The cycles your dishwasher has might be wildly different - you should try 'em out

Hello. I've recorded over 24 hours of footage of this dishwasher, and I'm not going to make you watch all of it, but I've gone through most of it, and now I

know everything there is to know about this Frigid Air dishwasher.

If you got here without seeing the main channel video, there's a clicky thing.

Uh, the purpose of that video, there were two purposes. First, I announced a new dishwasher detergent product that I was very slightly involved in the development of. Really, I was just along

development of. Really, I was just along for the ride. This is a formulation of Matt Keezy and he sent it to an ASM testing lab to be blind tested against

two mainstream products, a bigname powder and a bigname pod. And well, the main reason I made the video is because I have been vindicated. I it doesn't

seem like I was wearing such a tinfoil hat anymore because we now know there's no reason powders cannot be excellent detergent products. And it sure seems

detergent products. And it sure seems like the bigname brands are not putting their best foot forward with the powder products they sell. And given that they

sell so many different kinds of detergent at wildly different price points, well, you know, they have an incentive to do that. So yeah, I'm just

going to leave it at that. Um, but I was right and I'm very happy to know I was right. Uh, so yeah, I really hope that

right. Uh, so yeah, I really hope that maybe there's going to be more and better powder options out there because anybody who's convinced that pods work better than powder, it's not because

pods are a better form factor. It's

because the manufacturers want it that way. But anywh who, the other reason I

way. But anywh who, the other reason I made that video uh was because in all the times I've made dishwasher videos, I have I keep saying for those of us in North America, you need to run the water

until it comes out hot before you start the dishwasher, but I never actually demonstrated the difference that makes.

And I did in that video. I also tested, this did not make it into the main video because it got out of hand. I also

tested the difference with my personal dishwasher at home between purging the cold water and not purging the cold water. My home has a pretty good run of

water. My home has a pretty good run of piping. Well, I mean a pretty short run

piping. Well, I mean a pretty short run of piping between the water heater and the kitchen sink. It has to go, it basically just has to cross the garage.

And I also suspect those pipes are insulated because the water stays hot for quite a while even after you you haven't used it. So, the dishwasher has

quite an advantage in my home. But even

still, if you don't purge the line, the wash water only gets to about I closed out of my document for some reason.

It didn't quite hit 80 if I didn't purge the line. But if I did purge the line,

the line. But if I did purge the line, it hit 95 when the detergent dispenser opened. Um, because the run of piping is

opened. Um, because the run of piping is short enough, I actually felt the pipe underneath the sink to see was it getting hot. It got hot before the

getting hot. It got hot before the dishwasher finished filling, but I would estimate it was only hot for about 20 seconds of the filling time.

Regardless though, actually purging the cold water meant that the main wash started at 95° and that also meant it had at least 10 more minutes of

effective washing time. Um because the the total amount of time in the main wash where the temperature was above 130 degrees was about 10 minutes longer, maybe a little more when I had purged

the water, purged the cold water. So, it

makes a really significant difference and it's yeah, it's something you really should be doing. If you're if you have not been in the habit of doing that and you think your dishwasher kind of

stinks, do that and see what difference it makes. But

it makes. But in making that video, I found the service data sheet. Well, really,

after installing these lights, which I did specifically to figure out what all the cycles do, I found this service data sheet, which explains what all the cycles do. That was annoying. But I

cycles do. That was annoying. But I

quickly realized the service data sheet is not quite correct. Um, for one thing, it doesn't show the light wash. It

doesn't explain what happens when you modify light wash and energy saver with the hightemp option, which you can do.

And the timing on the cycle chart is very wrong. The actual sequencing is

very wrong. The actual sequencing is correct. As far as everything I tested,

correct. As far as everything I tested, it's exactly correct with the sequencing, but the cycles are actually much longer than the charts say they are. Um, and I'm assuming that's because

are. Um, and I'm assuming that's because the software was revised at some point uh along this dishwasher's production run. Um, the board says 2009, but I

run. Um, the board says 2009, but I think the actual dishwasher was made in 2012. Uh, so yeah, that's probably what

2012. Uh, so yeah, that's probably what that difference is. But because of that difference, I thought fine, I'm going to do it anyway. I'm going to film every single one of this dishwasher cycles

with a temperature data logger in there, loaded up with dishes, and between every time I ran the test, I also pointed a box fan in there to make sure everything cooled down back to room temperature.

This was very thorough. Why did I do this? I don't know, but I did. And now

this? I don't know, but I did. And now

you get to benefit from it. In fact, the people who are really going to benefit from it are those of you out there who have a Frigidair FFBD2409 LS0B

or probably the last digits are different if you have a white one or a black one. But yeah, if you have this

black one. But yeah, if you have this Frigid Air dishwasher, oh boy, this video is for you. Uh, but I'm going to start. Well, the thing that I teased in

start. Well, the thing that I teased in the main channel video was the hightemp wash option. And I'm going to show you

wash option. And I'm going to show you the difference that that made for the peanut butter test because it was a huge difference. So, now I'm just going to

difference. So, now I'm just going to let this footage play while I tell you the story of where this dishwasher came from and why I didn't realize this was what it always does when you select

hightemp wash.

So, this dishwasher came from my previous home. And the reason why I

previous home. And the reason why I replaced it and turned it into a experimental machine with a hole in its side was because it was starting to go on the fritz. It would just stop washing

in the middle of a cycle. I would open the door and find it full of water and it wasn't giving any error lights or anything. It just turned off. And

anything. It just turned off. And

[snorts] very annoyingly, it did that. I seem to recall it did that at least a few times when I made the original videos because

I remember having some tests fail and now it didn't do it ever throughout all this testing. So apparently being

this testing. So apparently being unplugged for 5 years fixed something about it. Uh but anyway, the house this

about it. Uh but anyway, the house this came out of had a stupidly long run of piping between the water heater and the kitchen sink. It took over a minute to

kitchen sink. It took over a minute to get hot water at the kitchen sink, which was ridiculous. And because that kitchen sink, I mean, I think the faucet was a standard 2.2 gallon per minute

faucet. So, basically, there were over

faucet. So, basically, there were over two gallons of cold water just sitting in the pipes. And because the pipes went through the basement, they were going to cool off fast. And I knew the only way

this dishwasher is actually going to wash well is if I use that hightemp wash option. And so that's what I was in the

option. And so that's what I was in the habit of using it on. And I figured it was doing all these pre-washes because

it has a microprocessor. It's relatively

new. And it has a temperature sensor.

And I figured it's using that to determine how hot the water actually is.

And it keeps trying to refill itself with hotter water, but it's not getting any hotter. And so it finally gives up

any hotter. And so it finally gives up and moves on to the main wash. It wasn't

until I discovered that chart with all the cycles on there that I realized, oh, that's just what it always does. And in

a less nonsense house where there's a more modest run of piping, what this is going to do is every time it refills

with hot water again, the temperature in there suddenly jumps up by 10 to 15°.

And so by the time it fills the fourth time, the water temperature in there is probably about 100 degrees. Then it

switches on the heating element and keeps elevates it even more. And then it moves on to the actual main wash. And

because it does all that water changing and all that heating, it got rid of almost all of the peanut butter before the main detergent dispenser even

opened. I did use pre-wash detergent. I

opened. I did use pre-wash detergent. I

used a teaspoon of Matt's formulation for this test.

But most of it was probably drained away after five minutes. I think it's possible that like the the work that the enzymes maybe started

like No, I wouldn't think that's likely.

I think it's possible that the detergent lingered, the effects of it lingered is what I mean to say. I'm not testing this again without doing pre-wash detergent, but regardless, if there's something

like peanut butter that can be melted with higher temperatures, the hightemp wash option makes a huge difference. And

yeah, basically I was surprised how wildly different the hightemp wash option is compared to the normal wash program because it just says hightemp wash. Why would you expect it to do more

wash. Why would you expect it to do more than increase the temperature of the wash?

So, that's basically what opened that rabbit hole.

And between that and realizing that the chart doesn't actually explain anything, I figured I'll just go ahead and record every single cycle. So,

here's that. Not not we're going to show you every every single one, but I'm going to go through this machine cycles, explain what they all do, and also why

it's unmodified normal cycle is weirdly horrible. As often happens to me when I

horrible. As often happens to me when I work without a script, I forgot to explain several things. So, first I just want to point out that when we are watching these uh cycle indicators here,

the detergent dispenser light will light up two times during the cycle. first

when it dispenses detergent and again when it dispenses rinse aid. In this

machine, the detergent dispenser simply gets power two times. And either I thought Big Clive made a video on this mechanism. I just looked for it, but I

mechanism. I just looked for it, but I couldn't find it. So, I may just be confusing it with his video on wax motors because um I'm 98% sure this

dishwasher uses a a wax motor to open the detergent dispenser. The reason I think that is because it sends power to the dispenser for a solid minute and it takes like 20 seconds for the door to

actually open. So, what's probably

actually open. So, what's probably happening is it's sending power to a heating element which is melting some wax and the wax actually pushes out a little stubby thing which unlatches the

door. And either

door. And either when the door is shut, it doesn't dispense rinsaid. And then when the door

dispense rinsaid. And then when the door is open, some mechanical doodad causes it to dispense rinsaid. Or what I think is more likely, it just dispenses rinse

twice. It puts a little rinade in the

twice. It puts a little rinade in the water when it delivers detergent, which is technically going to help wash a tiny little bit, but not really. Um, but

regardless, I just wanted to point out the detergent dispenser. It's one device that gets power two times and it does two things, but I suspect it's

delivering rinsaid two times. Um, the

other thing with the cycle indicators, when you see the wash light blink out for a brief period of time, that is how this dishwasher and many others changes

which set of sprayers is actually getting water. It's a really clever

getting water. It's a really clever little mechanism. Basically,

little mechanism. Basically, the output of the wash pump, there's a little plastic ball that can slide back and forth and it either blocks one

passageway or another. And if it very briefly stops the pump, then the weight of the water moving back down into the

uh sprayer into the pump output, you know what I'm saying? the weight of the water pushes the ball backwards and then when it turns the pump right back on, it

plugs up the uh output to the main sprayers and it sends water out the back. I learned about this through a

back. I learned about this through a YouTube comment. I never looked into it.

YouTube comment. I never looked into it.

It's it's really clever. So what happens is you see it blink out for like a quarter of a second or a very brief period of time and then it switches to the top sprayers and then to switch back to the bottom sprayer it has to stop for

a couple of seconds. Let all of the water slowly settle back down to the bottom and then when it restarts the ball will have moved back to its original position. It's a clever little

original position. It's a clever little mechanism. My dishwasher at home because

mechanism. My dishwasher at home because it has a third rack and the top rack has these twirly little spinner things. It

actually has a three-way valve in the bottom and there's an actuator that moves um a flapper of some kind to redirect the water. But in this machine,

it's just this. It's devilishly simple.

Same with the detergent dispenser.

Really appliances are so simple.

Like part of why I'm fascinated by them is because it's just there's it's a very simple object, but the sequencing of what it does creates a very complicated

and effective thing if you know what I mean. Um but the so you see the main

mean. Um but the so you see the main wash blink out like that. That's it

switching between the two sets of sprayers. And a lot of dishwashers work

sprayers. And a lot of dishwashers work like that. Um at least dishwashers that

like that. Um at least dishwashers that you know made in the last 20 years or so. if it still has a clockwork timer.

so. if it still has a clockwork timer.

I'm assuming uh I think any dishwasher that has a clockwork timer, both sprayers work at the same time. Um and

it wasn't until electronics took over that they could do that clever trick with the ball thing. That's part of that's part of how dishwashers save water, but that's also part of why they've the cycle time has gotten much

longer. I was doing a little research to

longer. I was doing a little research to figure out, okay, I know that water usage regulations are a thing with dishwashers, and this thing's normal wash cycle has some ridiculous behavior

that I can only imagine is there because of those regulations.

And I discovered the regulations were loosened in 2013. It seems like they got tightened in the early 2000s and then were loosened in 2013, which is very

funny when you consider who was in office in the early 2000s and 2013.

Just a little bit of irony there for those that are always bent out of shape about water usage regulations. Um I the 2013 thing was from Reddit, so I don't know how true that really is. But the

point I want to make here is even if you're grumbly about how water usage regulations affected dishwashers, it generally only affects the normal cycle.

Uh this thing's other cycles all use more water, but its light wash cycle only uses about 15% more water, and its energy saver cycle only uses about 11

12% more water. So those other cycles are not a huge increase in water usage.

But which makes me think the main issue with this dishwasher is actually just whoever did the programming for the normal cycle doesn't understand what dishwashers do

because there are some absolutely nonsense decisions as far as far as what it does. But when I go through all these

it does. But when I go through all these cycles, I'm going to give you the total fill time in minutes and seconds and that is going to be the baseline water

usage. The way these meter the water,

usage. The way these meter the water, the fill valve is a throttle and so it should fill according to the data sheet at 0.87 gallons per minute. I have not

verified that it is actually filling at that rate, but I now I know through all this filming exactly how long the fill valve is open throughout each of these

cycles. And so I'm giving you a

cycles. And so I'm giving you a percentage of this is how much more these cycles use over the normal cycle.

The data sheet claims the normal cycle uses 4.9 gallons. Um, I feel like when I made my first video, it used a little over five. Uh, I'll put the number up.

over five. Uh, I'll put the number up.

I'll have to look that up. But, so these are percentages over that amount.

And here we go. So, here's the problem with the normal wash cycle. And as I've gone through all these cycles, really none of them are my version of ideal. I

would like to mix some of them together.

And you know, because this dishwasher only has six components, the only thing I didn't put an indicator for was the vent, which closes when it's running.

Because it only has six components, and they all run on 120 volts, you could very easily build a new control board for this thing and run your own software. You could do that for

pretty much any dishwasher, but don't look for me to how to do that. And you

have to be very careful if you're doing that. you need to really understand the

that. you need to really understand the sequencing of things and some of the limit switches and other things. But I'm

just throwing that idea out there. It

would be trivially easy to throw together an Arduino and a relay board and completely change how this dishwasher works.

But with the programming that it came with, the normal wash has 4 minutes and 56 seconds of total fill time. It uses

1.07 kilwatt hours of energy.

And it starts with a 15minute pre-wash.

That is the longest pre-wash of any of the cycles, but it is not heated at all.

After the pre-wash, it drains that water out and does what I call a halfass rinse. And this is what's nuts. I don't

rinse. And this is what's nuts. I don't

understand why it's doing this right now. I have no idea what this is going

now. I have no idea what this is going to do, but it opens its fill valve for just 26 seconds, which is only about a third of a full fill, and then runs the

wash pump in these really brief pulses, which just throw a little bit of water at only the stuff in the bottom rack.

Again, I don't know what this is supposed to do between the pre-wash and the main wash. And if I were designing this dishwasher, I would have just completely gotten rid of that. it could

use even less water by not doing this step. Or what I would do is I would use

step. Or what I would do is I would use that water and budget it for a different part of the cycle. But regardless,

that's the second thing it does. After

the pre-wash, it does this stupid half-ass rinse. I have no idea why. Then

half-ass rinse. I have no idea why. Then

it actually completely fills and goes on to the main wash, which it spends 58 minutes in.

I don't know why it's not an even hour, but it seems to be 58 minutes. The

temperature peaks generally at around 130 Fahrenheit, but it is a fixed timer for how long it runs the heating element. So, how hot it actually gets

element. So, how hot it actually gets depends on how hot the water that it fills with is and everything else that's in the machine.

Um, after the main wash, it drains out and does another halfass rinse. And this

is the fir. It calls it a pre-rin, but again, it doesn't actually spray anything on the top rack. And because

the next thing it does is a final rinse, anything that's in the main wash water that's stuck in the tubing or stuck in the top sprayers is going to be in the final rinse. That's the problem with the

final rinse. That's the problem with the normal cycle. It's only doing one and a

normal cycle. It's only doing one and a half rinses, whereas every other cycle does at least two. So, this machine's

normal cycle is just not good. But the

basic stats are four minutes and 56 seconds of total fill time, 1.07 kilowatt hours of energy. Um, a 15 minutee pre-wash with a pretty much one

hour main wash, but it's a fixed heating time and then it does a terrible job rinsing. So, don't use its normal cycle

rinsing. So, don't use its normal cycle without a modifier because it's just bad. Um, however, all of the other

bad. Um, however, all of the other cycles use more water. If I didn't say this before, when we're talking about the the cranky people about regulations,

because those other cycles are there, those are options. And two of them only use a tiny bit more water, but also have two complete rinses.

So, if I were you, I would use those.

Um, but I I forgot to make this note.

The temperatures that this dishwasher gets on the inside are it's at a disadvantage here because it's it's losing heat faster than it should. Um,

for one thing, it's just sitting out in open air, but also it's missing its sound insulation blanket. If this were actually installed in some cabinetry and it had that blanket, it would hold in

its heat a little better. So, understand

that the normal wash might get well beyond 130 Fahrenheit uh if it were actually properly installed in a cabinet, but that I'm sure would only

happen if it actually if you purged the water line and you were fairly lucky as far as how long the run of pipes was to your to your dishwasher. So, the reason I'm saying that is the temperature

differences are all relative. Throughout

all this testing, the temperature in the room was pretty consistent.

So, the relativity is what's important, but I do have to acknowledge that it's losing heat faster than it should. The

other thing to mention, I logged how many kilowatt hours of energy the dishwasher used, but because it's using hot water, the water heater is also using energy every time the dishwasher

fills itself. And this gets really

fills itself. And this gets really tricky to figure out energy costs because that's going to depend on the type of water heater you have. If you

have an electric water heater, uh it's going to cost almost exactly the same.

And that is actually an argument for not hooking up dishwashers to hot water. But

again, they would need to have wildly different wash programs here in the US in order to actually do that effectively. But if you have a natural

effectively. But if you have a natural gas water heater, uh then the cost is going to be lower. If you have a heat pump water heater, the cost is going to be lower. So, just understand that I'm

be lower. So, just understand that I'm only logging how much energy the dishwasher is pulling from the wall.

When it uses more water, it's using more energy because your water heater has to replenish the water that it took out.

Um, which is why it's extra funny that the energy saver cycle actually uses a little more water because it is actually going to be using a little more energy on top of the fact that it doesn't save

any energy from the normal cycle. Uh,

that's not a spoiler. I said that in the main video. So anyway, so yeah, I just

main video. So anyway, so yeah, I just want to make sure I point out I'm logging the energy use of the dishwasher, but the water heater that's sitting on the floor next to it, you

know, every time the dishwasher pulls a gallon of water out of it, it's just a little sixgallon point of use water heater. So it probably switches on every

heater. So it probably switches on every single time the dishwasher pulls water.

But the benefit of that tiny water heater is it heats very quickly. So, um,

it's not like the water heater ever ran out of water during this, in case anybody had that thought. The entire

cycle uses less water than what that water heater holds. But, as I've already showed you, if you select the high temp wash modifier, everything goes nuts and

it changes wildly. [snorts] You go from 4 minutes and 56 seconds of total fill time to 9 minutes and 40 seconds of total fill time. That's a 95% increase

in water usage.

Yeah, that seems overkill, but that's what it does. Um, the sequencing is a five minute pre-wash, then another five minute pre-wash, then another five minute pre-wash. They all have a

minute pre-wash. They all have a complete fill, then it moves on to a 10-minute pre-wash, which is actually heated.

And then, and uh, by the way, I'm talking about the time that it actually spends washing. It takes 30 minutes to

spends washing. It takes 30 minutes to go into the main wash, but that's because the time it spends filling and draining, I'm not counting. So, it's a five minute pre-wash, a fiveminute

pre-wash, a fivem minutee pre-wash, then a 10-minute heated pre-wash.

Then, when it drains that out, it does what I call a mini purge where it runs the drain pump and opens the fill valve at the same time. The purpose of that is

to get the last bit of water out from the sump. It's basically to create

the sump. It's basically to create another slug of fresh water to push everything out. It does that in the

everything out. It does that in the normal wash cycle too um a couple times.

And then it and then it does something really weird. So after the fourth

really weird. So after the fourth pre-wash, it fills again and then stops.

It sits there with the heating element on but without actually washing for three minutes.

This makes no sense to me because anything that's above the heating element that happens to have some food stuff stuck on it is going to get slightly baked by this. I who programmed

this thing? But anyway, after that 3

this thing? But anyway, after that 3 minute pause of nothing but heat, it moves on to a 52minute main wash with 45 minutes of heat. But there's an asterisk

because on this cycle it is actually trying to hit 140 Fahrenheit. So, I

observed the main temp wash peaked at 142 and then it basically it seems to have a fixed timer where once it hits that temperature, it then keeps washing

for a certain amount of time and then drains out. So, the main wash time is

drains out. So, the main wash time is going to vary when you are using the high temp wash option. But in this test, it was 52 minutes, 45 minutes of which

were heated. After it drains that out,

were heated. After it drains that out, it goes on to an 8 minute heated pre-rin.

And then there's a final rinse, which is 49 minutes with 46 minutes of heat. So

the total cycle time was 2 hours and 37 minutes. I had seven complete fills of

minutes. I had seven complete fills of water with three mini purges and none of those weird half-ass rinses. Again, that

only happens with the unmodified normal cycle.

So, the hightemp wash is a huge overkill over just normal wash. So, then let's move on to the light wash.

And here's where things start to get really strange. So, the light wash used

really strange. So, the light wash used 1.21 kilwatt hours of energy. That's

more than the normal wash. The uh

hightemp normal wash, if I didn't mention it, was 1.75 kilwatt hours. But

again, I put an asterisk there because that's going to change depending on how long it takes to actually get to 140.

For the light wash, it should be a fixed amount unless you select high temp. So,

the light wash was 1.21 kilwatt hours with 5 minutes and 40 seconds of total water fill time, which is only a 15% increase over the normal wash cycle. And

it sequencing is a five minute pre-wash.

I wish it were longer, but that's all you get. And then you move on to a 45

you get. And then you move on to a 45 minute main wash with 40 minutes of heated time heating time. And there's a small gap in the middle for some reason.

Who knows why? The observed temperature peak was 131.4.

And then after the main wash, we had an 8 minute pre-rin with a bit of heat in there for some reason. And then a 40-minute final rinse with 35 minutes of heat. Total cycle time was an hour and

heat. Total cycle time was an hour and 45 minutes. This had four complete

45 minutes. This had four complete fills, three mini purges, but most importantly, two full rinses. So, the

light wash is going to rinse way better than the unmodified normal wash, even though it only uses 15% more water.

This would honestly be my baseline wash cycle for this, except I wish I had a longer pre-wash. Again, I don't love

longer pre-wash. Again, I don't love anything. None of these cycles are

anything. None of these cycles are ideal, but then you can do the high temp modifier on the lightw wash cycle. And

here it actually makes sense because the only thing it does is make sure the main wash gets to 140 Fahrenheit. So the

water usage was identical. It was

[snorts] within one frame, 5 minutes and 40 seconds of total fill time. The

pre-wash was slightly shorter for some reason. I don't know why, but the main

reason. I don't know why, but the main wash went to an hour and four minutes and 59 minutes was heated. So again, it seems like it turns off the heating element and then drains five minutes

later. The peak uh temperature was

later. The peak uh temperature was 140.5, so it actually hit 140. And then

it did an identical pre-rin and the final rinse ended up being quite a bit longer, too. Um,

longer, too. Um, I'm guessing this was just because whoever programmed it figured people would want some evidence that the hightemp wash actually happened.

Personally, I'm annoyed by that. I don't

understand why it needs to make the final rinse go longer and heat longer, but it does. So, it goes from a 40-minute final rinse to an hour and

five. So the total cycle time was 2

five. So the total cycle time was 2 hours and 26 minutes, an hour or a half hour longer than the standard light wash cycle. Um, and the observed energy use

cycle. Um, and the observed energy use was 1.75 kilwatt hours. Again though,

asterisk that's going to that will change. It's not fixed like it is in the

change. It's not fixed like it is in the light wash. So honestly, if I were using

light wash. So honestly, if I were using this dishwasher as my everyday machine, I would use the light wash with the high temp. That would be my normal cycle. I

temp. That would be my normal cycle. I

think that's its best balance between water usage and energy usage and performance. Um, and uh to point

performance. Um, and uh to point something out I haven't pointed out yet.

I don't know how common enzyme based detergents were when this dishwasher was made. And so I think they were basically

made. And so I think they were basically just starting to come on the market. So

that might also be why the target temperature is only if you select high temp wash. Regardless, that's what it

temp wash. Regardless, that's what it is. My personal advice, if you have this

is. My personal advice, if you have this dishwasher, use the light wash cycle with hightemp wash selected most of the time. That's going to be its best cycle.

time. That's going to be its best cycle.

If you have a really dirty load, then I would use the normal wash with the high temp wash selected.

Okay, so then we have the energy saver cycle.

Infuriatingly, this uses the exact same amount of energy as the normal cycle.

Actually, it may be slightly more, but um it was 1.07 versus 1.08. So, I'm

going to consider that a rounding error, especially because if the voltage were a little higher during that test, it would use a little more energy.

The energy saver had 5 minutes and 30 seconds total fill time, which is 11 and a half in uh% increase. The savings of 10 seconds comes from the fact that it

only does two mini purges rather than three. So, the energy saver cycle is

three. So, the energy saver cycle is pretty much the same cycle as the light wash. It is a 4minute pre-wash.

wash. It is a 4minute pre-wash.

Then the only real difference is it doesn't do a mini purge after the pre-wash. Then it moves directly to the

pre-wash. Then it moves directly to the main wash which was 42 minutes. 37

minutes of which were heated. The

observed temperature peak was 127. Then

it went on to an 8minute pre-rin with some heat and a 35minut final rinse with 30 minutes of heat. Total cycle time was an hour and 40 minutes. Four complete

fills, two mini purges. That is

incredibly similar to the light wash.

It's basically four minutes shorter, one less mini purge, and the wash time was three minutes shorter. So, they're

almost the exact same cycle. However, if

you do the high temp option with the energy saver, nothing changes as far as its water usage or the cycling, but it makes again both the main wash and the

final rinse a little longer. The main

wash is 50 minutes with 45 minutes of heat and the final wash or the final rinse is 45 minutes with 40 minutes of heat. Here, however, I do not believe it

heat. Here, however, I do not believe it is trying to hit 140. The observed

temperature peak was 135.3 and the fact that the main wash was 50 minutes exactly with 45 minutes exactly of heat seems to me like that's just another

fixed timer. So the energy saver with

fixed timer. So the energy saver with the high temp wash selected is really basically just heating a little longer.

It's not actually trying to go for a target temperature. So the energy saver

target temperature. So the energy saver cycle on this thing is dumb. It is not really doing anything different from the light wash and the high temp option

doesn't work as well as the light wash.

So never use the energy saver cycle because it's dumb.

Yeah. It saves a tiny bit of water.

That's it. And it uses more water than the normal wash, which is great. Okay,

then the last thing, the last like new cycle was the heavy wash, which here, first note, high temp wash is on by default, and you can't turn it off. So,

the heavy wash cycle is always going to go to at least 140 Fahrenheit. It had 10 minutes and two seconds of total fill time, which is a 103% increase over the

normal wash. So, it's a little more than

normal wash. So, it's a little more than high temp normal.

And it and this is what is really annoying. It starts with just a

annoying. It starts with just a threeinut pre-wash. So, if you want the

threeinut pre-wash. So, if you want the heavy wash cycle and you want to use pre-wash detergent, it's not really helping that much. So,

it starts with a three-minute pre-wash, goes to a six-minute pre-wash with the mini purge afterwards, then a seven minute heated pre-wash, and then it moves on to the main wash. So, the heavy

wash has one less pre-wash than hightemp light, but it has another rinse. It has uh actually has does it have three rinses?

One, one. Yeah. Yes, it has four rinses.

So, the heavy wash has one less pre-wash, but two more rinses. It loves

to rinse. I don't really again why I can't I mean maybe if you actually had a load like I put in there with all that peanut butter you need four rinses but that

seems excessive.

So anyway the heavy wash sequence it's a little more water 3 minute pre-wash 6 minute pre-wash 7 minute heated pre-wash than a 50inut pre uh main wash 50 main

wash with between 45 and 48 minutes of heat. I wrote it that way because it did

heat. I wrote it that way because it did the same just heating for no reason for a while. The observed temperature peak

a while. The observed temperature peak was 141.1.

Then we move on to a 7-minute pre-rin. A

7-minute pre-rin with 2 minutes of heating. A 7-minute pre-rin which is

heating. A 7-minute pre-rin which is heated throughout. And then a 55minut

heated throughout. And then a 55minut final rinse with 50 minutes of heat. All

of these cycles, I wonder why it's heating so much in the final rinse, but whatever. So the total cycle time for

whatever. So the total cycle time for the heavy wash was 2 hours and 49 minutes. had eight complete fills of

minutes. had eight complete fills of water with three purges and used 1.78 kilowatt hours of energy. But again,

there's an asterisk because that's going to change depending on what's in there, uh, how hot the water comes in. It's

trying to hit 140°.

So, those are all the cycles. Nope,

that's not all. I forgot to talk about two things. First, I did film what this

two things. First, I did film what this thing does when you select the delay start option because I wanted to know is it going to try to heat the pre-wash or do something to help compensate for the

fact that you're not going to be able to purge the water line before it starts itself. And the answer, at least for

itself. And the answer, at least for this model, is no. So, for those of you out there that use the delay start

option, um you probably need to select the hightemp wash modifier or something in order for your dishwasher to actually wash as well as if you had purged the

water line before you started it.

[snorts] And personally, I'm very annoyed that this dishwasher works like that because it basically means the delay start option is either useless or

you have to select a cycle which is going to use way more water. So again,

this is just one dishwasher model.

There's no nothing to suggest that all dishwashers work like this, but the cycle ran identically to if it were just the standard normal cycle. Now, I will

say I had it hooked up to hot water and because the water heater is right next to the sink, uh here it got hot water right away, and I suppose it's possible

it's program would have realized that, but I doubt it based on everything else we've seen. The other thing I tested was

we've seen. The other thing I tested was what changes when you select the sanitize option. On this machine, you

sanitize option. On this machine, you can only select sanitize on the normal wash or the heavy wash. And when you select sanitize, it forces on hightemp

wash. So with this machine, sanitize is

wash. So with this machine, sanitize is going to do way more washing, way more rinsing. It's going to use about double

rinsing. It's going to use about double the amount of water as the standard light wash with the highte option selected. But the reason why I wanted to

selected. But the reason why I wanted to test this really was because the button says sanitize wash. And really it should probably sanitize the final rinse. And

another thing I wanted to test with this was the data sheet says the sanitized light will only come on if it actually meets the sanitized temperature by the end of the cycle. And it did not come on

when I did this test. And this is another point to suggest that it's losing too much heat in this situation.

It was ideally situated as far as getting hot water right away, but sitting out in open air like this, it's just losing too much heat and it looks

like it's programmed to only run the heating element for an hour. And if it doesn't meet the sanitized temperature by that time, it gives up and will not light up the sanitized light. But in

general, the only thing the sanitize option does is it extends the final rinse and make sure that the final rinse hits I think it's 150. Uh let me check

the data sheet. Yeah, the data sheet says 150 Fahrenheit plus orus 5°. So it

is looking for the final wash temperature to reach 150. If it does, it will light the sanitized light, but if it doesn't, it will not light the sanitized light. But that's the only

sanitized light. But that's the only difference. The final rinse is extended

difference. The final rinse is extended with more heat to try to hit 150. In

this case, it did not hit that, but it's because it's sitting in open air in a somewhat cold warehouse rather than wrapped in a blanket under some cabinets. So, those are all the cycles.

cabinets. So, those are all the cycles.

They're all so different. Well, the

energy saver and the light wash are very similar, but if if you have a dishwasher that you're not happy with and you're not trying the other cycles, you got to

try the other cycles. Um because and I don't mean to say that like why are you being so incurious or whatever. It

doesn't make sense that this dishwasher's hightemp wash would change so much. So, what I mean is seriously

so much. So, what I mean is seriously try the other cycles because they may not do what they say they do. It might

not make any sense. It's

Yeah, it's kind of maddening that the dishwasher is it behaves like this. And

like I said, if I were if I were programming it, I would not have done any of this. I Here's what I would do if I had this dishwasher. I

would have it do a 15minute pre-wash. I

might even add some heat when that happens. I think there might be some

happens. I think there might be some logic of not heating the pre-wash water because like it might burn some stuff on the heating element maybe. But

regardless, I would do a 15minute pre-wash, then move directly to the main wash with a mini purge. I would not not that stupid half-ass rinse. I mean, just

drain that water out, open the fill valve for a while while draining, then go right to the main wash. Do that for an hour. Hit 45. Make sure you hit 140.

an hour. Hit 45. Make sure you hit 140.

Then drain out the main wash water. Do

one pre-rinse.

Drain that out. And then do a final rinse. I think it should just be four

rinse. I think it should just be four fills of water, not three and a half or whatever weird nonsense it's doing. So for this

dishwasher to I'm repeating myself but my general advice would be light wash with the hightemp wash selected is

probably the best cycle the best balance for 99% of wash loads. If you have really difficult stuff, you can use the normal wash with high temp selected, but

that is almost the same thing as the heavy wash option, which uses much, much more water than the light wash option.

So, I think that's the end.

If you uh you don't have to install blinking lights like I did, you can just listen to what your dishwasher is doing.

Uh it would be helpful to have a temperature data logger or something if you wanted to verify the temperatures that it gets to. But

yeah, it's the cycles are so much more different than you might think depending on the dishwasher you have. And that's

what's frustrating about this and about this whole concept is not only have dishwashers evolved over time, but dishwasher detergent has

evolved over time. And now that the market is like 98% pods, dishwasher manufacturers are probably skewing their programs more towards a single dose of

detergent, which annoys the crap out of me. Um, but it also means right that

me. Um, but it also means right that I'm very like basically my suspicion is that you could use way less detergent if

you had a longer pre-wash and a longer hotter main wash and you actually used two detergent two small detergent doses.

The difficulty here is all these variables are changing at the same time.

And so if you have a dishwasher that's like 15 years old, perhaps it has a really bad normal cycle because the water regulations were too strict. Uh

but then if you have a dishwasher that was just made, like my KitchenAid at home, it only does a 10-minute pre-wash, which honestly is probably fine given how quickly the butter released.

That's probably fine, but I would like the pre-wash to be heated. Personally,

if there's unless there's a reason that would damage the heating element, I would like the pre-wash to be heated.

Um, I do not know whether my KitchenAid at home heats the pre-wash water or not, actually, because I don't have Well, actually, I think it's just

plugged in under the kitchen sink. So, I

could plug it into a kilowatt. I should

probably do that.

I don't have a load of dishes to run tonight, so that's not happening before this video gets uploaded. If I if I could, I would do it. But no. Uh

although I say that as if I didn't just run 10 cycles with nothing through.

Anyway, um I if if you put me in charge of designing additional and and I keep repeating myself, it took a lot longer to compile all this

stuff than I thought it was going to. So

I'm here later than I wanted to be. Um,

but it it's just it's hard to know, right? I don't want to use pods ever, ever. I want loose powder. That's just what I want to use.

powder. That's just what I want to use.

So, it's frustrating not knowing that.

Are newer dishwashers being designed to avoid the pre-wash cycle because so many products just don't allow you to do

that? And remember, we've uncovered

that? And remember, we've uncovered those little samples of detergent you get when you buy a dishwasher.

The manufacturers are being paid by the detergent, the co-arketing agreements, as they say on the like the number one recommended brand or whatever, as the result of co-arketing agreements. Those

recommendations are not because they're actually testing these detergent products. is because the name brands are

products. is because the name brands are saying "Hey suggest this."

suggest this." So, it's really difficult to know, right? If all the main if if the big

right? If all the main if if the big detergent companies out there are only putting their best foot forward on their highpriced products that are pre-dosed,

then it could very well be that the dishwasher manufacturers are just trying to make their machines work best with that reality. And those of us that

that reality. And those of us that actually understand what dishwashers do and want to optimize the amount of detergent for the sequence

that is ideal are just screwed.

And so that's the main reason I'm happiest there's another powder option.

And we have proven powders are only bad because the manufacturers don't want them to be good. It seems like anyway.

And this would follow with my experience which is genuinely I have consistently better results buying store brand powders than name

brand powders. I had previously put I

brand powders. I had previously put I know I had one batch of a name brand I've talked about this before but again I'm avoiding naming brands just in case given what I'm talking about now but I

have had one box of a name brand powder which led left a horrible residue and that never happened has never happened with Walmart's great value

powder and when you consider that Walmart doesn't have the incentive to make their

powder worse than their alternatives that other companies do.

Again, it doesn't seem like my experience is that outlandish. I'll just put it that way.

But thanks for watching. I think this is the capstone to the dishwasher saga.

Unless there's I don't know what else I could do. We've

proved it. Bad detergents are bad. not

because they're powders, but because they want them to be.

And uh and I don't know, I just think the world would be a little better if you let people control things and you, you know, were helping people understand their

machines.

And I have gotten some uh I got some feedback from Patreon members in Europe that like, yeah, the European market is moving away from pre-wash because they're really trying to clamp down on

water usage. And I got to say,

water usage. And I got to say, I don't like having this opinion, but if you're trying to get a dishwasher to use less than five gallons of water, you might be going a little too far. It's

kind It's kind of nuts to me that we're we're trying to make dishwashers use so little water when like if you take a five minute shower, you'll have used more water than a dishwasher almost

certainly. Unless you have a really low

certainly. Unless you have a really low flow shower head, you're going to have used less water because the fill valve on this is87

gallons per minute. So if you have a a two gallon per minute shower head, it's more than double the flow rate. So,

a five minute shower is more water than its long its worst cycles. Anyway,

that's more like an opinion, but like I do I don't like having this opinion, but I do think we might be going a little too far with dishwashers. Um, especially

because right like rinsing is important not just for the cleanliness of the dishes, but pipes. you're gonna have sludge buildup over time if you're not

using enough water to rinse things. So,

I don't know. I don't know what the standards are for toilet flushing in Europe now, but like I think here they're down to 1.1 gallons per flush.

Is it 1.2?

But it's still to me it's just like, okay, I typically flush the toilet three times a day, something like that. Just me. So,

one person's typical toilet usage can be a whole family's nightly dishwasher usage if it uses five gallons of water.

I don't know. I just think we might dishwashers might be getting a little too strangled in ways that are bad for the the purpose of washing dishes. So, I

don't know there I I actually do think it might be worth re-evaluating those water regulations for those of you in Europe and whatever they are now. And

well, now here I think they've been loosened even more, but certainly five gallons per wash load could be great.

You really just need two complete rinses. The nonsense this Frigid Air is

rinses. The nonsense this Frigid Air is trying to do is completely ineffective.

But now I'm gonna stop. Bye.