The One Rule I NEVER Break Even After Becoming Youngest Self-Made Woman Billionaire | Lucy Guo

My daily routine is essentially waking

up between like 5:30 a.m. to 6 o'clock

a.m. every day. And I quite literally

just roll out of bed, then I go straight

to Berries. And one thing about me is I

literally got my house specifically

because it's 5 minutes away from Berries

and 5 minutes from the office. So I can

reduce my commute and I don't really

need a car, which is awesome. I shower

and I hit work. Afterwards, I'm usually

just in like backtoback meetings. I try

to sometimes block off time because like

I need to like be in Figma and like

actually get feedback on design because

I'm usually working until maybe like 8

o'clock, nine o'clock. I'll get dinner,

then I'll go back to work, and then um

I'll fall asleep sometime between like

11:00 p.m. to 1:00 a.m. depending on the

day, and then repeat. You know, in YC,

they tell you you should only be doing

three things, which is like working out,

talking to customers, and building. I

see like why working out is so important

because it puts you on a schedule, tests

your discipline. like no matter how

shitty I'm feeling, I will still get up

and go out and work out because I know

I'm going to feel better and have more

energy to be better at my job the rest

of the day. So why my life looks like it

is today, but like don't sit still

essentially. I don't waste time

scrolling through Tik Tok, watching TV,

watching movies, etc. And I think by not

sitting still, I've been able to really

be efficient with my time and invest it

in things that make me happy.

Hi, I'm Lucy Glow. I am the founder of

Scale AI and passes back in capital

Capital and HFZ. I angel invest. I've

invested in over a 100 different

companies. Um, and I'm excited to chat

with you guys today.

I think in terms of like how it's

potentially changed my life. Um, my DMs

are popping.

Not life-changing, but it's been cool. I

mean, I think overall probably just like

what makes me happy. Um, everyone's

like, "Okay, cool. Like what are you

buying with your money, etc." But like

at the end of the day like what makes me

happy is like what drives every single

thing I do. Um whether it's like you

know building passes because it makes me

happy because it provides challenges in

my life but I also get to like you know

change people's lives. So at passes were

building infrastructure for creators to

monetize their brand. So I think when

you look at the largest creators they

really are like unicorns. For example

Kim Kardashian built skims. Logan Paul

built Prime. Mr. Beast with Fastables.

I'm excited for us to eventually build a

unicorn creator.

[Music]

I think I got suspended from

kindergarten to be quite honest. I think

it came from like me telling the teacher

that what we were learning was dumb. But

if you think about it, like my parents

were trying to teach me like I was going

to like abacus competitions like

multiplication, division, etc. back in

like kindergarten. And in school they

were literally like here's the alphabet,

right? Um, and I was just very bored as

a child. So, I was always trying to

figure out like different things to do.

I was like learning stuff on my own.

Specifically, like the stuff I learned

was to like make money. But eventually,

I discovered my love for product and I

was like, "Oh, this is actually really

fun." Um, but you could see glimpses of

it where like, you know, I tried to

start my own virtual pet site after

being addicted to Neopets. I was playing

a lot of online video games. I was

figuring out how to start my own online

arcade game website. I mean, I think

what really shaped how I'm an

entrepreneur today is that through like

the early stages of me like making

money, my parents found all of my hidden

cash and would take it away. So then I

was like, I have to like figure out how

they don't take away cash. PayPal had

come out and then you could just go like

buy a Visa debit card, open up a PayPal

account and that's when I started

learning how to make money on the

internet and then that's when I got

curious about building my own websites

and then like that kind of led to

hackathons and then I would say like the

turning point of like real

entrepreneurship and like wanting to

build lasting companies like more than

just bots, right? Um was at these

hackathons where suddenly I was exposed

to startup world and I was like wow I

can build apps that like millions of

people use this is really really cool.

Both my parents are absolutely

brilliant. They're both technical. I

think it was interesting because they

actually really discouraged me from

pursuing a technical field because they

kind of imagined like my place as a

woman was to get married and pop out

grandchildren, but they still wanted me

in an intelligent environment to find an

intelligent partner. I think I ended up

pursuing it almost by accident. Um, I

thought I was going to be a chemical

engineer because I was like like

chemistry was my favorite subject. like

I loved AP chemistry and I was very good

at it. But when I I ended up on this

website, College Confidential, like I

need help with my college applications

and um there's this random stranger who

literally looked at my extracurriculars

and it was like you're an idiot. If you

want to get into best college, just

apply for computer science and I was

like, I guess that makes sense. So

that's actually like kind of how I just

landed in computer science. My college

days are like I was going to a lot of

hackathons. So like you know every few

weeks M hacks hack MIT quite literally

every hackathon I like was like I'm

going to go to and then I made a lot of

friends and I say this because like I

might be biased but um like when I was

first hiring like the first people I

went to were the friends I made in

college and they didn't even ask any

questions which is concerning. They

definitely should have asked how much

their equity was worth, but um they were

just like, "Yeah, like we'd love to come

work with you." YOLO. Right. And that

was cuz there was that trust that was

gained in college. When you're building

your next company, um your network is

your net worth and like you're going to

be able to hire the friends that you

made in college and you know they're

good.

I I think if I didn't have a rebellious

nature, I probably would have been the

good girl that my parents wanted me to

be and stayed in college, right? And

like I knew I was hurting them when

going to um do this, but I think that

like part of the rebellious nature was I

want to prove you wrong and show you

that I can forge my own path and I will

be successful without college. Um so I'm

sorry I'm hurting you right now, but

like it'll be worth it at the end of the

day. Um I don't think I ever doubted it.

And what helped me commit was just

thinking like this is not a risk at all.

Um like college is always going to be

there versus this is a once in

a-lifetime opportunity and I'm going to

be learning a lot. I feel like I'm not

learning practical skills in college and

everything that I've learned was through

like hackathons, right? So, if I leave

college and I dive myself in the startup

world, I am going to learn significantly

more and be able to like actually build

products that millions of people use

versus learning theoretical skills that

like I'm probably not going to use in my

job. Um, so I was pretty like dead set

on it early on. I think my conviction

was to optimize learning. So, I've

always like that's been my number one

rule in life. Like even if you are

leaving something, it feels like a risk.

It's not that much of a risk if you're

optimizing learning because your

knowledge is always going to be worth

something. And the more knowledge you

gain, the more valuable you are later on

in life. I think the reaction I got from

most people was, "You're a

idiot." From my parents to my friends to

like people who didn't know me. Um

people were just like, "Yo, like what

are you doing?" A lot of it stem from

the fact that I actually only had four

CS classes left to graduate, like one

year left, right? So I think the like

risk mental calculation didn't really

make sense for others but for me I was

like what am I I'm losing time right but

like what's the worst case scenario I

take a job what's the second worst case

scenario I go back to college I chose

like to optimize for that learning and

like optimize for being in a network of

like extremely ambitious intelligent

people

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I think at SNAP I really learned how to

think much bigger. Um, like when I first

joined Snap, I didn't realize like kind

of the vision Evan had for Snap. And it

was very inspiring seeing like his ideas

on how he would eventually compete with

Amazon, um, compete with Google, etc.,

which I think like no one even to this

day thinks about Snap competing with

Amazon or Google. But to see him think

so innovatively about product and not

care about like that AB test portion of

things taught me just a lot about like

the importance of being open-minded and

like product driven as well and really

about like perfection. Um I the lesson I

really took away from that is like just

get to 90%. You don't need to spend 3

years going back and forth on a design.

Um, but also like I remember there was

like that zoom out the snap mapaps

feature that like no one at the company

wanted to build because everyone thought

it was so dumb and he was just like kept

on insisting it and it turns out like he

was right at the end of the day, right?

Um, it ended up like being a very

natural UX that people love and use.

That really almost tells you also that

like people don't really know what they

want in the consumer field, right? Like

it might sound like the dumbest thing,

but you really just have to like kind of

give it a go. Um hence like why he was

probably just like you know just

thinking eventually like don't think

about like all this like research

feedback etc because um if he did that

like that would have never been shipped

but like once it got into the hands of

people um they realized like oh I

actually I wanted this but no one could

have told you that. When you come up

with a product spend like 2 weeks

designing it and then ship it and see

how it does and if there's traction then

go and iterate and improve on it. But

people will use products they want to

use even if it's super buggy and the UX

is shitty for the most part. So um it's

better to ship that like 90% with like

no user research and then double down on

the product like if it gets traction

versus wasting like months doing all

this research etc and shipping it and

like it might fall flat. I mean I would

say it's like risk benefit analysis and

then am I learning right? So for example

like when I was at Snap I was giving up

a few million dollars but I also was

like that's not life-changing for me.

So, I would rather optimize learning and

also have the opportunity to make

life-changing money. And if I don't make

that life-changing money, um, at least I

learned a bunch of like new knowledge

and I'll be able to like hop to my next

job and make more. And all I'm losing is

like what, one to two years because

that's the amount of time it would take

to like figure out like am I going to

like be able to build this company

unless you're crazy. Like I have friends

that like, you know, pivoted for like

six years and then finally found

something which like those are obviously

the founders I love investing in. If I

were making like a hund00 million at

SNAP, like would I have made that jump?

Like I'm going to be realistic. Probably

not. I probably been like that's

life-changing money. It is worth staying

four years for $100 million before

moving on. Um so, um I would say like

those two things are like my criteria

when choosing like when to make moves.

We were both working at Kora and like I

think it was literally over lunch we

were like, "Huh, should we start a

company together one day?" I was like,

"Yeah, let's do it." And then over like

winter break, we started iterating on

ideas. So um we came up with a horrible

one. Class passed for clubbing and you

know it got traction but you know it's

bad when it's only VCs that are

subscribing to your service. And then we

were like okay let's go do something

more meaningful. So um we pivoted to Ava

which is um a healthcare app that we

help you find like the best doctors for

specific procedures. So it's like oh you

need a root canal. Here is like the best

person to give you a root canal. Um,

also a terrible idea, but the idea ended

up getting us into YC. Um, I think

mostly because I knew we were going to

get into YC because I was like talking

to um, YC partners before the interview

and after the interview and they were

just like, "Oh yeah, like you'll get in

because like you guys are both super

smart. You're obviously at SNAP and a

teal fellow and he is like you know

MIT." So yeah, we uh, entered YC and

then the idea was terrible. So we ended

up pivoting to scale.

I think like generalized my most painful

failures have been trusting people that

I shouldn't have trusted which is just

not great. Um especially in the

workplace for example like you might

trust an employee and then like when

they underperform and you need to fire

them they decide to try to extort you.

It's just like you need to make sure

that like be like you don't want people

where like you constantly feel like

they're going to like stab you in the

back on figuring out on who to trust.

This is very cliche but go with your

gut. Um, but outside of going with your

gut, like you should definitely just do

like reference checks on both like

friends, like people that know them or

like people that aren't even friends,

you know, like acquaintances cuz like

you're probably going to get a more

honest answer from acquaintances. I

think the best way to build trust again

is like be extremely authentic. But at

the end of the day, if like trust is

broken, like sometimes it can't be

repaired and that's when you know that

like you might just need to separate and

maturity is understanding that.

I think the team self motivates themsel

but it's innovation when they see that

like we can ship a product in two weeks

and it takes a large company like that's

stagnant like years to ship a product

that's extremely exciting for the team

especially when like you tie that

product to actual revenue numbers and I

think it's just constantly emphasizing

that and I think that's why a lot of

engineers choose to work at startups

instead of larger companies because they

feel like they have more impact. Impact

is what motivates them because they're

not going to get that same impact at a

large company. leaders need to be doing

IC work as well because the only way you

can judge people on like their actual

job is if you do the job yourself and

like really it's all hands- on deck like

nothing is too big to be done. So for

example like everyone was on intercom

when we got a pilot for like a new

customer quite literally we'd have a war

room with like engineers like me etc.

And like we'd all be labeling that data

and making sure it's perfect. We really

emphasize like nothing is below you.

you're going to do what's best for the

company. And if like your time is best

being spent like helping close this

deal, then like you're going to do that.

Let's say you're running customer

support and you're not doing the

customer support tickets yourself,

you're not going to know if your

customer support reps are answering them

fast enough, giving the correct answers

or like if you know if it's not obvious

answer like should they know this the

answer to this or is it like something

more obscure? And you really only get

that like muscle if you you do the work.

I think the number one thing I look for

is like intelligence and hard work

because you can be the smartest person

ever, but if you don't work hard, you're

going to not impact a company. Hard work

is extremely important to me, especially

cuz like with creators, we're very

creator first. That's our culture. Which

means that like because creators can be

24/7. We need to be 24/7. Like if a

creator hits me up at like 2 am like

about a bug, I'm proud to say that I can

call my engineers like and one of them

will pick up and fix that bug at 2 am,

which is incredibly important in an

industry like this. Um, and I look for

people that are willing to like go the

extra mile. That's not saying like you

have to work every weekend, but like if

needed, like are you going to show up?

Yeah. I mean, I think as a leader, one

of my like biggest values in life is

just kindness. It's like you're wanting

the best for everyone, right? Like if

someone wins, awesome. Like if I lose an

amazing engineer, um I still want to

help them like succeed. If I lose a

crappy engineer, I still want to help

them succeed. For me, I'm like I think

I'm very giving as like both a person

and a leader. So it's like, okay, like

you know, I give you chances. I like try

to you're not working out in your role,

but I think that you're hardworking and

smart. I try to find like a role that

like you might be better suited for.

So I would say it was a mix of things.

Um, I think what inspired me was

actually living with all the founders.

Like their energy definitely grew on me

and I wanted these founders to start

bases, but no one would do it. And

around the same time, I had a friend who

asked me to be CEO of his AI company.

And I kind of sat on it like I kind of

got excited, right? I was like, "Oh my

god, like I feel ready to be a founder

again." Uh cuz I think a lot of the

reason why I wasn't I didn't do it

sooner was cuz I was scared of failure.

But I finally got to a point where I was

like, you know what? If I fail,

whatever, it doesn't matter. like my

life is going to be fine. most people

don't build two successful startups like

don't be scared of failure and just go

and do the thing right and I didn't feel

like doing an AI company again to be

quite honest I was like I did B2B

enterprise I know how it works but I

would rather like if I'm doing a second

company and like risking failure at

least have fun doing it and I had always

been attracted consumer you can see this

with like a bunch of different like

random apps I had made Snap was like one

of the most fun experiences of my life

so uh I like just knew I wanted to do

consumer and I had been sitting on this

idea idea for a little bit. So, I was

like, "Okay, like let's see some

competitors out there." And really, you

could only find like Patreon. They've

existed for a decade and I saw like an

opportunity in the market. Um, I was

friends with a lot of creators. Um, I

lightly asked my creator friends like,

"Hey, if I were to build this, would

they you use it?" So, you know, like

selling before building, they're like,

"Absolutely." I was like, "Great." And

then I just talked to my LPs and they

were like, "Here is money. Um, go

build." So, um, it all happened really

quickly. like I would say within the

span of like 24 hours of my friend

asking me to like be CEO of his AI

company and me having like commitments.

So the future I see for the creator

economy I think that like AI is really

going to help creators be co-pilots. I

see more creators becoming

entrepreneurs. More kids want to be

creators than ever before. So I think

the creator economy is going to grow but

also everyone like creator marketing

spend is going up in like pretty much

every country. And I think this is due

to the fact people are realizing like

their audience and like the like reach

you get is much stronger spending it on

creator marketing versus on ads. So, I

think because of this, um, we're going

to see more creators work so closely

with brands that they're essentially

considered co-founders or start their

own brands, which is why I think like

unicorn creators are possible and like

we're excited to help them either get

access the best brands and like get that

equity for long-term generational wealth

or if it makes sense to like help them

build that next product.

I think if 20-year-old me could go back

in time, I would stop complaining about

some of the people I work with and just

start really like getting to know them

better and uplifting them. Why do I

think so? Um, I think that like in

general most companies are very gossipy,

right? So, if you're complaining about

people, like it just gets around and

then it drives them away obviously

because they hear about complaints like

no one wants to be talked badly about.

And I think like the best work

environments and the most positive ones

are when you are like everyone's

cheerleader. So, uh I think I would have

like spent more effort like seeing the

good in people. This is going to sound

very LA, but I feel like I have like

manifested everything in my life. And

because I'm like focus so much on

positive energy, I feel like as long as

I like put in that hard work to like

bring my dreams to life and like

surround myself with positive people,

like anything is possible. so cheesy,

but I really like do believe that's

true. And like I have like the best

friends in the world that, you know, are

constantly around me and encouraging me

and like really doing whatever they can

to help. Like they'll go out of my way.

They're like truly incredible. And I

think that like when I have like such

positive people around me, like I only

look at like upside