2B uh and I mean and you can see as well that uh the demographic is slightly uh older unfortunately it's

basically the age of and the gender of decision makers you know uh it's a little bit like golf uh in a way golf is very B2B as well it's a great B2B

platform uh tennis as well somehow is a is a pretty good B2B platform you know compared to football with a lot more B2C uh from that from that perspective. So

you look at it from all that all that perspective.

>> So tell me then we've got all of this you've already achieved within sport and now you mentioned there's things coming on the horizon. I know you won't be able to speak specifically about them but where are we looking at developing

everything that we've talked about here.

How are you looking at the future of this side of the business?

So the future the the future of it is I think it's to continue expanding our um local penetration.

I think we're in 39 markets. I think we can be smart in uh doing things in uh in some in some markets. You have uh you

know you you you have markets that have their own u specific uh things. So for

example, I mean like whether it's in Greece or Lithuania, it's a basketball country, you know, in Poland, they love volleyball. Uh in Scandinavia, they love

volleyball. Uh in Scandinavia, they love hockey, you know. So you need you need to make sure you do things that are super relevant. And I think we can do

super relevant. And I think we can do more of as well deals. I think I think right now there's a lot of effort on the big one, the flagship one, but then it's

about how do you activate locally with some smart deals, you know, maybe not the ones that you will see all over your TV, you know, all the time and so on, but that actually locally would feel

ultra relevant. I think that's that's

ultra relevant. I think that's that's very interesting because the price tag is very different, but the way you activate it, etc., etc., I think can be can be super powerful. And now I have

like 39 markets to to cover. So, how do I get into uh into um into a deal that actually make makes sense?

>> And it sounds like a lot of fun. I mean,

we can't we can't deny it. This job must must be taking you to some pretty great things.

>> Yeah. Yeah, it's fun, but you need to be very uh uh very agnostic of things. You

need to be very rational >> uh and make sure you don't let your emotions speak. So, it's fun, but

emotions speak. So, it's fun, but actually I think it's killing the fun.

So I think it's from the outside people say ah you got the best job in the world and so on but because you need to always make rational decision about everything

each time I go to a game and so on I don't really look at the game I look at the business opportunity which is the exact opposite of what you go when you go watch sport you know before I mean

for me watching sport is actually doing the opposite than thinking about work >> it's not thinking about work it's about relaxing being with friends you having a beer and so on and just having fun. Now

it's the opposite like like I I can't watch sport without thinking about work which is so you think yeah I do a lot but then is it actually fun? It's

debatable. It's debatable.

>> You can still go and decompress watching Marseilles.

>> Uh yeah. Yeah. I love Mar.

>> Brilliant. Look on that note we I've loved it. Honestly this is fascinating.

loved it. Honestly this is fascinating.

We haven't, as I said, dived into this side of the industry properly from someone on your side of the table. So,

getting a little bit of an understanding about this, I know people will be so pleased, so relieved to hear us ask some different questions as well. So, thank

you so much for joining. So, so enjoyed it.

>> Thank you for having me.