Mel Robbins: The ‘Let Them Theory’ (A Life-Changing Hack That 15M People Can’t Stop Talking About)

every human being has a hardwired need

to be in control of everything there's

three things in your control Jay what

you think what you do or don't do and

how you process your emotions if you

Embrace this skill you're going to be

shocked this is by far one of the best

self hope books I've ever read your mind

and soul are in for a tree the queen of

grounded science fact personal

development Mel

Robin work has been seen as the number

one cause of stress you have a customer

that's really rude you lose a big

account you get passed over for

something as you notice the stress come

up Jay you're simply going to say let

them if you focus and try to manage

things that are never going to be within

your control it only creates stress

anxiety and frustration for you imagine

for every thought you had about that

person you had to pay them a dollar

that's how much energy time and money is

being wasted you have no idea right now

how much time and energy is being wasted

or drained because of other people's

behavior or your expectations about how

you wish things would go this is I think

my legacy I think that this is um the

thing I was supposed to figure out and

leave the

world the number one Health and Wellness

podcast J shett J shett the one the only

Jett

if you're struggling right now with

things you can't control this episode is

for you if you're someone who's

struggling at work and negative people

and toxic culture this episode's for you

if you're someone who's struggling with

your family members and your friends and

setting boundaries this episode's for

you so Mel where I want to start is work

has been seen as the number one cause of

stress you write about this in the book

in people's lives how can the let them

theory help people in the place that

causes them the most stress it's an

excellent question so first let me no

pun intended let me explain the theory

so in case you haven't bumped into this

online the theory is very simple it is a

mindset tool that instantly helps you

identify what's in your control and

what's not in your control the reason

why this is important is because any

psychologist will tell you that if you

focus and try to manage things that are

never going to be within your control

it only creates stress anxiety and

frustration for you when you take the

context of work there is so much inside

your day-to-day life at work that is

irritating it is stressful it is

annoying from the endless meetings and

no time to get work done to if you're

somebody that is working in a retail

store you're doing shift work you don't

have control over what shifts you get to

feeling like you don't have the chance

for promotion it is just endless and the

way that you're going going to use the

let them theory is anytime something is

happening at work that stresses you out

you have a customer that's really rude

you lose a big account you get passed

over for something your idea gets

dismissed in a work meeting as you

notice the stress come up Jay you're

simply going to say let them let my boss

be in a bad mood let my colleague take

credit let the uh customer like be rude

to me and here's the thing this sounds

almost like you're being a doormat and

you're being passive it's the exact

opposite when you say let them you're

recognizing that the situation right now

that has just happened has already

happened and that there is no reason to

allow it to stress you out when you

allow your boss's mood to stress you out

or make you nervous you're giving power

to your boss that they do not deserve

and so you're going to say let them when

you allow a customer that is rude or

inconsiderate to make you feel bad about

yourself or to make you upset or to

Rattle you you just gave this rude

person power over you when you say let

them something interesting happens first

of all you detach second you feel almost

Superior it's this weird thing because I

don't think this is the same thing as

saying let it go you're a very grounded

person Jay you strike me as the kind of

person that can let anything go me

whenever somebody would say to me Mel I

know I know it's not not fair what just

happened at work you got to let it go

I'd be like but I feel like I lost I

feel like I now have to be defeated I

feel more like a dorat if somebody tells

me to let something go what's the

difference between let it go and let

them for me when I say let them I get a

jolt of superiority because I'm like I

can see that my boss is kind of a jerk

and I'm just going to let them be a jerk

and I rise above it and I feel a little

judgy I mean if I'm being perfectly

honest I mean this is why people get

this tattooed on their bodies because

when you say the word let them or you

see it on your arm what happens is you

no longer allowed a rude colleague or

something frustrating at work to derail

your day you say let them and you rise

above it and you kind of go I see what's

happening here I'm going to allow this

without allowing it but then there's a

second par J and this is the most

important part and it's the part that

people do not tattoo on themselves

because it's the harder part and the

second part of this theory is saying to

yourself let me let me remind myself

that in life there are always three

things I can control that's where my

power is my power is not in managing my

boss or in trying to like deal with some

customer that just doesn't want to be in

an okay mood and doesn't want to be

calmed down they want to be right they

want to take it out on you so you're

going to let them but then you've

created this boundary you rise above I'm

going to just let you be upset here I'm

not going to let it impact me and then

you say let me

and what you're reminding yourself of is

there's three things in your control Jay

what you think next what you do or don't

do and oftentimes not doing something is

the more powerful

mood and how you process your

emotions those are the three things that

are always in your control and when you

say let me take responsibility right now

for how I'm going to respond to this and

the word responsibility after all is the

ability to respond right and so when you

say me and you remember I can think what

I want about this I can act in response

to this and I can process my emotions

and either allow them to rise and fall

and stay steady and calm or you know you

can certainly erupt if you want to but

why would you want to because then that

means you've given power to somebody

else why are we so distracted and

obsessed with things we can't control

I'm sure we all have a friend or know

someone

who knows they need to be working on

their business but they're talking about

the news they know they should be

writing their book but they're focused

on talking about politics they know they

should be building the next stage in

their career or whatever it may be

trying to get that promotion work

towards that next threshold or whatever

they're trying to achieve but they're

distracted by talking about all the

people all the things all the ideas that

they can do nothing about why are we so

addicted to it well I think there's two

reasons because your question is about

two different things one is why are we

focused on things we can't control and

the other one is sort of like why are we

distracted and they're they're

interconnected so let's just address the

issue of

control every human being has a

hardwired need to be in control of

everything because being in control is

what makes you feel safe so I need to

feel in control of my thoughts my

decisions my environment my future and

the problem is so do you but part of the

need for control Jay extends Beyond me

because if you're doing something that

makes me annoyed or irritated or worried

about you now I'm feeling a little

unsafe or worried because of what you're

doing and so now I'm going to want to

control you so that I feel better and so

it is a fundamental hardwired need

inside every human being you know to be

in control of yourself and yet the

second we step across the line and we

try to control someone else whether it's

I think you should be healthier I think

you should be more motivated I wish you

wouldn't like leave the kleenexes when

you're blowing your nose on the whatever

it is that you wish someone else would

do I wish my boss wouldn't talk in every

meeting and would give a chance like for

us to talk all of that desire for

someone else to change is you attempting

to control the

uncontrollable and so I think one of the

reasons why we do this is because we're

hardwired to do it and the problem

becomes that the second I try to control

you Jay it's not going to motivate you

to do what I want you to do it's going

to bump up against your need for your

own control so you're going to push back

against me absolutely and so you also

asked about distraction I think the

reason why we're so distracted is

because if you spend so much time and

energy allowing the world around you to

stress you out and drain your energy you

are now susceptible to being hijacked by

meaningless things that are not

important to you and this is one of the

biggest discoveries that I've made about

using the let them Theory and

researching it is has spread around the

world is that the single biggest benefit

is that you get time and energy back you

have no idea right now how much time and

energy is being wasted or drained

because of other people's behavior or

your expectations about how you wish

things would go and once you start

noticing all of these little moments all

day long it's like a death by Thousand

Cuts you want to know why you're too

tired you want to know why you're

overwhelmed you want to know why you're

stressed out you want to know why you

have no time for yourself it's because

of the power you give to other people's

opinions their emotions their immature

Behavior it's the ways in which you are

turning people into a problem in your

life and here's the sad fact the sad

fact is other people should be the

greatest source of happiness and

connection and inspiration but if you

don't truly learn this skill that we're

going to talk about today of focusing on

what you can control and letting people

be who they are letting things play out

as they're playing out and then bringing

the power back in house and really

focusing on how you responded if you

Embrace this skill you're going to be

shocked you're going to be shocked by

how much time you've wasted I'm not

kidding yeah and you're going to be

shocked Jay by the fact that you've

allowed stupid things and people's drama

to drain you and that's why I also think

we're so susceptible to distraction

because we've given so much power away

all day long because here's the truth

like I'll give you an example when I

first discovered this and I started

playing around with it the very first

way that I used it after I discovered it

was I was standing in line and we've all

been at the grocery store when it's like

six people deep and there's one person

working yeah it's like beep beep beep

and you start feeling that wave right

and immediately the wave of stress takes

over because you're now irritated by

what's happening and what just happens

when you start reacting to that and you

allow that stress wave to start to take

over is that you're giving power to

something outside of you now I can't

control what's happening right now so

why on Earth would I allow it to drain

my energy because as it comes up Jay

what do I then do I then start talking

to myself well this is ridiculous why

have they not done an announcement like

I I got I got to get going here why why

are they not bringing another now I'm

starting to believe Jay that I can run a

supermarket better than the people that

are running it and then you of course

turn to the person behind you and you

roll like can you believe this and now

this

is the interesting part that I really

want everybody I really want the person

listening to embrace

in that moment you just gave away your

energy and you have a

choice when you say let them you

instantly feel a

release and then you say let me decide

what I'm going to do right now am I

gonna leave I can leave the

store that's one thing I can do I could

stand here and practice being present

that's another thing I could do I could

because I don't have time at the end of

the day and I'm always tired and I'm

complaining that I'm only I could

actually pick up the phone and call my

grandmother I could text my friend J

shett because I've been thinking about

him like you have so much power but

you're going to burn through it in that

line and then you're going to feel your

stress activated and then you're going

to get in the car and then somebody's

going to pull out in front of you and

then you're going to like be stressed

again and then you're going to walk into

work and you're going to be annoyed in

some meeting because of what something

somebody said and then that's going to

hit you again and all day long because

because you don't recognize how this

stuff is impacting you that energy

inside your body is slowly draining and

this is why you're exhausted and so

simply starting to use it whether it's

at work or it's just in your daily life

to say let them wanting people to change

is not the problem how we go about it is

if their behavior is telling you that

your needs are not a

priority you have to let them reveal

that you're only attached to it because

you've never experienced anything else I

want to paint another scenario for

people to really understand the system

let's say you have a partner boyfriend

girlfriend maybe you're married to them

and this person always turns up from

work a little bit late uh they don't

wash the dishes you wake up in the

morning the dishes are always still out

there there's a sense that you've told

them this irks you a million times did

my husband ask you to ask me this

question Jay

he's amazing I know Chris Chris has your

number so I probably text yeah Chris

yeah and so I I I mean I'm speaking from

so much not direct personal experience

but personal experience in so many ways

and you're saying this person's not

changing they haven't changed for like

this is a fundamental role everybody

number one you cannot change another

human being it is impossible for you to

change somebody else now you can

influence them but you cannot change

them people only change if they feel

like it and if they can and wanting and

wishing is a wonderful thing wanting and

wishing somebody to be cleaner and to

pick up out after themselves wanting

your kids to be more motivated wanting

the people that you love to take better

care of themselves and to be healthier

or to date somebody that is normal and

healthy instead of the losers that treat

them like crap that's a beautiful thing

for you to want for other people and you

deserve to do that and you should do

that wanting people to change is not the

problem hunting bigger possibilities for

people is not the problem how we go

about it is and so in the scenario that

you're talking about this is a beautiful

example because you have to say let them

you see the dishes in the sink it makes

you upset because you feel disrespected

and it's annoying and you have higher

standards for cleanliness which means

you're probably just going to do them

anyway and then you're going to feel

like you're really taking whatever for

granted but you have to say let them and

one of the reasons why is

because number one if this is a

long-term committed partnership learning

how to love somebody as they are is a

form of love that is deeply important

and if you can't say let them in that

moment you are going to get frustrated

and angry and then you are going to come

to the next part of the let them Theory

with tremendous intensity and judgment

and that's not going to motivate change

what it does when you judge somebody or

you push against them is it actually

creates resistance to change so you have

to say let them because it allows you to

detach from your emotions and detach

from judgment right it is what it is I

see what's happened I'm accepting the

reality of this let them then you come

to the let me part is this something

that bothers you and if it is remember

you got three things I can choose what I

want to think about this and so you

could think a good thought you could

think okay good intention they were

probably super busy this morning and

they meant to do it later let them okay

I'm going to choose to believe that you

could also then remind yourself let me

remind myself there's something I can do

about this right and if it's really

important what you need to do about this

is have a conversation and by the way

Chris has had this conversation with me

a bazillion times so if you walk into

our bathroom Chris's bathroom probably

looks like your side of the sink which

is it's like a Zen sevenstar Hotel Jay

like there's not a speck on that man's

like Basin or whatever you call it if

you look at mine it looks like somebody

tipped over a Walgreens aisle on top of

that thing and it drives Chris crazy but

what particularly drives him crazy is

when something migrates from my side to

his side right and so he's asked me he's

asked me to please keep my stuff over

there he has asked me to please flatten

cardboard boxes when they come in don't

please pack don't unpack them and then

stack them by the garage door as if I'm

supposed to do it and he's asked me ask

me and ask me and then I forget well he

finally sat Me Down Jay and this is the

let me part you have to take

responsibility for explaining to

somebody what you need and the reason

why this is important to you because

when Chris said to me I know you don't

intend this but this is the impact mail

when I see the cardboard boxes stacked

or I see your hair brushing 15 products

of yours on my

countertop it actually makes me feel

like you think I'm the

maid and we don't even have a maid like

it's just like it makes me feel like you

think it's my job to clean up after you

and that doesn't make me feel loved now

when he took the time and a very calm

way to drop into his values and

communicate what he

needed something interesting happens if

you're in a committed loving partnership

and you're with somebody who wants to do

better and cares about you it tap into

their intrinsic

motivation to build new

skills if you have that kind of

conversation with somebody and you

explain how their behavior impacts you

whether it's their drinking or it's the

tone of their voice or it's the fact

that they leave their stuff everywhere

or it's that they insist that you spend

every holiday with their family and they

have no interest in your whatever the

issue is if you sit somebody down and

you take responsibility you've let them

be and you've let them shown you who

they are

and then you say let me sit down and

talk about this and take responsibility

I have the ability to respond to this

like a mature adult and you actually

Express what you need and why and that

person doesn't

try you have to let them and here's why

their behavior is telling you the truth

their behavior is telling you what they

care about and what their priorities are

and if their behavior is telling you

that your needs are not a priority

you have to let them reveal that because

that's also what let them me yes because

then you're going to come back to the

second part which is let me ask myself

is this kind of behavior from somebody

what I deserve is this what I'm willing

to accept in somebody because again what

do we also know people only change when

they want to or they

can and you might be in a situation

where somebody would really love to

change but they can't because they're

dealing with some challenge right now or

they don't have the skill yet and you

may decide if that's the case to still

love and accept the person right right

yeah but there may be times where you

have had the

conversation and it is very clear

they're capable of it they just won't do

it yeah and what I find in relationships

where that sort of invisible distance

and the frustration and the resentment

comes up is twofold number

one you can't detach from your emotions

and say let them and really fully just

let the person be who they are and you

don't do the part let me where you

actually take responsibility for

expressing in a mature way what you need

and how their behavior impacts you and

so if you don't ever express what you

need and how it's impacting you you're

not actually giving somebody the

opportunity to build a skill or to

change or to love you the way that you

need them to

love you so that you feel loved the

second mistake that I see constantly is

that you make the ask and then the

person doesn't do it and then you start

making excuses and resentment builds and

you stay in something seeing exactly who

someone is wishing they would change

living up here in your mind about the

fantasy of what you wish this was

refusing to accept the reality of what

it actually is

you've just unlocked a whole new meaning

of let them for me how so I've always

understood let them when I've heard you

speak about it when I read the book this

idea of let them be who they are let

them act the way they want to act let

them say and do whatever they want to do

I have to let them I have to keep that

distance what you just unlocked for me

which I really want to you know everyone

to Grapple with because I think it's so

powerful is this idea of let them also

show you who they are yes and if they're

showing you who they are let them be

that person don't make them the person

you imagine them to be the one you want

them to be the one that you're wishing

and waiting and hoping for them to be

they are that person let them be that is

oh my gosh my mind is literally blown

because that is so powerful but you

still have power Jay then here's the

most important thing everybody this is

the most important thing this is The

Epiphany that I had too like holy cow I

still get to

choose I still get to choose

I get to choose how much time and energy

I pour into this whether it's this issue

or it's this topic or it's this

person and here's how you know if you

can actually love somebody for who they

are and who they're not can you end your

complaining and bitching about it

because if you can't do that then this

is something you're holding on to and

you're holding over the other person mhm

and if they're never going to change you

going to have a problem MH M because the

only thing that's going to make the

relationship better is either them

hearing you and caring enough and being

able to adjust or you being the one to

adjust because it's your complaining

about it that is creating the the

friction and the resentment and this is

not only with romantic relationships

like when I think about the broader

applications of this for

family there are very challenging people

in my extended family just just like

everybody's family right and so there's

always one person in your life that you

wish there just wasn't drama with you

wish they didn't have a challenging

demeanor or personality the let them

theory has fundamentally profoundly

changed my relationship also with people

that have been difficult because when I

say let them like let's say you're

talking we're talking about somebody

who's very narcissistic or dramatic or

victim or they're all it's always about

them and very draining person to be

around well part of the reason why

they're draining is because you

brace and you get ready for it and you

allow their energy to impact you and I

always find it funny Jay that especially

in families and at work we allow the

most challenging person to have the

biggest impact on the whole system so if

you have one person that's narcissistic

in their personality style or that is

very very dramatic and immature in their

personality style they're one if you

imagine a spiderweb right I think about

a a system of relationships like a

spiderweb and you're out in the morning

the do's on it when you have a

challenging person because we all tiptoe

around this person that person's energy

is like tap tap tap and shakes all the

do off I believe the opposite is true

especially after learning the let them

Theory because there's been people in my

life both in work life and in my family

life where when that person's around I

literally shrink to 8 years old I'm

dancing around their mood we all have

had an experience like this maybe you're

thinking about a boss or your mother or

your father-in-law or a brother or

whomever an adult child

right when I walk into these situations

now and I say let them let them be who

they

are why am I making it my job to manage

their mood yeah why am I pouring time

and energy into this

drama let me manage my energy let me

remind myself I can remove myself from

any dinner table any family text chain I

can remove myself from an interview a

date a conversation a relationship

anytime I want and I believe Jay that

the person that is the most

peaceful and centered and Powerful

because you understand the power of your

energy and your thoughts and your

actions you actually have more power in

any family system in any office building

in any room anywhere than the most

Challen ing person I could agree more I

couldn't agree more I love that and I

feel like when you start looking at your

energy and time if you thought about it

like money and this idea that imagine

for every thought you had about that

person you had to pay them a dollar and

you think about how many dollars if you

now started to count the amount of

thoughts you're having about that person

about that situation about what they

said about what they said to so and so

what they thought about you and you had

to pay a dollar for every thought you

had about them that's how much energy

time and money is being wasted yes and

we're not realizing where else it could

be invested and put in but I think you

hit the nail on the head there the

reason is we feel so attached that we

don't feel we can actually leave as Tian

would say we would rather live in the

familiar pain than the unfamiliar pain

at least we know what we're going to get

with this person and there's a part of

us that gets attached to that even

consciously well here's the thing though

Jay because I think it's a really

important point that you're bringing up

but here's what I think you're going to

discover I think you're only attached to

it because you don't value your time and

energy for sure you're only attached to

it because you've never experienced

anything else MH and the reason why

you're used to it is because in the

relationship dynamic

you're up in your head usually in a

relationship explaining away Behavior

instead of actually seeing it with clear

eyes and detaching from it and that's

the other reason and I know you knew

this instantly that the let them Theory

and saying let them and let me one of

the reasons why it's so powerful and I'm

so excited is I feel literally like I'm

am surrounded by

ancestors because this is a modern

application of

ancient philosophy spiritual guidance

stoicism Detachment theory that you can

then apply in any moment in any

relationship and what I also love about

this Jay is that I think it allows you

to truly see people perhaps for the

first time and to give them the space to

be who they are and from that space

what's amazing is you can let people for

example a lot of us are very triggered

and motivated when somebody's

disappointed or when some or we think

that somebody's going to like you know

really be let down by us and I had this

huge breakthrough because I used to feel

really guilty either by how much I work

or the fact that uh Chris and I raised

our kids on the east coast and my

parents are in the Midwest and you know

I love my parents and I wish we all live

together but here's the thing they're

not moving to me and I'm not moving to

them we got at them right mhm but

there's a lot of emotion about it and I

know your family's all over the place

too so you know you're nodding like I'm

not saying anything cuz my family

listens to this SM so so here's the

thing if I don't go home with my family

for the holidays my parents are

disappointed let them be

disappointed I mean isn't that a

beautiful thing that they're

disappointed don't you want somebody to

be disappointed

that you're not coming that really

messes with people's minds right yeah

like whether you can't make it to a

business engagement or you can't make it

to a birthday party or you can't make it

this year home I mean what's the

alternative that they're like thank God

Jay's not coming I can't stand

him no seriously like really wrap your

brain around this and and so when you

say let them be disappointed Something

Beautiful happens you actually honor

their experience of Being Human mhm you

allow them to be adults yes that is a

sign that emotion that things are really

good in your relationship yes but then

you say let me and the old me would

twist myself in knots and then I would

make myself feel bad and then I would

question what I was doing and then I'd

bend over backwards try to be there and

try to be here and instead when I say

let me I drop into my values I deeply

value family and so if they're

disappointed that's not the reason I

would change plans

I have to look at what do I think what

do I want to do and how am I going to

process my emotions and so as someone

else's disappointed the old me would

feel deeply guilty and

conflicted now with the let them Theory

I have space for them to be disappointed

and for me to feel a little sad but if I

change plans I don't do it for them

because if I change plans for them guess

what I just did I made them the villain

in my life MH if I change plans because

it makes makes me feel like a good

daughter it makes me feel good abut now

I take responsibility for my life and I

am owning my

decisions and it's a small Nuance but

it's

absolutely everything yeah everything

yeah and the other reason why I love

this especially as a parent of adult

children and you know there are very

this is a book about adult relationships

and so I make it very clear in the book

and there's resources for parents with

young kids in the back but one of the

coolest things about this is that when

you let someone like have their emotions

and you let someone struggle while you

say I'm on the sidelines and I'm here to

support but I know that the greatest

teacher in life is life and I'm not

going to Shield you from the

consequences of some of the things that

you're choosing you're an adult so I'm

going to let you when you allow someone

the space to process emotion and the

space to face their struggles and the

space to heal their own timeline and in

their own way you actually communicate

that I believe that you can yeah when

you step in and try to force somebody to

be more motivated at school or you let's

just take that one because I there's a

lot of people that listen to my show and

I'm sure it's the same people that are

listening to yours that right in are

like I don't know how to make this

person more motivated oh for sure right

and so here's what I want you to

understand and this was another huge

breakthrough when I was writing this

book do you want to know the hardest

person hardest working person in a

classroom Jay it's the kid who's

struggling it's not the people that are

getting straight A's it's the person

who's having a really hard time wow do

you want to know the hardest person

that's working on their health it's

actually the person that's

unhealthy because they know that they

want to be healthier and so they are not

stuck they're in deep conflict actively

within themselves and so if somebody is

already aware that there is a gap

between their potential and how they're

performing that there is a gap between

their god-given right to thrive and be

happy and be connected and what their

life actually feels like they know it

and then you come in and try to impose

your will or your good ideas oh thanks a

lot so I never thought that if I wanted

to get great good grades I needed to

study and not play video games thank you

Einstein oh I should go to the gym if I

want to lose some weight never thought

of that so you come in and you have

judgment and assumptions what is it

that's more pressure on top of somebody

who is actually already deeply

conflicted with themselves yeah and so

if you really Embrace this and you

understand that people change when they

feel like it and when they can and if

somebody's

struggling it's because they're not able

to right now there's a skill that's

missing and one of the biggest things

that typically missing is the belief

that any of the small actions will

actually do anything anyway yeah and so

you coming in and imposing it you know

what that says it actually says I don't

believe you can do this I'll do it for

you yes I can do it for you I can it for

you yeah absolutely if you can't control

it why on Earth would you allow any

timer energy to be wasted because you're

going to keep this person in your life

even though they walked out the door

which is why you have to let them you're

not just letting them leave you have to

unlearn the patterns of your life yes

that were with them I remember when me

and R actually got married and we moved

to America and rad will say this herself

that at that time in her life had

parents had made a lot of big decisions

for her and she was following decisions

that they were making or opportunities

that they were putting forward and all

of that was with good intention and then

when we got married she'd start to ask

me for my advice or my insight this

would be anything from what plates we

should buy for our apartment through to

like what kind of curtains we wanted

right we're talking about really small

everyday things and I remember I would

always say to her well what do you think

and she'd always say no no no you just

tell me and I'll be like no but what do

you think and in the start it would

really frustrate her but now she looks

back and she goes that question helped

her so much because it helped her find

her own identity her own strength her

own taste her own dislikes and now she's

a whole human with opinions and it's so

fascinating to watch that and it was

because I almost had this for visioning

or this thought that even if I make my

life easier by just telling her my

tastes and dislikes and likes it's only

going to be easy in the short term

because 10 years from now she's going to

think she became the person I wanted her

to be and never became the person she

could be right and I could see that and

so I set up and I was like no you just

tell me until this day I always practice

I'm like I think you look beautiful but

I want you to wear what you want to wear

it it shouldn't be about what I think

you look better in or worse in or that

that just shouldn't be the case and it's

so interesting how we think love is over

caring but actually over caring is over

enabling that person and overwhelming

that person and it's control it's

control you're not like if you think

about what love really is and for me

love is two things it's consideration

right it's having someone in mind if you

pour in oat milk instead of the cow milk

because that's what they like that's an

act of love it's also admiration and

admiration is the ability to see

something in somebody that you deeply

admire I want to go back to something

that you said though because it was

genius and it had

me think about the idea of the power of

your time and energy and you were

talking about imagine if like your time

and your energy had dollars associated

with it because I don't think we value

it and I started to think about one of

the biggest obstacles because what's

ultimately happening when you start to

use let them and let me is you're going

to see that you've turned other people

into a major problem and you have turned

them into a problem in four ways first

of all you allow them to stress you out

but you're not going to do that anymore

because you're going to let them be but

the second way that you've made them a

major problem in your life is that you

give so much weight to other people's

opinions and in the example you were

just talking about what was happening is

by asking you what do you think Rody was

doing what we all do but most of us do

it subconsciously and we don't even

realize it

which is before we even ask ourselves

what feels right for us we stop and

consider what we think somebody's going

to think and you have that like really

brilliant thing that I've heard you say

a bazillion times that I love it's not

what you think you think and think and

I'm like wait what what But but so I

want to play this out because this is so

important was a huge thing for me if you

open up your favorite social media

platform we've all had the experience

where you go and you pick a photo and

you then put it up and you're like okay

should I put filter on this and you

start to then question is this the right

photo and then you go back to your photo

roll and then you start working on the

caption should I put an emoji is this

too much should I do this and then you

are worried why because you're actually

thinking about what other people are

going to think or do in response to what

you're posting yes which means if you

take the value of it right you just

overvalued

something that you will never be able to

control ever ever ever ever and yet

you're doing it subconsciously and what

typically happens is if you notice

everybody's got hundreds of draft

posts yeah you know what that is that is

a graveyard of energy you wasted on

something that you didn't you'll never

be able to control because the average

person has 70,000 random thoughts a day

you can't even control half the crap

that goes in your own mind so what makes

you think any post is going to guarantee

that any human being thinks anything and

the let them Theory revealed to me Jay

how often I was subconsciously valuing

oh for sure someone else and that like

are they going to think negative are

they think this are they going to think

too much and there's a such a simple way

to change this you just let them think

negative thoughts that's it the next

time you catch yourself stopping to

consider what you're going to post or

what your colleague might react to and

that's what's keeping you silent say to

yourself let them think negative

thoughts because that's what you're

actually afraid of yeah and so when you

say let them think negative thoughts

something wild happens you accept the

reality that no matter what you do it

doesn't guarantee that anybody thinks

anything yeah and then you say let me

and here's where this gets really

cool let me remind myself I can think

what I want and I can do what I want and

your social media in particular as you

and I both know your

self-expression that's what it's there

forh and if you can't allow yourself to

express yourself

there then it's going to be everywhere

where you edit yourself because you're

not just letting people think negative

thoughts for sure but if you operate in

a way now and you now take the value you

take the money back we're not going to

pay Jay the money for his opinion I'm

going to take the money back and where

I'm going to put the value is operating

in a way that makes me feel proud of

myself MH because when I operate in a

way whether I'm posting something or I'm

speaking in a meeting or I'm showing up

and not responding to my dramatic

whatever I'm proud of myself and when

you're proud of yourself you don't even

consider what other people are thinking

because you've just anchored all of your

worth inside of yourself yeah and that's

why this is another reason why this so

unbelievably powerful yeah and and the

truth is no one's thinking about you for

as long as you think true no one's

thinking about you for as much as you

think no one's thinking about you as

much as they even say they're thinking

about you and we just like you said we

keep draining that energy consumed by it

you reminded me of the beautiful Charles

Horton couie quote and he wrote this in

1890 and he said the challenge today is

I'm not what I think I am I'm not what

you think I am I am what I think you

think I am which means we live in a

perception of a perception of ourselves

so if I think Mel thinks I'm not smart

then I don't think I'm smart so it's not

even reality it's not even factually

proven or checked or tested by the way

everything in the let them Theory this

book is literally every thought those

70,000 thoughts that's what you're

addressing in this book let them two

words get rid of this fear yeah it

literally does because I was talking

I've talked to at least three friends

this week and all of them are concerned

by either hey Jay I'm thinking about

posting a video on social media I'm

scared of what people will think so

that's for their professional their

passion I've got another friend who's

worried that a lot of our other friends

are talking about him negatively because

he's recently fallen out with them okay

and so he's worried like what are they

saying they're all talking to each other

what what rumors are they spreading

about me like maybe it's not true and

the thing that they're holding on to is

they just can't let they can't let them

and it's no but they can yeah see I

don't think they have the tool yeah see

here's the thing if you're worried that

people are gossiping about you let them

let them gossip about you here's why you

can't control it it's gonna happen

anyway yes and so if you can't control

it why on Earth would you allow any time

or energy to be

wasted yeah it's an act of self- torture

so if you are worried that people are

gossiping about you first of all let

them gossip about you yeah because

they're going to do what they're going

to do because you cannot change what

other people do you can't control what

they think you can't control what they

do if they're going to gossip they're

going to gossip so let them gossip and

when you say that it's a relief because

you actually acknowledge the thing that

you've been afraid of and it's like

you're allowing it without allowing it

but then don't forget you have power

yeah let

me remind myself that I get to choose

what I think about myself I get to

decide what I do yeah and what I don't

do whether or not I respond or not and I

get to decide who I spend time with and

so the bigger question becomes if you're

busy worrying about which means you're

spending time and

energy

people who are gossiping about you why

would you want to be friends with them

yeah and so now you take responsibility

for your own part in chasing people that

aren't treating you in a way that you

deserve yes and you recognize that the

power here is in just letting people be

and when you let people be your

relationships get better because people

reveal who they are and where you stand

and then you get to choose how much time

you spend or not yeah and not everybody

in your life deserves an

explanation they don't deserve a

response

necessarily and so you also get to

choose who you tell your story to or who

you apologize to or who how you respond

to it and that's where your power is and

I'm not saying this makes it

easy because you're probably in a

situation like that going to have to say

let them let them let them and then

you're going to see them on social media

and you're gonna be like should I block

them should I not block them are they

going to see if I do that should I not G

let them let them know their lives and

if I want to unfollow them let me do

that because I get to choose what comes

into my space or not and when you start

really play around with this because one

of the big push backs that I that I've

gotten in the research is what am I just

going to be a doormat I'm let people

abuse me I'm let people no actually it's

the opposite because you're probably

allowing it right now and then

explaining it away when you say let them

you're letting somebody's Behavior speak

yeah and then you have to bring it back

to yourself and say I've got to let them

reveal who they are and if this person

keeps gaslighting me or not including me

now I've got to ask myself is this

actually the relationship for me Mel do

you think we expect too much from people

I do I think everybody's really busy and

life is very

overwhelming

and you have no idea what's going on in

other people's lives and we've gotten to

a point in today's world where if I text

you I expect Jay to respond and if Jay

doesn't respond then I make it mean

something about J or

me and I hate that because it doesn't

give people Grace we're

constantly expecting people to show up a

certain way and then judging them when

they don't instead of stopping to

consider that other people have lives

and other people have a lot of things

going on and sometimes when people go

silent on you it has nothing to do with

you it has to do with a crazy busy

period in life

or it has to do with the fact that

something's going on with their family

and they're so drained at the end of the

day that the last thing they want to do

is talk to anybody and so I do think we

expect too much because relationships

feel very like transactional you do this

for me I do this for you I text you you

better text me back now there are rules

in terms of just being courteous to

people and being gracious to people but

I'm deeply concerned Jay about the rise

of both arangement I'm concerned about

the amount of posts that go viral about

you know I got my life better because I

cut all the toxic PE people out and I

stop and think always well did you have

a

conversation about what was bothering

you because if you just ghost other

people or you use the silent treatment

that's actually punishing somebody and

that's extremely immature actually it

means you can't handle your own emotions

which is why you don't have a hard

conversation about what you need or how

that someone's behavior is impacting you

and if you haven't had that it's a very

immature move to just cut somebody off

and so I get very worried about the

labeling of people as toxic and about

the ease at which people seem to just

drop people yeah and what I really love

about the let them theory is that it

opens up the window to a lot more

compassion because we're quick to think

that if somebody hasn't texted you back

or you've texed texted somebody a couple

times and they haven't responded that

you did something bad and it's perfectly

fine to be like did I do something you

know I I I noticed you haven't responded

is everything okay if they don't respond

then then something's probably wrong

either with them or with you and you get

to decide what you're going to do next

but I am worried about the combination

of people being isolated of people

spending way too much time on their

phones instead of with each other and

that we've gotten very transactional

with one another and it's easy to forget

that people have a lot going on and

they're not thinking about you as much

as you're thinking about them and just

because you have time to text them

doesn't mean they have time right now to

text you back and I guarantee you when

they saw your text they probably thought

oh my God I love you know I got and then

something came up yeah and so I do worry

about it Jay I do think we have too much

of an expectation of something in return

yeah and when you start to use this

Theory what you're also going to notice

is this when you start to say let them

you will notice that maybe you're the

sibling that reaches out more and it

might bother you because when you say

let them and you keep reaching out and

they don't reach out or you have a group

of friends and you notice that when you

stop reaching out or making the plans

that you're not included in theirs and

that hurts yeah the thing I used to do

when that happened is I would make it

about me I would make it like some

deficiency in me and what I've learned

using the let them Theory and really

just saying let them which detaches from

the hurt it detaches from the Judgment

it reminds you that adults are allowed

to live their lives adults are allowed

to come and go in Friendship they're

allowed to prioritize certain people at

certain times they're allowed to have

busy periods at work they're allowed to

fall in and out of

communication and the more you let

people live their lives the better your

life gets and the more compassionate of

a human being you

become and The more I've started to

recognize oh wait like my social life is

my

responsibility if I have a group of

friends where if I make the plans

everybody's included but if I sit back

I'm never invited yeah then now I got to

examine am I investing in the right

group of friends or you might also wake

up and realize well maybe I just like

really like introverted people but I'm

the party planner and that's my role in

life and instead of you being

transactional you actually recognize the

gift that it is to people oh yeah right

yeah and you know it sucks that maybe

your siblings get together because they

live closer and they don't include you

and it does hurt and feeling a little

bit of pain like that means your mind

and body is working properly yes right

it's a sign that you're mentally well

yeah it doesn't mean there's a sign that

there's anything wrong with youh and so

when you can say let them and then you

say Let me let me decide what I want to

do about this you can have the

conversation yeah and you might realize

that they just

click and you don't have as close as a

relationship but then you get to decide

how you value family and if you're going

to bring different energy or if you're

going to try a little bit harder because

again you get to choose and when you

realize how much power you have you see

that through the way you think about it

or you respond to it you actually can

shift anything for the better for sure

and I'm really excited about this I

wrote this um actually with my daughter

who's 25 and it was an amazing

experience

because she was

bringing a much different perspective

and when we wrote the section about how

you use the let them Theory with

love she started researching The Breakup

section because the fact about love is

people choose who and how they love and

sometimes they won't choose you but you

also get to choose who and how you love

and how you're going to create it and

people forget that and so we get to the

part about when a relationship is

ending and her boyfriend of two years

breaks up with her and she the

book like this is hor just rip this up I

have to let them walk out the door I

have to let them believe this is a

of like just like and it was

this unbelievable experience

because when somebody that you love is

grieving or going through heartbreak or

struggling you would jump in front of a

car to take their pain away and the Le

them Theory and the experience of this

book taught me that the best thing I

could do was to let her grieve to let

her be

heartbroken to let her go through her

process you know I think about it this

way like arm around somebody you're not

blocking and tackling you've got your

arm around somebody but if she's on the

floor sobbing let her because she needs

to you know if we need to remove the

photos from the family thing because

this was a two-e long relationship

because that is actually a huge

recommendation that I make this book

that you've got to follow a 30-day rule

of zero contact zero photos zero videos

because you're not just letting them

leave you have to

unlearn the patterns of your life yes

that were with them yeah it's it's a

withdrawal like anything else yes and

any sign of that person actually

triggers the old patterns in your

nervous system and it delays your

ability to move through it absolutely

and it's

impossible when you're in it to just let

them move on because every part of your

wiring and programming you're going to

want to check their location you're

going to want to listen to The Voice

Memos you're going to want to saturate

yourself because the life that you

wanted is

over and you're either going to trap

yourself in a life that you're no longer

in by watching their life play out from

afar and you're going to keep

re-triggering these patterns in your

nervous

system because you're going to keep this

person in your life even though they

walked out the door which is why you

have to let them and then you've got to

let me do the hard part which is I get

to choose how I'm going to move through

this and the research is also really

empowering it gets better for the

majority of people 71% of the people

start to feel better by 11 weeks that's

the that's number 11 weeks 11 weeks and

you may feel better in 11 days what

happens at 11 weeks what happens at 11

weeks if you're not cyberstalking

somebody is that you've actually allowed

your body to break the old patterns

right see the reason why when you're

going through a heartbreak and uh

heartbreak and breakups are just like

death that's what they are for sure

because you're grieving what's no longer

there the life you had the life you

could have had yes

and aside from the 30-day rule which is

remove like do not look at voice memos

location social nothing no photos

because it triggers everything to stay

alive in you but during those 30 days

what's going to happen is every time you

wake up you're going to feel them there

because your body remembers that doesn't

mean that's a sign you should get back

together yeah that's actually a sign

that you're unlearning something let

those memories come up let your nervous

system process this every time you have

news in your life you're going to want

to reach out to them why because that

was the pattern that doesn't mean you

should yeah so you've got to do the let

them leave and let me remind myself I'm

going through this process and every day

that you do that you're actually

unlearning these patterns and by the

time you get to about 30 days you feel

less

intoxicated another huge recommendation

is do something in your bedroom like

paint a wall move the bed do something

because you spent a lot of time there so

walking back into it is like a graveyard

of your old life and it can be very

triggering and so she did that and the

11we Mark is important because what's

happening is you're now starting to

create new patterns as you've let them

leave you're now letting me move on

you're letting me take the actions that

show me that my life is moving forward

and my therapist and and Davin who's the

smartest woman i' human being I've ever

met she said you know Mel the the thing

for Sawyer to ask herself is if she knew

that the love of her life were

literally just a couple months away what

would you

do right

now with this period of

time and when you think about it that

way because again as long as you're

holding on to somebody who already left

you actually are not open to meeting

anybody else that is beautiful that idea

of what would you look like what would

you be thinking

how would you behave if the love of your

life was two months away yeah or two

years or a year away or whatever you see

because we think because when somebody

leaves that you love you think you're

unlovable you actually think you're

never going to find it again you hate

yourself that's why most of the advice

about this is complete

go love yourself how the hell

am I going to go love myself when the

person I love more than anything just

left me mhm I hate myself I despise

myself I am terrified of the day that

they're going to meet somebody yeah I'm

never going to find that again I'm never

G to have sex like that again I'm not

like you hate

yourself and so telling somebody to just

go on a Revenge diet or love yourself

it's horrible instead I want you to face

reality they left let them and then let

me grieve and follow my therapist an

davin's advice you have to do a 30-day

detox and if you are somebody that's

been holding on to somebody that left a

year ago I guarantee you you have not

gone 30 days without listening to a

voice memo or looking at a photo you are

keeping them

alive which is keeping you trapped in

something that's

dead and your inability to let them go

and let them leave and then let me

accept reality and start moving forward

and let me believe

that the person that I am meant to meet

they are in the future they're not in my

past and by the way even if you kind of

hold out secretly hope it might be the

person from the past it might be but

they're not the version from back there

and neither are you and neither are you

and so you have to again come back to

where the power is it's not in getting

them back it's not in making them

jealous because if you focus on making

that person jealous or blah where are

you putting your power

then and something you can't control mhm

you have to put your power here and the

reason why I love the 30day rule and the

11we Mark is because it's the truth this

is going to

suck the only way to get over someone

and to go through heartbreak is to go

through it there's no avoiding it

there's only delaying it and we delay it

because we don't want to accept people

as they are yeah when somebody breaks up

and leaves or cheats on you they have

just revealed who they are for sure and

your inability to accept it instead of

explaining it away and living in a

fantasy up here that's what's keeping

you from having and creating the love

you actually deserve and want in your

life I was talking to a friend recently

and this everything you're saying is

just so true and it's it's resonating so

strongly to me I was talking to a friend

recently and she was saying to me I wish

my friend would just be honest with me I

wish this person who's just screwed me

over just let me down would just be

honest with me rather than pretending to

be my friend and I said to them they are

being honest with you them lying is

showing you their truth that's how much

they value you them pretending to be

your friend is their truth yeah you

don't want the truth actually you want

them to lie to you and you want them to

be someone else you want them to become

the honest person but they're showing

you that they're not an honest person

that is the truth it's true and here's

the other thing why are you pretending

to be this person's friend yeah and not

bringing it up why is it on them to tell

you the truth let them lie to you and

then come to the let me part yeah if

aren't you

pretending that you're their friend if

you haven't brought this up and you're

actually holding that in your head right

there's so many applications of this so

many just incredible and the thing that

I'm really really excited about is that

you know the other massive thing that I

think this is going to help people with

is that one other way that you make

people a massive problem is that you see

somebody else's success or happiness or

the things that they achieve in their

life as somehow robbing you of yours

yeah and the thing about life is that

you're never playing against people you

play with them and some somebody else's

success happiness love like the things

that they achieve it's in Limitless

Supply MH and when you wrap your brain

around the fact that happiness love

money like all of it Limitless Supply so

other people can't block your way they

actually lead the way and so if you let

them lead the way and you see their wins

not as your losses but you see it as an

example to follow you now stop making

other people a problem and you stop

using them as an excuse for why you

can't do what you're capable of other

people don't block you you block your

way M allow people to lead the way and

the way that you do that is you say let

them be successful let them get married

let them have the baby let them have the

nice car because they're showing me

what's possible and the cool thing about

really embracing let them in that regard

is that other people also show you the

formula right yeah absolutely they show

you exactly how to do something 100% but

if you're so busy going oh well Jane

launched a podcast and there's too many

podcasts now I can't launch a

podcast who's blocking you you correct

you're capable of learning to be a

better player in The Game of Life from

other people yes so stop playing against

them yeah and let them show you the way

Mel why is it so hard to make friends as

we get older there is a massive shift

that happens in adult friendship when

you hit 20 that nobody sees coming the

rules of friendship completely change

when your 20's hit and I'm going to

explain the rules when you're little and

then we're going to talk about the rules

of adult friendship so when you're

little your entire life is organized

around friendship and making it possible

because you're with people your age all

the time in class in sports so true you

move in groups CU you're on teams and

you're in neighborhoods and you're

always together you also celebrate the

same Milestones you're hitting the same

birthdays you're all talking about the

next level of school or the this thing

this summer you're watching the same

movies because you're all the same age

and so there's so much Synergy and

relevance and the conditions to spend a

ton of time together are there then you

get to University and you spend even

more time together and what happens when

you hit your 20s right is that it moves

from this big group sport where you just

kind of expect to be around your friends

all the time you expect the group to get

invited because that's what's always

happened you expect to see them all the

time cuz you do always see them all the

time but then your 20s hit the rules

change and what I call the great

scattering happens everybody moves in

different directions and friendship goes

from group sport to individual sport you

can no longer expect

friendship you are no longer part of a

group that is expected to be invited

everywhere because everybody scatters

and suddenly everybody's on different

timelines you're in different cities

you're moving in different directions so

there's no way to locate yourself inside

your friend group and the only thing

that's keeping you together from your

friends from your little is a text chain

that starts to go quieter and quieter

quieter as people start to focus on the

people in front of them and that brings

me to two major shifts that I want you

to embrace using the let them Theory

number one you can no longer expect

friendship you have to take a way more

flexible approach and a more proactive

approach you got to let people come and

go MH super important

and then you got to let me take the

actions to create the friendships I got

to go first I got to be the one planning

I got to seek out new people but there

are three pillars of adult friendship

based on Research that are also going to

help you understand that when people

come and go in your life 99% of the time

it's not personal and you actually

haven't lost them as a friend one of the

three pillars is missing so the three

things that need to be required to have

a friendship happen

are the same three things that were

around all the time when you were a kid

number one proximity proximity matters

tremendously proximity means who are you

actually physically next to in fact

they've done research Jay if you and I

were in a dorm and we lived across the

hall I don't I don't remember the

percentages exactly but it's like 90%

chance we're going to be friends

interesting the poor person at the end

of the hallway 10% chance that we're

going to be friends with them because of

proximity even a matter of 50 feet makes

a difference and so when you were little

you were in proximity to people your age

all the time all day exactly the

research also shows that to have as an

adult a kind of casual friend you need

to spend approximately 70 hours with

somebody to have a close friend 200

hours so when you're an adult that

creates a big problem because who are

you spending all your time with once

you're 20 the American Time study shows

that it's with people you work with so

why aren't we best friends with people

at work because you have proximity

and you're spending a lot of time

together but here's the thing timing

when you were little you were in the

same timing of life with everybody yeah

when you hit your 20s and it's now

individual everybody's on different

timelines some of your friends are

getting married some are going to

graduate school some are now pursuing

jobs other people are moving out of the

city into the city everybody's timing is

now different and this also explains why

you're almost never best friends with

people at work because the timing is off

you're sitting next to people that are

in very different times of their life

you may like them a lot and you may be

friends but you never spend time outside

of work because they're at home with

their family and you're going out with

your buddies your age on the weekends

and then that brings me to the third

thing that needs to be present for a

friendship to truly click and that's

energy and the thing about energy is it

changes and you can have fantastic

energy with somebody and then if you

decide you're not drinking anymore the

Energy's off yeah if you decide to get

really focused on Fitness the Energy's

off if you have very different political

beliefs the Energy's off it's not

personal it's one of these three pillars

and it has helped me so profoundly Jay

to realize that people come and go and

it's a beautiful thing and you should

let them and you should really if you

have a friendship that starts to

dissipate right ask yourself before you

blame them or you blame you

are any one of these three

pillars

missing are we not near each other

anymore is the timing of our lives off

is there just something about the energy

that hasn't clicked because you can't

force those things but what I found is

that when you recognize that those are

really important factors to your

connection to someone

else that if a friendship starts to fade

for me it's so easy to say let them and

I don't wish anybody bad I literally

wish people well because the other thing

that I've learned and you know being 56

I've had a lot of friends Come and Go in

different phases of my life that you

would be startled by how many people

from your past that you no longer quote

consider friends because you haven't

seen them in a very long time or things

just got weird if you actually called

them they'd pick up the phone they would

if you texted them the research shows

that when you get a surprise text from

somebody that you haven't heard from in

a long time the amount of joy that you

feel and so I want you to consider if

you're very lonely right now that

there's actually probably hundreds of

people from your past that still

consider you a friend MH and if you take

the approach that I'm talking about

which is friendship is your

responsibility you need to go first let

me create the friendship and the

connection that I want and you can start

by literally taking a look through your

past and thinking about people that you

remember fondly and just sending them a

text and you will be startled by what

comes back because they're there they

haven't actually gone anywhere the

connection is still there and oftentimes

even if you've had somebody where

something's been

off again let them yeah and wish them

well and there will be a time I promise

you where the timing or proximity or

energy comes back around again yeah and

often you're so right when when I'm as

I'm listening to your talk I'm just

thinking of how conscious we have to be

with all of our relationships the ones

that matter to us the ones that we want

to invest in and it's what you said

there was we were

actually dealt such a tough card in the

fact that basically from the moment you

joined school at 4 till the moment you

were 21 if you went to college you

basically didn't have to make really any

major decisions or think about the next

step because you went from seventh grade

to e8th grade to nth grade to 10

whatever it is right and so then all of

a sudden you're in the world at 21 yeah

or 18 if you didn't go to college and

you all of a sudden now have to figure

out what to do for the next 50 60 years

all structure of your life just

evaporated disappears the hardest there

is no structure and it makes no sense

and as I'm hearing you talk it sounds

like to me that it would have been

harder to watch your daughter have to

practice the let them Theory than it is

for you to practice the let them theory

yes when she was going through her

breakup would you say that's in your

deep vicinity of people that you're

close with the hardest way you've had to

practice to let them do yes the hardest

way is when you recognize the potential

in

somebody and you see them struggling and

when you recognize that somebody that

you love deeply is in pain when you're

saying let them you're not abandoning

somebody you're actually recognizing

their ability to meet these difficult

moments in their life with you by their

side and I think when I think about

supporting versus enabling because the

more you kind of step in and rescue

people from their feelings or from the

consequences of their decisions or their

inaction the more people continue to

drown and their problems I really

believe that I do too I really believe

that and it's a very very difficult

balance because you're going to hit your

frustration and rock bottom and worry

with somebody before they

do and somebody said something in the

addiction Community I can't remember who

said this but it just is so true that

somebody only gets sober when getting

drunk is harder than facing the thing

that they don't want to face mhm and the

same is true with any

like really motivating yourself to get

in better

shape recognizing that you have a

pattern of dating people that are

emotionally abusive and taking a break

and really digging deep into the issue

that keeps coming up for you that's

really hard that's why we avoid it yeah

and so when you see somebody that you

know is capable or who deserves better

wanting that for them is a form of

loving them I like you should want the

people in your life that you care about

to be doing better and you I hate seeing

somebody with so much potential

squandering it but again I'm going to

come back to something that I learned

from Dr Stuart ablon at Mass General

Hospital people do well when they can

and I want you to start to assume that

if somebody in your life is not doing

well or if they're going through a

challenge there is a skill that's

missing or there is emotion that needs

to be processed or there is pain that

needs to be felt before they can

Galvanize the ability to do the very

difficult work to change and in the case

of watching my daughter go through this

heartbreak I mean I literally found

myself Jay wanting to text you know her

boyfriend and her boyfriend's mother

like you know hey maybe we can like just

because I want to fix it but when you

step in and fix it you literally demean

someone else because I do know that she

has the ability to move through this and

so the way that I love thinking about

support is this way the next time you

have somebody in your life who is truly

struggling whether it's in school or in

relationships or with an addiction I

want you to think how can I create an

environment that supports their

healing how not not stepping in and

doing it it's rarely an issue of will

like it's not willpower for people or

the desire it's actually more about

skill MH and the ability and need to

process things and do it on their own

timeline right so how can you create an

environment for that to happen and for

me it meant removing any imagery it

meant letting her stay up in her bedroom

and every once in a while knocking on

the door and being like do you need

anything and allowing her to be in her

pajamas for 4 days and be in a

depressive State because guess what

being in a depressive State and falling

on the floor and crying it's a sign

she's mentally

well that's what you do it's a sign that

you're okay yes it would be scary if she

wasn't feeling

anything and then when you're ready you

kind of put your armor on people and so

how can you do this like when I when I

when she was born actually Sawyer um I

had severe postpartum depression Jay I

had a very traumatic delivery lost a lot

of blood and I just was so out of it

that they put me on these drugs that

turned me into a zombie I couldn't

breastfeed her I wasn't allowed to be

alone with her I missed the first three

and a half months of her life and nobody

asked

me if I needed help they showed up and

created an environment where I could get

better I had my parents drive out and

just stay and they just did laundry and

they cleaned and they did what needed to

be done and people who are struggling

they don't even know what they need and

so don't ask somebody what you can do

find something you can do show up with a

meal walk into your brother's bedroom

and pull open the curtains in the

morning when he's struggling with

depression so the sunlight comes in

create a playlist for

somebody pick them up like don't say you

want to meet at yoga say here's what

we're going to do I'm G to come over on

Saturday and pick you up and we're going

to go to that yoga class or I'm going to

come over on Sunday and I'm going to

watch the kids and the dog so you can go

to the park and read a book for two

hours that's how you create an

environment for someone else to get

better and the other way that you do it

is instead of judging you're going to

let them be who they are you're going to

let them struggle and then you're going

to use this technique that's incredibly

effective I labeled at the Abc so that I

could remember it first you're going to

apologize so let's talk about like this

is an issue I had with our son he didn't

seem motivated so I would constantly be

like why aren't you motivated why don't

you study hard why are you doing this

it didn't work yeah it doesn't work no

and so I finally a you're going to

apologize I'm sorry I'm pressuring you

I'm sorry I'm questioning you and then a

you're going to ask an open-ended

question how do you feel about this

issue and it doesn't matter what they

say because you're probably asking for

the first time how they actually feel

about the issue MH and then you're going

to ask a really important question

you're going to ask what would you like

to do about about it if anything and

their answers don't matter because what

you're doing by apologizing is you're

removing the pressure that you're

bringing and now by asking these

questions and I like to do this in a

carj because they're trapped and because

you're both looking ahead so it's not as

confrontational and there's something in

the science around forward ambulation

and the movement that actually opens up

your

thinking and then you

ask you know what do you want to do

about it if if anything and what happens

is you're now revealing this tension

because people that are stuck know it

people that are struggling know it

people who are failing at school know it

nobody wants to fail it's not like

people are trying to be depressed it's

not like people are trying to be very

unhealthy people know when they're

letting themselves go you don't need to

remind them but have you ever asked them

what would you like to do about this if

anything what happens in that question

with they answered or not is that

friction between what they know to be

true about what they desire and where

they actually are Rises up that is the

organizing intrinsic motivation that

somebody needs to want to do better and

then you got to do B back off that's the

hard part let them let them let them let

them let me shut up let them let them

let me not roll my eyes let me and

people need space

to have it be their idea and I'll give

you a quick example I used to be the

kind of person that would eat like that

would eat lunch and work on my computer

I'm like tapping on my computer shoving

a sandwich on my throat right and there

would be this colleague that would stand

up and go for a walk most days and every

time she came back she'd have smile on

her face and she' take her earbuds off

and she'd then get back to work and this

would go on for weeks and then finally

one day Jay I look up outside and it's a

nice day and I think I think I'm going

to go for walk now here's the

interesting thing I didn't credit her I

thought it was my

idea her example influence my desire to

do it the people that you are close to

need enough distance from you this is

why you have to back off for that

friction yeah and that stirring to sit

with them in order for them to feel safe

to be able to take the step forward and

then you better keep backing off because

you do not want to be like oh I saw you

inent in your T like that's going to no

and so you keep going let them and then

the C part is any small thing you

celebrate it in a non-passive aggressive

way and you actually model the change

you can't ask somebody to stop drinking

while you're pouring yourself a glass of

wine for sure you can't ask somebody

else to get healthy if you're sitting on

the couch eating chips so you model the

change and make it easy just like my

colleague did with the walk and just

like you and I constantly buy things

online because it looks so easy and

fun your behavior and backing off and

that tension inside them actually

creates the space for somebody to truly

want to

change and that's how it's done Mel I

want to thank you so deeply for writing

this book The let them

Theory a life-changing tool that

millions of people can't stop talking

about it's true uh Mel I've learned so

much from you today honestly and you've

connected so many dots to me I know I'm

going to be recommending this book to so

many people in my life because I really

believe it's the thing that's holding

them back yeah I want to thank you for

writing it I want to thank you for

pouring your heart into it I want to

thank you for just showing up so

brilliantly and emphatically today as

you always do and I'm just so grateful

to call you a friend and grateful to

know you in this journey called life and

genuinely so thankful that you're

constantly trying to find really simple

practical rules that all of us can apply

in our lives to make it easier and make

it a bit more livable but also Thrive so

thank you so much truly well I'm not as

smart as you Jay so I can't do the

intellectual stuff I got to find simple

things you kidding me well you know I

have to tell you I really appreciate

simple is beautiful and I truly accept

and feel how

heartfelt and honest those words are

because this is I think my legacy

I do I think that this is um the thing I

was supposed to figure out and leave the

world I believe it too thank you thank

you the best so are you if you love this

episode you'll love my interview with Dr

gabo mate on understanding your trauma

and how to heal emotional wounds to

start moving on from the P everything in

nature grows only where it's vulnerable

so a tree doesn't grow where it's hard

and thick does it goes where it's soft

and green and vulnerable