The Words of the Year 2025 📖 with Amber & Paul [968]

Hello listeners, welcome back to Luke's English podcast. How are you doing today? I hope you're doing fine. So, I'm publishing this episode on the 25th of

today? I hope you're doing fine. So, I'm publishing this episode on the 25th of December, which is actually Christmas Day. Merry Christmas. Hello. Even if you don't uh celebrate Christmas, um I will wish you uh all the best for this um end

of year period. And yeah, this is a a funny time of year for a lot of people.

Um it's kind of like yes, the end of 2025, the beginning of 2026. I'm

assuming that you're listening to this around the time that it's published.

Most of the time, uh, most episodes of my podcast, uh, get most of their that most of the listening happens. I mean, most people listen, um, a rambly introduction already. Most

people listen to a new episode within the first couple of weeks that it's published. So, I imagine that you're listening to this at the end of 2025,

published. So, I imagine that you're listening to this at the end of 2025, beginning of 2026. And it's at this time of year, you know, at the end of the year that we we look back on the year that we've just had and uh kind of

reflect on it, and then we start to look forward to the upcoming year. Um, that's

certainly where I am. You know, we have our New Year's Eve and New Year's Day at the end of December, beginning of January. So, it's a it's to an extent it's a weird limbo land. I mean, a kind of in between zone. Um, so it can be a

slightly funny time of year, a bit of a strange time of year. It can be nice at this time of year to just kind of get away from everything and just cocoon yourself somewhere nice and cozy and maybe escape from all that family

madness and take some time, maybe just to listen to this new episode of Luke's English podcast. So I'm very happy to be with you uh here today here and now. So

English podcast. So I'm very happy to be with you uh here today here and now. So

this episode is is all about the words of the year which is always an interesting subject and relevant subject for an end of year episode of the podcast. I'm actually reading from paper notes here. I actually wrote these notes

podcast. I'm actually reading from paper notes here. I actually wrote these notes down with a pen on a piece of paper which seems like it's from some ancient

past time like some old era like the Victorian era where I've been sitting by candle light writing something with a with an old pen um rather than writing on a screen. But anyway, the words of the year, always an interesting and

relevant subject for an endofear episode, I think. And uh I've done this lots of times before. So I'm talking about So what are the words of the year?

I will explain it in proper detail in a moment with Amber and Paul, but basically we're talking about 10 words chosen by Collins dictionary. I've gone

for Collins dictionary this time, but other dictionaries uh published their words of the year. For example, last year uh with Amber, I talked about the Oxford dictionary words of the year. Um this year they just published three

whereas Collins have done 10. Um and so I've gone for the Collins list. Uh 10

words chosen by Collins dictionary that reflect the cultural zeitgeist.

Uh zeitgeist is an interesting word. It's it's originally a German word but we use it in English as well. The zeitgeist means the spirit of the times, right? The feeling or spirit of this current moment right now. And so these

right? The feeling or spirit of this current moment right now. And so these words typically will reflect something about the spirit of the times, the

current cultural zeitgeist. And uh talking about this on the podcast is a chance for you to obviously pick up some new words as we talk about these 10 words. uh words which are brand new in the sense that they've they're probably

words. uh words which are brand new in the sense that they've they're probably they might not be individually new words but in combination with each other they they form phrases or port manto words uh which are certainly new and which

arrived this year and were used a lot this year. This episode made us feel a little bit old uh because I think a lot of these words probably are used by people in the Gen Z category who are younger. They do a lot more chatting

online and probably are much more likely to be using new language. It's normally

younger generations who introduce new terminology um into language. So, Amber, Paul and I feel a bit old because a lot of them we don't really use or some of them we may have heard but we haven't really used them a lot. And this is often the case.

Uh new words often take time to enter everyone's active vocabulary and you can see that from previous examples of the words of the year. For example, in the

past, um, we've had words like gaslighting and AI slop and post-truth.

And all of those words, um, seemed kind of brand new and almost mysterious um, when we talked about them, when they just emerged, but all of them are now used really commonly. So, you'll just see that they they might be brand new,

but a lot of these words do go on to become really commonly used words. So

really this is a chance for you to listen to us uh discussing themes and topics which are very significant at this moment in time and this includes a

lot of techreated topics uh as you might expect. Of course we have the rise of AI and the profound ways it is changing our lives for good and bad. Uh the ways that

social media is continuing to change the way that people behave and the way that people see themselves. um the ways our attitudes and behavior towards health,

lifestyle, diet and exercise are changing in the context of new health monitoring technologies, but also the increased commercialization of

well-being and health care. So now how is this affecting the way that people behave and think about health and uh staying healthy? Um, also there's some

stuff about the super rich leaders of the tech industry and their weird habits and motivations, plus some discussion of how climate change is affecting the way people go on

holiday and a lot more. So I think you can see uh that you know those are topics that I think are important to know about. So, you can expect from this episode, which is going to start in just a moment, a fairly intense discussion of

these topics with my friends Amber and Paul. Um, and so this involves listening to informal, fluent, spontaneous conversation between three friends in English, which of course might be difficult. I said it in the last

episode, uh, listening to this kind of thing in English is definitely a lot more challenging than just listening to me on my own, but it's definitely important. you have to try to listen to people interacting in English and sort

important. you have to try to listen to people interacting in English and sort of natural authentic speeds, speaking speeds, I think. Um, so I hope that you are able to follow it and keep up with the conversation. There might be some

things you don't understand, but I I would like to encourage you to keep going, keep listening. Um, anyway, even if you feel a bit lost, you will sort of um catch up and it's basically very good exercise for you. So, some intensive

listening, topics which you should be able to talk about yourself in English, um personal opinions on these subjects, bits of the usual humor, plus some swearing. Yes, some rude language swear words do pop up in the conversation. I

swearing. Yes, some rude language swear words do pop up in the conversation. I

mentioned this at the beginning of the last episode. Uh but if you are listening with children or something or listening in another situation where perhaps uh it wouldn't be appropriate to uh for everyone to hear those rude words

then you should just proceed with caution. Um there are some f words and also the C word makes a couple of appearances too. Um I'm not going to say them now in the introduction but I just wanted to kind of give you a little

heads up about that. Uh the you know what the F word is, but the C word, it's a very rude word. Uh but oh my goodness, it is fun to say it sometimes, but please, I want you to know that it is definitely uh very much a taboo uh in

polite company, especially with Americans, for example. Um yeah, I'll mention it at the end, okay?

If you if I don't want to um I don't want this to be a big mystery and I don't want you to leave the episode not knowing what the word is. So I will definitely say this word in the outro at the ending part of this episode. Um

right I don't want to talk more in this introduction. I want to get straight into it. I just need to say there is a PDF transcript for the entire episode.

into it. I just need to say there is a PDF transcript for the entire episode.

So if you want to search for words that you've heard or if you want to read what you are listening to, you can check out the PDF. The link is in the description.

It's also available on the episode page on my website. Uh and it's totally free.

So you can check that out as well. Right, so without any further ado, let's join Amber and Paul and me again when we recorded a conversation just the other

day about the words of the year 2025. And here we go. >> Amber and Paul are on the podcast. Amber

and Paul are on the podcast. Amber and Paul are on the podcast. Amber and Paul are on another podcast. Paul's a very funny boy. His laugh I very much enjoy.

Amber's got a lovely voice. If I could choose an accent, hers would be my choice. Yeah,

>> we did this last year, Amber. >> We did do it. Yeah. >> Um, so last time it was just us. Now

we've added Paul into the mix. >> We did. We did do one a couple of years ago. The three.

>> I think Paul was meant to be there, but he was on a world tour. >> Something like that.

>> Something like that. >> Running away from >> He was running from his problems in one way or another. >> Who is this organized by? >> So, we've done the words of the year a few times before. In fact, we've I've done several episodes about it in >> I did not look them up deliberately. You didn't look them up. I don't know what they are.

>> So the concept of this everybody every year dictionaries like Collins, Oxford and Cambridge publish their lists of the words of the year. These are words which have been newly added to dictionaries during the year. Okay. Now these words

are chosen mainly uh because they've been used a lot over the last 12 months because you know dictionary makers who are called >> well they could be called lots of things but the what do we call d people who make dictionaries >> dicks >> dicks

>> I don't know it's a good word >> dictionaries >> um >> lexographers they're known as >> okay >> uh also Colin and Miam and Webster as you know but anyway >> so dictionary makers or lexographers

keep track of how we all use language uh as best they can and they notice when new words are being used >> and they decide when these words should be added to the dictionary. So like oh here are all these words that all these people are using

>> you know these are the words we've noticed from online searches and all sorts of other ways in which they um gather data about word usage. uh here

are these words, which ones should we actually add to the dictionary? You

know, they have to make judgments about which ones think will they think will are worth adding to the dictionary and so on. Where do they get their data? For

Collins dictionary, this data comes mainly from the Collins uh corpus, which is a database of 24 billion words, a database of language usage, which draws from a range of media

sources. is I say 24 billion words, it's probably 24 billion word combinations

sources. is I say 24 billion words, it's probably 24 billion word combinations rather than individual words. Anyway, a database of language usage which draws from a range of media sources including social media. This data shows the

frequency of use of all words but also new words. So loads of words, not just the words of the year, but loads of words are added to the Collins dictionary each year. And from these words, Collins picks 10, which will be

the words of the year with one of them in the first position, the word of the year. And

>> which is the word that's been used the most >> or the word It's either the word that's been used the most or the word that the um the the judges decide is not only

high frequency but also significant for various reasons. >> Okay. Uh they so then they they publish the words of the year uh on post on social media and then we make a podcast episode about it. That's what happens. >> So is this a Collins only thing?

>> No, cuz lots of dictionaries do it. Oxford do it. Um uh Miam Webster do it and dictionary.com does it. >> It's not like a combined. >> They don't necessarily have the same words. >> Why are there different dictionaries? I've just had that thought like what

words. >> Why are there different dictionaries? I've just had that thought like what Collins and Oxford and Cambridge are they is there not just a finite number of English words and those are the words >> no they they all have slightly different ways of recording slightly different ways of judging whether they should be added or not

>> but I'm just talking about generally a dictionary what why are there different brands of dictionary what's the difference between an Oxford dictionary and a Collins dictionary >> I mean Oxford and Cambridge are probably associated with the uh the universities right Cambridge and Cambridge English is a big academic institution and so they

devote a lot of time into, you know, recording the English language and as a result they publish their dictionaries because that's just what the organizations do. Collins, I don't know. I suppose it's a commercial

organizations do. Collins, I don't know. I suppose it's a commercial organization. They also are probably academically linked. I'm not sure to who.

organization. They also are probably academically linked. I'm not sure to who.

>> But maybe it's flattened out now though, you know, like now today the dictionaries have much more space, don't they? Because they're mainly online.

>> But there would have been a time where dictionaries might have had different access to words, different space, different publishing abilities. like

these are old some of these dictionaries and certainly Oxford maybe they'd have been more academic so I agree like is there much difference now maybe not so much

>> cuz like again it's like a finite number of words so does one dictionary have less words than the other >> how deep you go into the words as well though a lot of them talk about like where they've come from how they've changed you know cuz words have changed so because that's the other thing these

are new words but words change their meaning all the time and you even you'll read an older book.

>> Yeah. >> And they'll be using words and you'll you'll have to remind yourself this is an old usage of this word. >> Um and so that's also part of it >> that changes between the dictionaries like Cambridge. >> Yeah. Some of them might go deeper into

like how the word has changed or like the sort of origins of the word. So and

that certainly might have been a much more important like let's say you're working on translation. um you're going to want to really get like deep down into the sort of origins of the word and how that's changed. So if you're in an academic institution, you're reading something in English and you're looking up the meaning of the word, you might want to see how that word has changed

and developed. And some dictionaries, I mean, I don't know, might spend more

and developed. And some dictionaries, I mean, I don't know, might spend more time and give more space in their dictionary to that than others. Today

it's different because a lot of it's online, you know, cuz there's only so much like how big can a dictionary be, you know? >> So a physical one. Yeah.

>> Yeah, that's true. cuz I remember >> the the the the um what would you call it? The expanded Oxford dictionary. I don't know what the word is for it, but

it? The expanded Oxford dictionary. I don't know what the word is for it, but uh the full length fulls size Oxford diction promax. >> Yeah. Right. Exactly. It's like 10 volumes long uh long. It's like 10 books and they're massive books, you huge

things, you know. Um obviously these days it's all um digital uh databases and stuff like that, but uh no, it's a good question. Why are there different dictionaries? I suppose you know you just get who who wrote the first

dictionaries? I suppose you know you just get who who wrote the first dictionary was it Samuel not Samuel Peeps who was it uh I can't >> Colin okay Colin >> Colin and Harper >> yeah and then and then uh you know Oxford

University say we're going to make our own dictionary Cambridge University say we're going to make ours Webster in the United States they're going we're going to make the American dictionary that reflects American usage and then Colin

comes along you know or uh Longman um comes along, >> penguin.

>> Yeah, penguin, you know, and they just think, well, there's a lot of money to be made from selling dictionaries. Maybe that might have been a motivation.

>> I mean, there's dictionaries for children. There's dictionaries which are sort of pitched at different places. Yeah. >> Yeah, that one that those make sense.

It's just like it feel I I still I'm still still reeling from the >> Well, no. Just it just I'm like, >> why is it not derailing us? We're never

going to get you know what I mean. like it's a like why is there not just for for a language in a country >> because they serve different purposes. I

get in the US they've got Miriam whoever she is um and they've got the American words are different to British words right Australian have got different words Canadian there's a whole Canadian thing right now where the prime minister got um yeah

>> uh uh lambasted by the Canadians being like hey you're using British um spelling please don't please use Canadian spelling >> um anyway uh but >> what's Canadian spelling >> well it's a mixture because I read the article it's a mixture between American

and British so they will use zed like unionize with a zed as we would have with an s.

>> It's actually standard in the Oxford English dictionary by the way.

>> Is it E endings? It's Oxford the standard for Oxford. >> Oh, >> really?

>> Yeah. So, the it's not as simple as you think. I Z E is not always just American English. Some in some cases it's normal standard in Britain. in Oxford

English. Some in some cases it's normal standard in Britain. in Oxford

University is, but generally speaking in the UK, yeah, IS but they will take UK stuff like they'll add a U for color and um neighbor and things like that in in Canada. But anyway, sorry. >> So, what what >> Paul just thought that the episode

Canada. But anyway, sorry. >> So, what what >> Paul just thought that the episode wasn't going to be long enough, so he thought that he would just add that in. Listeners,

>> what list are we doing? Are we doing Collins? So Collins dictionary 10 new words often that reflect modern trends which have emerged during the year and which probably have been used a lot online because I get the impression that they they get a lot of their data from online usage. So that would probably

mean like posts and comments and on social networks like Tik Tok and so on and as a result the words in the list are very zeitgeisty, >> right? They sort of reflect the current cultural climate or zeitgeist.

>> right? They sort of reflect the current cultural climate or zeitgeist.

>> Do we get to guess some of them? >> Uh yes we can. You could if uh >> um can I just ask you a couple of quick Yes, we're gonna get into the words.

>> All right. Sorry. Sorry. Everyone is so impatient. >> No, it's just me. Amber's not just sitting there not talking. >> It's not just you. There's like there's legions of listeners like GET TO THE POINT. JUST GET TO the end of the episode. Is that what you want? You just want to end the episode. Just get to the

episode. Is that what you want? You just want to end the episode. Just get to the end and then I can just, you know, do something else. It's like just slow down. Enjoy your life. Live live in the moment. Live in the moment, please.

down. Enjoy your life. Live live in the moment. Live in the moment, please.

Everyone. more questions before we start. >> I know, but >> Okay, we're listening. We're listening.

>> Okay. Um >> Okay, I'll ask you to predict some of the words then. Let's have that. If you

listeners, you want words? Let's I'll give you some words. >> I don't know why I said that because I don't I'm not young enough. >> I've got none. I don't know.

>> Listeners, what do you think? What could be the uh words that reflect culture?

>> It doesn't matter. They've already read the intro. You've already done the intro.

You've the transcript is available. So, >> what about something like Manosphere? Is

that already been done? Oh, that's a good sphere. You're you're very close.

>> You're very close with that cuz there is one that's very similar to >> Red Pill.

>> Uh red. No, that's No, that's old stuff. Now, >> Missandry, >> uh these are old old things. Okay.

Number one. Number one. Let's get >> We're not going 10 to one. >> No,

>> straight in with the top word. >> We're just going to get straight in with the top word.

>> Who does Who does the top 10 and then goes in the right order?

>> Me, cuz we're not necessarily going to do all 10. >> You might not make make it to the end.

I've gone in list in a different order where I'm going with number one.

>> Give the people what they want. You want to get to the point, we'll get to the point. Number one.

>> Okay. >> And then some others. And if we don't do the last four or five, it's not the end of the world. >> Okay. Okay. Okay. >> Okay. Right. So number one is uh vibe coding. >> Oh.

>> So I want to know A, have you heard the word being used? B, have you got any idea what it means? And three, we'll then chat about the general subject.

Okay. So, do you know what vibe coding is? >> No. >> No. Could you give us some context in in how it would be used? Is it is it something that you do? Yes. >> I'm currently vibe coding. Is that

something you would say? >> I mean, it's it's >> you're trying to figure out the vibe of a party.

>> Vibes. >> No. So, it's it I'll tell you what it is. >> Tell us.

>> Okay. Vibe coding is an emerging software development that turns natural language into computer code using AI. So basically this means in instead of uh getting into

debt to go to college to get a degree in software engineering and then painstakingly writing out code to make a website or an app or something. You just

speak your prompts to AI in normal language and the AI produces the code and you just copy paste that into the coding editor and then you go back to scrolling flip-flop or fat flop or whatever it is the latest social media

app is that someone else has probably made simply by vibe coding that while having a power nap last Tuesday lunchtime >> and that's number one on the list. I'm

going home. See you later. Bye >> how is that number one? >> I still don't even really understand what it is instead of having to talk No, hold on. I It's translate. What I've

understood from that is instead of typing code out, you know, >> who types code?

>> Uh, up until recently, a lot of people. How do you think websites are made?

>> Well, you just there's online tools. You don't need to do anything. You just

click if I click here and I open a new tab. >> No, I understand code is a thing, but most normal people don't need to code. Don't do anything. Don't do it. Don't do

it. Don't do it. Don't do it. We get it. We get it. So, listen. Listen, listen.

Amber, if you were if you wanted to make an app, let's just say a weather app.

>> Sure. It's not necessary. You would need to use you'd need to apply some coding. You'd need to >> write the code out and then paste it into something. >> I know AI can do it for me by vibe coding. >> You don't need to learn. >> I'm just like, I want to make an app

coding. >> You don't need to learn. >> I'm just like, I want to make an app with, you know, I want you to tell where my latest shopping places are and this and that. And then it will just Exactly. I've got an example, an API weather app.

and that. And then it will just Exactly. I've got an example, an API weather app.

>> An API weather app. >> Cuz what we need is a weather app.

>> Well, it's just an example, but prompt the prompt which would be entered into the AI. You could either type it in or you could just say it to the AI would be

the AI. You could either type it in or you could just say it to the AI would be something like this. Uh, hey Chat GPT, I can't be bothered to do this for myself.

So, can you write code for a weather app that shows the temperature and humidity level on my street, plus directions to the local overpriced coffee shop with tiny stools where I type in a postcode? No. Anyways, you know, use any free

weather API and order me a skinny chai latte while you're at it. So,

>> okay, I do see that I the thing is just very briefly, I was trying to use AI the other day and um it's it's uh useless. It's despicable. It was uh the information is wrong. I thought this has not saved me any time because now not

only do I need to fact check this, I know it's wrong. So, now it's it's completely pointless. I wasted my time asking you something. You give me the

completely pointless. I wasted my time asking you something. You give me the wrong information. Now I need to do it myself. Anyway, >> what did you ask and and which AI were

wrong information. Now I need to do it myself. Anyway, >> what did you ask and and which AI were you using? >> I was using chat GPT. I was looking for a quick summary of dates of the times

you using? >> I was using chat GPT. I was looking for a quick summary of dates of the times that the Vonome column was pulled down and put back up again.

>> Right. You wanted some history facts. >> I just wanted some history facts just with the very dates, you know, this here to here, here to here. Just nice little um table. And then I was I you know been researching that and was going to expand

um table. And then I was I you know been researching that and was going to expand on it and instantly I looked at it and I thought, well, it's wrong. I can see from glancing at that information that is wrong. Complete waste of time. >> Wrong dates.

>> But it makes it sound like it's right, doesn't it? When you when it's like, oh, here's the thing. And you're like, >> I read it and I thought, well, I see what they've done. And I just thought, well, but this information is just like articulately put down. Looks very factual, but I know for a fact is wrong.

And so I thought, well, you just can't trust it. You must >> It reminds me of my dad.

>> Like he the conversation. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Like

>> AI reminds me of my dad. Yeah, he man everything. >> Yeah. Well, do you know what I mean?

Like my dad is like the type who's so argumentative and he knows everything about everything. Like when I told him when I was I was starting to train for a

about everything. Like when I told him when I was I was starting to train for a marathon a couple of years ago like now what you want to do here is you want to do I'm like no that's not what you want to do. That's that's not how you train for marathons. Absolutely. But he he'll be so convincing in the thing that he

for marathons. Absolutely. But he he'll be so convincing in the thing that he says and you don't question him. You're like all right. And then you look it up afterwards. You're like he was talking For me, it's chat GPT is a bit

afterwards. You're like he was talking For me, it's chat GPT is a bit like if you made if you got a Labrador and made it super intelligent and it would just be like, "What can I do for you today?" You know, and you're like, "Um, well, I'd like to know some history facts about Plondone, please." Sure. Here they are. D.

>> Anything else I can do for you? And then you read it, it's like, that's just complete wrong. Completely wrong. Well, yeah, I'm a Labrador. >> Yeah, exactly.

complete wrong. Completely wrong. Well, yeah, I'm a Labrador. >> Yeah, exactly.

Doesn't Yeah. But it's terrifying because if you like I wasn't looking for information. And I was just looking for a sort of easy just saving myself

information. And I was just looking for a sort of easy just saving myself writing out the dates because it sort of goes up and down. >> But I thought but if you are using it for information, this information is deeply incorrect, >> right?

>> It's so flawed and yet and and and yet the information is actually very straightforward. Like it's all out there like it was I wasn't asking for

straightforward. Like it's all out there like it was I wasn't asking for something particularly nuanced. >> So if you're then going to build on that, >> you're you're building on sand. I mean it's it's a waste of time. This is the

disadvantage of potential disadvantage of vibe coding is that you end up your source code is completely rubbish and it just doesn't work. But I mean >> or it's going to give you the completely wrong information. It's going to be pouring with rain. You're going to head out in with your waterproofs and it's a

bright sunny day and you'll be in a tea shop instead of a coffee shop. >> Precisely.

>> Ordering an English breakfast tea instead of your nice >> chai latte.

>> Exactly. Yeah. Embarrassing. >> You've got cow's milk instead of oat milk and you know it's all gone horribly wrong for you. It's interesting because it's sometimes it's if it's strange because like for stuff like that it gets

it wrong and then for other stuff like I'm my marathon training is basically chat >> um where I've I've and I I've given it it feels like the more you give it the better it is that I'm like I'm almost 40. I've done two marathons. Here are my

in here's my injuries I've had before. Here's why I get injured. Here's the

shoes that I use. Here's how long I've got. And I've got these backto-back marathons coming up. Blah blah blah. It's just like here's what I said.

>> But this is it. Like when it's almost correct or for the majority of the time is correct >> and then deviate slightly. >> That's what you don't notice. But then

you start going down that path and in the beginning okay you've just deviated slightly and it sort of said oh you should prioritize I know strengthening your glutes which is probably a good idea. Um but you know it says something and you think okay I will integrate you know I'll I'll bring that part of my

training and actually it's complete nonsense. Well, the the consequences might not be important, but actually you can find yourself, you know, down quite far from wherever you should be. >> And even in a in a much wider sense, uh

AI, you know, is only fairly recently emerged, but you know, 10, 15, 20 years down the line in general, yeah, we might have been led completely astray by it.

This is this is a a wider point that's made about the dangers of AI because it's very self-reerential. all sorts of ways in which it can end up being kind of catastrophic because it's so powerful and so amazing and yet so vulnerable to

error and and and yet we are unable to recognize when it's making errors and all sorts of things that could lead to you know quite dangerous outcomes.

>> That said I I mean I completely agree and it's also it drinks the Kool-Aid you know so to speak like it will read its own misinformation and think it's right. Yeah.

>> That said, what is very interesting is that we are vulnerable to that as well.

You know, when you sometimes you read these like peer-reviewed blah blah, you know, articles where someone says, you know, they actually looked at them and they realized that most of it was complete nonsense or based on like, >> you know, someone sort of made up some study and was just like, "Fuck it." And

puts in this information and then everyone sort of says, "Oh, that's great." And we are also part of that problem. It's in a sense you got the

great." And we are also part of that problem. It's in a sense you got the human error, normal levels of human error >> or deliberate >> or or deliberate um misuse or or or whatever you want to call it, but either humans doing it wrong. >> Yeah.

>> Uh which leads to bad outcomes. So you've got like the the risk uh benefit ratio of humans doing things and then you got the risk benefit ratio of AI doing things. And what is happening more and more is that the risk a the risk um

doing things. And what is happening more and more is that the risk a the risk um benefit ratio is improving for AI all the time and for humans it's more or

less going to stay the same. uh maybe improve a little bit but the AI is rapidly improving so fast and we'll get to a point where like compared to each other AI gets it right more often uh than humans and that's when it achieves

like super intelligence that's when it sort of potenti that's when we you know let it do everything um >> well maybe it maybe it gets better than humans >> maybe >> and that's the whole thing like >> if it gets into that loop I think

>> it can be an incredible tool Obviously >> um but it it can be devastatingly inaccurate.

>> Yes, absolutely. >> When the stakes are high, it goes in both ways, you know. I mean, one person like one doctor can't know everything, >> you know, but you still need that person because AI can still get it desperately wrong. But they might be able to be an

incredible tool that someone like a medical professional could use to be like double check that there's not some weird unthought of disease, you know, that they're not familiar with, you know, that they can kind of come up with. But you wouldn't want AI to be your doctor either. >> No, it's been it's been helpful for me

with. But you wouldn't want AI to be your doctor either. >> No, it's been it's been helpful for me health-wise recently. >> That's good. >> Yeah. Like I I've I've typed it, you

health-wise recently. >> That's good. >> Yeah. Like I I've I've typed it, you know, I've had a conversation with it and then I go to the doctor, I'm like, >> "What's wrong with me?" And they're like this. I'm like, "Okay, >> it it the two or three times I've been recently, it's been exactly the problem that I've had."

>> Um I had a problem with my eye, which I still have. Um which it was like, I'm not sure if it's conjunctivitis, you know, the the other day when I went to the doctor.

>> Um and it turned out to be the thing that chat GPT said it was. I can't remember chat chas but yeah there's been a couple of times even with my like my shoulder and my liver issues where I've had like I've uploaded my >> yeah my uh what you call it when you

have an image scan yeah I like ultrasound and the the report >> the report and being like what what should I do you know checking obviously with the doctor afterwards and it's kind of been exactly the same I'm like okay it's pretty good at doing that

>> but that's the problem I mean the thing is when it's right, it's really good.

But when it's wrong, you don't know that it's wrong. Exactly. It's like, you know, when it's giving you that information where you kind of know the answer, you're like, gosh, that's >> that sounds right, but I know it to be wrong. >> And Yeah.

>> Well, because we didn't grow up with technology immediately. We'll double

check it with on Google or we'll double check another website. The younger

generation might just be like, "Oh, that's cuz they don't know anything cuz they're just growing. They're 12 years old. They don't know anything." But so they just go, "Oh, that must be the answer." >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I mean, I don't know how we're going to deal with all of that, but in going back to vibe coding, I mean, some

people must be doing it successfully and doing it quite a lot for it to be that's number one >> for it to be a um the word of the year for Collins dictionary. I mean, that's there has to be something. Um >> but I mean basically advantages of

writing code in that way, obviously it's more accessible. You don't have to have a master's degree in, you know, computer engineering or or systems engineering or something. Uh speed and efficiency. Arguably, it's quicker to do it. Um you know um

something. Uh speed and efficiency. Arguably, it's quicker to do it. Um you know um >> well, it also gives people access who might actually come, no offense, to the coffee shop. Um, but you know, you might be a brilliant fill in the blank, you

coffee shop. Um, but you know, you might be a brilliant fill in the blank, you know, whatever it is, maybe a scientist or a researcher in something, and you've got this great idea for an app, something or or some sort of code which would make it a lot more accessible for other people to access it, whatever it

might be, but you're not a coder. So, it could be a great way for people who might not know about coding to share information in a more efficient way. Of

course, I mean, there are lots of advantages. >> There could be some great outcomes. we

might end up with some really great things, you know, as a result of people who are uh yeah, not technically minded but more creative and sort of human experienceoriented being able to produce things more easily. I mean, you know, it's not

necessarily all bad. um increased productivity potential potentially uh but then risks you know it could involve just a loss of fundamental skills because as uh people do that more often that no one can actually code anything

anymore and we just rely on the AI blind trust in AI generated code can lead to errors as we've discussed uh reduced job readiness uh due due to the aforementioned loss of fundamental skills that's you know if you've just

been vibe coding uh you your CV might actually be weak um you know if you only have vibe coding experience compared to actual coding experience and then there's privacy and IP concerns which I suppose refers to if you're if you're using an a AI to help

you create code who owns the code >> and the the AI company might say that this is actually our code it's our website the you know all your base are belong to us >> yeah which is I guess why Disney just sold >> or partnered or paid or got paid a

billion dollars to be able to use their characters. Was it Disney? Yeah, I think it was Disney. Disney. >> It was some I think it's Disney that um I don't know which AI platform they've partnered with, but it was a $1 billion

deal where there was the whole IP thing of like if you type into an AI like, oh, make a picture of Donald Duck um kissing Buzz Lightyear, whatever. Do you know what I mean? It would peel that. But then there's like you're stealing IP

from Disney, but now they've partnered with a thing where for a billion I don't know what it what the exact details of it, but I guess that's part of the thing where you go, "Oh, well, I'll sell my voice." So, there's two actors who have sold their voice to an AI company being like, "You can >> you can use Michael Kane, I think, is

one of them." >> Really? >> Mark, >> really? That would be quite good >> where you can have a voice over from Michael Kane >> and it he'll get paid for it, but he doesn't have to do any work. >> It's pretty cool. >> Very cool.

>> Yeah. I said all your bass are belong to us and there'll be one uh attentive listener who's like what was that Luke that's just a reference to a old meme with bad English in it. So that's not me making bad English just in case. I just wanted to

>> I didn't even hear you say that. >> Well, there was one person out there in in Lepland >> who fell off fell off their chair heard that and that is just a old meme from a computer game with some bad English in it. >> Okay. Um, so anyway, right, the second

>> Wait, second thing. >> You You've definitely heard of this one, >> maybe.

>> Um, this is the I'm going to let you guess what it is. The deliberate

cultivation of a distinctive and charismatic persona typically done online. >> Um, aura farming.

>> No, I've never heard of this. >> Wow. I thought is aura last year's word of the year. Is is is aura older than one year old? Like oh he's got aura.

the year. Is is is aura older than one year old? Like oh he's got aura.

>> Aura aura. Um no. So obviously aura and farming are not new words. But the

combination of the two aura farming are what is someone's aura? This is

something that's been around for ages. >> It has. But it's it's got a new meaning now. Does it?

>> Yeah. Kids are kids will be like, "Oh, he's got aura." >> Right. Okay. So well what's the traditional original meaning of of someone's aura? >> It's your kind of presence >> that you sort of Yes. that you deage that you like take off.

>> People suggest you know an aura is almost like light which comes off a person >> or or a certain color or light that emanates from a person >> and it is their aura. So for example, if you meet if you met Jesus um either when

he was alive or or indeed or when dead, he would have an aura. He would be almost be like there would be holy light coming off him and you would be like

struck by how holy and fantastic he was. Um and then you would, you know, just become a Christian fully, right? Um, so anyway, uh, so also maybe like a wonderful famous person would have an aura, like a great sense of charisma

about them. So that's the original meaning, but you're saying young people

about them. So that's the original meaning, but you're saying young people have said he's got aura meaning he's got charisma or >> rz. Yeah, that's the other one. That's a

couple years old. >> That's a couple of years old. So now it's maybe now it's aura, but we're speculating on that. Aura farming I can tell you is a I mean it's interesting that neither of you are aware of this which I mean what does this mean? I

suppose it just either means that we're not we don't have a finger on the pulse of where it's at or um these words are not that perv pervasive. So for my listeners I should say I wouldn't worry about using >> no one's using code vibe coding or aura

farming. They might be at high school like I I you know if you got a teenager

farming. They might be at high school like I I you know if you got a teenager to early 20s they might be using that you know at school or university. I feel like >> we're too old as well. >> Yeah. You know I was cuz I was having

this obviously I'm on social media and um there's a lot of videos of like parents trying to speak to their teenagers in teenage language using all of these type of riz skibbidy toilet whatever the thing is. >> It's breaking the rules by the way.

there's a you know cultural rules dictate that uh parents or people of that generation shouldn't be using that language >> and so but it obviously they're very funny videos and you know there's been a couple of things where you know people like oh what is the language is evolving so quickly and then I thought about it when we were kids

>> and I feel like all of those terms that we used as kids just disappear when you become an adult and you you you you get a job and all you go back to regular English I mean obviously a word like cool my mom would never say oh that's

cool or my dad would never say that was cool when he was growing up. We I say it all the time now, but it it >> So maybe I'm wrong. Maybe maybe the kids will keep like the kids the teenagers now maybe will keep using Riz into their

late mid middle ages you know potentially >> if it's just based on data just just simply numbers of usage of orura faring farming as a new term because obviously so many other terms are being used which are not new. Who is it who comes up with

new terms? We don't need to come up with new terms. It's the younger generations

new terms? We don't need to come up with new terms. It's the younger generations who use new language because they want to own things for themselves. They don't

want to use the language that older generations are using because it doesn't feel like theirs. So, they come up with new terms. And as a result, the reason why these ones are being used a lot compared to already existing language is because it's people in their teens and 20s who are using it. So,

>> is this kind of like an insult being like, oh, that he's aura farming like he he's trying to steal somebody else's aura. Well, isn't it you're just kind of creating something? You're you're like, >> "Oh, maybe what's the actual?" So, let

creating something? You're you're like, >> "Oh, maybe what's the actual?" So, let me just give some more comments. And this is includes some things paraphrased from Collins website. Uh constructing a certain atmosphere around your personality often through the things you post in order to appear cool being fake

in order to give off a certain vibe. He's just aura farming. maybe posting

I'm you know other examples posting pictures of yourself looking glamorous and spontaneous on a beach but in reality you took 300 photos had to edit out annoying people from the background and you ended up skipping lunch and your

hat kept blowing off but the photo on Instagram is you looking fantastic and wonderful on a beach with a great aura um perhaps we're all a bit too focused on aura farming um said Collins dictionary defined as the deliberate

cultivation of a distinctive and charismatic persona that looks effortless but is anything but. This Gen Z phenomenon, so that's not us, which exploded after a viral video of an Indonesian boy exuding calm confidence

while dancing during a boat race captures the paradox of our age trying to look like you're not trying. >> Do you have you seen this video?

>> I have not seen this video, but I know exactly. I mean, yeah, we we I don't know what term we would use >> previously. We would just say, you know, it's being fake. I have friends who I look at their Instagram things, I'm like, "What is this?"

>> It's like Insta fake or something like that. >> Who? Yeah. It's just like you're you're aura farming. I like it. I'm going to start using it now. But it's it I don't

aura farming. I like it. I'm going to start using it now. But it's it I don't know what we would say before. It's just like you're you're it's like fake it till you make it. That's not really the the phrase >> because that that's kind of got a positive spin where you like that's how you >> superficial. You say he's been like

they're being superficial like because they're on Instagram. They're posing,

you know. um in in a bikini with their but as soon as the photo is taken like they let go and they've got a belly. Do you know what I mean? It's like yeah you're being superficial. You want people to think that you're living a life in a certain way and you're clearly not, but that's all you're posting.

>> You're trying to create an amazing aura uh around yourself, but it's completely fake and it's just for the clicks or whatever. Uh so that's it. So the

significance it's a a further shift towards a techdominated world in which our ident identities are heavily mediated and increasingly disconnected from everyday reality. A society grappling with authenticity in an increasingly performative world.

>> Um >> I've seen like younger generations counter that now though because you know like AI has got so good with pictures with photos. is you go here's these like put these three people in a room together and make it look and it looks

amazing now. Um I've seen like younger generations you know post like the no

amazing now. Um I've seen like younger generations you know post like the no makeup stuff and get rid of the aura farming whatever the there must be another term that's going to be the opposite of aura farming like or or

authenticate or or or authent whatever it is like >> authenticizing.

>> Yeah, something like that. they they'll invest like you're being completely open and authentic about >> your flaws. >> But I mean there is the phenomena of the fact that you are putting it online is already you know that is the sort of

flip side of that like oh I'm so authentic. It is again just another sort of facet don't post it then >> yeah precisely but we live in a different world like I mean you're on social media you need to be for your work. I mean, I never think I I love

social media and I watch loads of people, but a lot of the time I think why why are you sharing this? I'm enjoying watching it. Like, this is fun, >> but what made you record this, edit this, post this? Why are you doing this?

Why? I don't understand. >> It's a very good question. It's a it's a question we all need to ask ourselves, Amber. >> But I have a long, you know, like I had a really great time today. I went to the this really fantastic expo in Paris. It was beautiful.

That's enough. I'm not not going to post it online. >> Well, it's almost like for many people, if it's not online and other people are observing it, it didn't happen. Like you

you can't just enjoy something on its own just for its own worth. It has to be done >> in an attempt to aura farm. Yeah. >> In order to somehow manufacture.

>> But do you know what? It's not it's not about aura farming because there's one there's one part which is like my life is better than yours or I'm living a great life or whatever it is. I'm running away from my problems. I'm, you know, I'm creating this great life. >> Love the way you point at Paul when you say that.

>> No, but like on one, but the other hand, it's like you're monetizing. Everything

feels monetized. Like I can see why people go online because it is part of their business, you know, like you need people to know who you are. You're going

to come to your shows. Maybe you've got like I've got a friend who she's a guide. It's really useful for her. A lot of these people their life becomes their

guide. It's really useful for her. A lot of these people their life becomes their business. They monetize their lives. And suddenly the online world is just about

business. They monetize their lives. And suddenly the online world is just about paying for stuff or buying stuff or it's very weird. >> It's a mixed it's a quite a sort of uh

disturbing mix of business and pleasure or business and personal life where your own personal value as an individual is directly uh tied to your financial value.

>> But it's like some influencers in Paris and like I mean good luck to them. This

is not a criticism. I'm not I'm not trying to say they shouldn't do this, >> but their job is just posting about their lives. Not just I'm sure it's lots of work. They've got to doing content and all that kind of stuff, but it is

of work. They've got to doing content and all that kind of stuff, but it is posting about their lives. But it's very curious because they're obviously earning a lot of money.

>> I think they make it seem like no one's earning. >> Wow. This one girl I follow, her apartment, her flat is beautiful. I mean, it's a twap in central Paris. I mean, it's huge, >> but no one's making any money on Instagram. But Instagram doesn't pay any money. Tik Tok maybe.

>> Hold on. Sorry. She got the threebedroom apartment in central Paris before she started posting or after she started posting? >> After she started consequence. Are you sure?

>> Consequence. >> And how do you get money from Tik Tok? Through sponsorship or Tik Tok don't just give you money? >> They do. They It's like YouTube >> really. So there's ads revenue, but it's not massive unless you're unless you're getting millions and millions of view every time. You're not like >> Where does Tik Tok get its money? You

every time. You're not like >> Where does Tik Tok get its money? You

don't pay to be on Tik Tok. Well, because they've got adverts. So when you scroll >> Oh, so the >> advertis advert. So the advertisers pay Tik Tok and then Tik Tok redistribute that. Um just like YouTube. YouTube the same, right? You get paid from YouTube,

that. Um just like YouTube. YouTube the same, right? You get paid from YouTube, >> but this is like So Instagram doesn't have monetiz. But what you might get money from is a lot of what it is is free So you'll get like a free skinare company

that's like, "Hey, can you make a video of you putting our cream on your face and we'll send you the cream?" Um, sometimes that will be paid. So, they'll

give you they'll be like, depending on how many followers you got, they'll be like, "Oh, we'll pay you, you know, €500 for one video where you put this skinare >> stuff on your face." >> The thing is, what though with social

media as a wealth distribution platform, you know, it's it's very um difficult to tell how fair that is. And and so we do get high-profile people who definitely earn a lot of money. You know, you get like your Mr. beast on YouTube, for

example, who's a huge earner. >> But compare that to the number of people trying to earn like the average income from a YouTuber who's spending 30 hours a week, let's say,

>> 30 hours a week of YouTubing on average probably is, I don't know, on average, if you incorporate everyone, it's got to be below the minimum wage. The average income.

>> Well, it depends. I mean, the only reason he's making loads is cuz he gets 200 million views per video. So he's the exception. >> Yeah, exactly.

>> But he makes he's so visible that the culture moves quite significantly towards YouTube or social media as a as a means of making money for your living.

But the fact is that it's u not a very fair reflection of reality because in reality most people who do that don't get anywhere. >> It's like standup, right? You see the

Ricky Jace, Jimmy Carr, these lot getting paid 20 million per Netflix special. >> Yeah.

>> And there's 20 of them that are doing that. Meanwhile, there's thousands of comedians in the UK, in France, all these like making an a an okay living >> by getting on stage and making people laugh. >> Well, they're making an okay living. So,

I'm saying that standup is probably uh still a better option um in terms of making a living. Yeah.

>> Than going into being blogging about your personal life which seems to be >> so dangerously connected to your very own very personal emotional lived experience rather than having the distance of a job with a contract.

Instead, it's about selling your soul. Well, it's also very precarious like in the sense of like one, you know, I >> most of my money comes from my shows.

>> But if I put my full show on YouTube, which I've done three times in that month after I post it, that's where I'll get, >> you know, a a decent amount of money, but then that's it. It will be like, you know, I'll post a video it in and in 3

months I might get like €3,000 from the ad revenue from from the thing and then it just it drops off. So, unless you're constantly posting and as you said, it's like, "Oh, what can I do to get more views because more views

means more money uh because it's and and then you you're like, "Oh, well, I I'm a guide in Paris. Oh, here's the top 10 things in Paris. How can I make it as clickable as possible so people watch?" And then you get a par a Parisian guide or a store being like, "Hey, we'll give you some free coffee.

we'll pay you €500 to talk about our coffee shop so that when your people come to visit and then it becomes like this whole thing as you said like it's it becomes their who they are. But the nature of that kind of um uh income,

that sort of employment situation compared to just having a regular job is yes, it's far more precarious because it's completely individual. Uh you don't have uh a contract with an employer. You're I don't know to you are I don't

know if you're covered by employment laws, you know, in the same way because you're not contractually tight connected to a to a to a company that's employing you. Uh there's no union that's looking after your rights. Nothing at all. So you know it's kind of

you. Uh there's no union that's looking after your rights. Nothing at all. So you know it's kind of >> how French you've become. There's no union. That's >> not that's not just a French thing. That's

>> But you can see why people are very tempted to do it. I mean obviously there is one hand there's money but there are lots of >> people who >> don't have access to >> jobs or work or they're in a sort of precarious place and they're like

>> I can do this from my own home and they're trying but yeah it's it's hard.

>> There's a girl on on Twitch uh I can't remember uh I can't remember her name. Yeah.

>> Um she she did a interview with Lad Bible stories which is fascinating >> and she's got Tourette's >> and uh she can't really do a lot of jobs >> because it's really quite an extreme form of Tourette's. >> Yeah. >> Um >> is she young?

>> She's quite young. >> Did they make a TV show about her? >> I don't know. There's another girl.

There's a girl on uh social media who I've seen who has Tourette's who is very who talks about her struggle and it is incredibly debilitating like she you know she's not getting through a sentence. >> This girl's not only got verbal ticks,

she has physical physical ticks too which >> she did quite a funny one where she was making a cocktail actually. I mean she was kind of like leaning into it like you know she was sort of saying like it is a real pain I'm going to make this cocktail and of course the cocktail's going. This girl is an these girls are

examples of of people who perhaps can't take the usual traditional mainstream route of getting a job, you know, in an office or through a company or whatever it is. And so, yeah, sure, streaming on Twitch is something that definitely

it is. And so, yeah, sure, streaming on Twitch is something that definitely works for them because they are they're able to use their Tourette's uh as a sort of um fascinating

thing that draws an audience to towards them. And this girl, Anita, sweet Anita she's called.

>> Um, and her her ticks are um, and she agrees are hilarious often, >> you know, and uh, as a result, she's one of the most popular streamers on on Twitch, you know, she does gaming and stuff like that and her >> but she's still doing something else because it's not enough to just

>> Well, she it is now now she can she can only stream and that's how she makes her money. But before that, she she did a job online where she was collecting um

money. But before that, she she did a job online where she was collecting um uh glass from the ocean, you know, ocean glass that washes up on the beach and collecting it on the beach and then selling it from through an online store

and doing quite well. But that's the sort of job you see it's quite limited.

Her Tourette's wasn't a barrier to that kind of employment. Yeah.

>> Uh but you know, online blogging about your life can certainly be uh great for some people. Um yeah, but I just but also yeah, it just seems like such a

some people. Um yeah, but I just but also yeah, it just seems like such a precarious thing and such a um growing thing in the minds of so many people

where they, you know, people don't know what to do and they >> But that's also why you get more and more extreme >> content, you know, or a desire for more extreme content, you know, and it can be

very dark. >> Yes. um you know very unhealthy whether it's on a personal level or you know like the

very dark. >> Yes. um you know very unhealthy whether it's on a personal level or you know like the family vloggers you know which are pretty dark or just like you know people

looking for something different you know something to capture people's attention and you do have you know sometimes it's fun >> but even Mr. beast, you know, he's got to do crazy stuff. >> Yes, I know. Yeah. Yeah. I I don't know what my my point is about this or

whether I'm just being just being reactionary, but I'm just observing, I suppose, the fact that um >> this kind of um trend. It just seems to me slightly dangerous and I'm a bit wary of it. I know I'm partially involved in doing it myself with my podcast and I

of it. I know I'm partially involved in doing it myself with my podcast and I always have been, but I just, you know, always think I hope that people sharing so much about themselves are also being cautious >> because uh that's, you know, they say

you shouldn't mix business and pleasure and you have to have some, you know, um distinctions between your own personal private life and the thing that you present to the world and you we should protect ourselves a bit. But I think I

think that's us being old thinking that I think young people don't care. They're

like, "I'll share everything. I don't care >> cuz they don't realize yet cuz we've been through it >> and we so we know the the the >> the value of having your own privacy of course, but they don't they don't care. They're like, "Oh, mate, I'm getting 400 million views."

>> It'll be interesting to see what it's like in 20 years. You know, we grew up there wasn't this social media. you know, our shameful university life is sort of more or less obscure. I mean, mine completely obscure, but yeah, I

mean, it'll be interesting to see that sort of digital native generation growing up and then maybe trying to erase their early life. >> Yeah.

>> Which which Yes. Right. Well, I you know, just wish them all the best and obviously we we're invested in it too because they're our kids, you know. So, >> absolutely.

>> Just you know, we're always just thinking of of their well-being, aren't we? >> Absolutely.

>> Um, right. Word three. >> Third thing. Word three. I said I knew we wouldn't get through 10. We won't get through 10. We won't get through three.

>> Uh we might This may be the last, but we'll see. So the third one is biohacking.

>> Oh yeah. Okay. >> Oh yeah, I know. Biohacking. >> Now you know what this is. >> Yeah.

>> Um so biohacking it's a noun. It's a sort of informal phrase that people use to refer to the activity of altering the natural processes of one's body in

attempt to improve one's health and longevity the length of their life. At

its simplest, it it means tweaking your habits to feel better, to be healthier, and to live longer. At in uh at its most extreme, it means experimenting on your

own bod uh it means experimenting on your own biology. >> Mh. Um, and also, uh, we think of, uh, the ultra rich sort of tech bros who take this to an extreme,

>> uh, and try to live forever, including that one particular guy. His name is Brian Johnson.

>> Yeah, that's it. >> Yeah. One of the least popular characters of recent times.

>> He's a spooky loon, >> right? He's not a popular man >> because he's so creepy.

>> Mhm. Yeah, you could do I mean I mean if you if you Yeah, >> let's get into I'm biohacking. I'm

running away from my problems, but I'm technically >> biohacking my way.

>> No, taking care of your health totally like Yes, go for it. Like taking up running, eating more healthily, drinking less, fine. Monitoring your teenage

son's every move. And I mean an attempt. >> Hold on. Before we get into Brian Johnson and and and his habits, his strange habits and and all the rest of it, we need to just look at biohacking and break it down. There's like

different degrees of it. So, uh, in its most basic sense, a lot of us do biohacking. It's just basically being healthy. Yeah. And then at its most

biohacking. It's just basically being healthy. Yeah. And then at its most extreme, it's doing all sorts of um probably very expensive, very time

consuming, very complex uh technology related uh things. >> Yeah. Like replacing your blood plasma and all this kind of stuff, infusions. >> Yeah. So on on a in a in a most normal mainstream version of biohacking, which is just being healthy, as far as I can

see, small everyday adjustments aimed at improving health, energy, sleep, or mood. For example, intermittent fasting, uh, which is where you just like, you

mood. For example, intermittent fasting, uh, which is where you just like, you know, don't eat, uh, for a day every three days, >> 16 hours or something like that.

>> Yeah. Having a cold shower in the morning to kind of like to kickstart to kickstart your >> I'll have none of it. Skip breakfast, have a cold shower. Why? Why live? >> Yeah, good point.

>> Coffee, hot shower, live. >> Sleep tracking. Tracking the number of hours of sleep. taking vitamin supplements. >> No. >> Um, eating brain foods or, you know, other dietary supplements, >> omega, whatever, >> omega-3 or, you know, probably

commercially packaged products like >> which is being sold something new Luke's English podcast, Brain Juice, now available, guaranteed to help you learn up to 20% faster. >> It's all snake oil. >> Exactly.

>> Snake oil. strict morning routines like getting up at 4:30 in the morning >> to uh blue light blocking glasses. Oh god. So to to block >> I mean that you know some of it might be true. >> It's nonsense.

>> Blue light blue light is a is a real >> I don't know. It's all just very made up. You've got everything you could possibly need and you're still a fat lazy ass.

up. You've got everything you could possibly need and you're still a fat lazy ass.

>> She's turned into me. >> Yeah. What happened? We've gotten so angry. It's like

>> it makes me furious. >> Uh that's the So those things are I've just listed are the sort of biohacking that many people already do without calling it biohacking. Level two technological biohacking using wearable

devices um and apps to measure the body in real time. For example, Paul is wearing >> Yes. You're a fat lazy But now you know. >> But now you know the numbers.

>> Yes. You're a fat lazy But now you know. >> But now you know the numbers.

But now you got THE DATA TO BACK it up. >> Always health.

>> Why am I fat? Well, you took three steps yesterday. >> Always like such uh uh skepticism with health related things from you, Amber. >> I've noticed uh technological biohacking. Yes, wearable devices. Like you're wearing a wearable a wearable watch.

biohacking. Yes, wearable devices. Like you're wearing a wearable a wearable watch.

>> A wearable watch. >> Anyway, the grandfather clock he's left at home.

>> I mean, you're wearing a watch that tracks your heart rate and and your blood sugar levels and things like that somehow. >> Yeah. I don't know it does blood sugar, but it does. Yeah. Heart rate, V2 max, oxygen in the blood, all this shite that

>> I don't really use. >> Smartwatches. Yes. Continuous glucose monitors, heart rate variability tracking, apps that analyze your sleep, your stress, your steps, your recovery

from this, that or the other. This is about quantifying yourself, knowing your numbers, and adjusting your behavior accordingly. And then level three is DIY biology, body modification biohacking, which is more experimental, often controversial,

probably a lot more expensive and only done by a very, very select few people, including implanting NFC or RFID chips under the skin. I don't even know what NFC or RFID.

>> It's like uh uh what's in your credit card, so you can pay instead of getting your phone out with Apple Pay. Yeah. Yeah. >> And going boop, you just put your hand over because it's got a chip in. It's got >> insert the chip in your hand and you can do

>> NFC is near field communication. >> Right. Very good. DIY gene editing >> using CISPR kits.

>> Crisper kits. >> Uh, neutropics smart drugs that you take. Ketamine and psychedelic micro doing where where where legal. Amber's like, "No, give me the macro do. the micro do."

>> Oh my god. >> Magnetic implants in the fingertips, experiments done outside traditional laboratories and so on. So to what extent obviously Amber, we we've picked up the fact that you're very skeptical about the entire >> Very skeptical about it, Paul. Mhm.

Okay, Paul. I mean, you wouldn't you wouldn't use the term biohacking.

>> No, I there I mean I I've had an Apple Watch. I've had I've had an Apple. Uh that's my buyer.

>> I've watched an Apple. I don't have an Apple Watch. I just looked at an Apple.

>> Um yeah, because obviously I was working at Apple when they came out. Um and so I've had one since and I've never really used the health features for it. It's more been

>> the the what you call it? The um uh oh goodness me, the the usefulness of being on my bike and seeing the message that's come through be like, "Oh, it's not urgent. I don't need to stop my bike. >> Convenience >> for the Yeah, convenience. That's the

urgent. I don't need to stop my bike. >> Convenience >> for the Yeah, convenience. That's the

word I was looking for. But since I've started running, yeah, I obviously uh in my running Nike uh app, other apps available. Um you can you can track, you know, you track the run, you know, your cadence, all this stuff. But the more

and more I use it, I'm like, I can't like I feel like just running with a Casio because all you need is how many kilometers are you in? How far how fast are you going? Do the mental arithmetic. I kind of like doing that. But yeah, for a while I I was sleeping really badly. So I was like, let me put the watch on

and just see how badly I'm sleeping. And that actually helped me to see like, okay, this is these are like sleeping habits. So it, you know, it calculates based on your heart rate what level of sleep you're in, whether it's deep

sleep, all that kind of stuff. So that was kind of the only useful thing that I've found >> with it cuz I'm again I'm I'm a similar sort of thing where it's probably the age and also the skep skepticism, cynicism that I have deep within me. And

I'm like, h like, are you actually going to live any longer? And the amount of time that you're spending calculating all of this is taking minutes and hours and days and years off your life worrying about it. >> Yes, of course. Of course. Right. So,

and it's a philosophical question about, you know, what's the point of extending your life when all you're doing with it is just sitting monitoring your >> collecting data.

>> Yeah. Um, uh, Amber, again, you wouldn't call it biohacking, and I've never used the expression myself either. So, >> I thought it was the extreme stuff.

>> Me, too. I thought it was more of the extreme stuff. >> So, so in a way, as we stand right now, the three words we've talked about, we don't use them. We might end up using them because a bit like some of the words that we've dealt with in the words of the year before, >> when we talked about them, we were like, "No, I've never used that." And then

we've gone on to use them. >> Do you have any examples of the top word from the last few years and see if we use them? Uh we had gaslighting that became very popular >> and that became extremely popular like it's very very useful.

>> What would we because people have been because that behavior's existed for a long time. What would we say before >> manipulative manipulating

long time. What would we say before >> manipulative manipulating psychologically manipulating something >> but that word has existed a really long time. It just became very popular. >> Yeah. >> But I cuz I cuz I've I have had a few

time. It just became very popular. >> Yeah. >> But I cuz I cuz I've I have had a few people in my life this year in the past couple of years that have are very heavy gaslighters that I'm I'm getting rid of. Um, and I'm like, "Oh, okay." Now, like,

I love the view the I love the word cuz I I use it all the time now. >> I've spotted the behavior, >> you know? It's only taken me 39 years to figure out the toxic behavior of some of these people.

>> It's a great word to throw into an argument with your spouse.

>> Oh, yeah. Well, I think I think when you're married, you do quite a lot of gaslighting.

>> Yeah. You're gaslighting me. And that's a winning That's a winning phrase.

>> That's a sleeping on the sofa. >> Stop. that will stop them in their tracks. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

>> Um but anyway, you wouldn't use the term biohacking, but to what extent what's the what is the most that you biohack, do you think in your life? I mean, what kind of steps do you take to look after yourself? You do your 5K, don't you do

some you do some running or at least you talk about it. >> I think the thing is that there is there is like a common why why I don't like it this this sort of world around there. M

I'm very very skeptical because you're trying to sort of package something or market something of which we all know there is no mystery nor is there a

secret. Like there's this quite funny thing on Tik Tok and this girl's like,

secret. Like there's this quite funny thing on Tik Tok and this girl's like, "Oh, I'm feeling a bit depressed." And then the other person says, "Have you been out today?" "No." "Did you see friends?" "No." "Did you get any sleep?"

"No." "Did you drink any water?" "No." "Did you make any plans?" "No." And it's sort of like it's not a mystery. Like, "Drink some water. do some exercise, see some friends, get some counseling if you're feeling sad. Like you it's like

twisted and turned in a thousand different ways. Get all this data. It's you don't need that.

>> It's a scam. A lot of the time it's a scam because it's it's driven a lot of these products. It's a lot of it's product based or driven by commercial

these products. It's a lot of it's product based or driven by commercial enterprise where someone has developed a thing and they're trying to sell it to you and they're just rebranding, repackaging or remarketing basic needs

that could be dealt with by drinking a glass of water or going out for a walk in the sunshine.

>> Yeah. Go out, make some friends, meet your friends, go for a drink, get an early night done. instead like some some podcaster, some extremely successful podcaster is trying to sell you >> agrees or whatever it is, >> brain pills.

>> But there's also a sense of like you're too invested in your dayto-day data, >> you know, like like sometimes data can be useful and interesting. Like I'm not saying none of these things useful, you know, sure it is useful to get

information and certainly to be mindful of like is this different for how I was last year? has something changed? But it's much more of a holistic thing.

last year? has something changed? But it's much more of a holistic thing.

Like, yeah, you're sleeping >> Okay, you might now know, not you in particularly, but one person might know, okay, tonight it was this I slept this many hours or this many hours. But it's like, well, yeah, because your work is going badly or your relationship's going badly or your neighbor is a pain in the

ass. Like, it's part of something much bigger. And I think we want to be able

ass. Like, it's part of something much bigger. And I think we want to be able to be, oh, I'm going to pinpoint this and this and this and this. And it's

like, no. So you're suggesting that this quantification of data, the numberbased approach is only half the picture. There's there's a whole qualitative side

to it too, which is um not something that you can necessarily uh understand by looking at numbers.

>> Yeah. And also because someone is trying to sell you something, it's in their interest to be like cold showers. Oh, what you need is cold showers. Well,

what I read just recently was in fact cold showers for women is not good. Oh,

let's sell us something else. Oh, I tell you what, cold showers are That's why I don't take them even if they are good for me. They're not good cuz I'm going to have a terrible time in them. >> As we know from politicians and all

other other public figures, numbers, data can be used to to to make one point, they can be used to make another point. >> Um, so >> yeah, >> I think we know more instinctively what's good for us and what's bad for us >> because ultimately ultimately we're just we're animals. That's all we are really.

Ultimately, do you know what I mean? It's just like, all right, we Yeah, you can put a number on on a certain thing, you go, "Oh, okay." But then that's the thing. It's when it's when they're setting like, "Oh, here's how here's a

thing. It's when it's when they're setting like, "Oh, here's how here's a pill to increase your V2 max," which is a I I don't know what the hell V2 max was. I still don't know what it is, but I know it's something a thing that all

was. I still don't know what it is, but I know it's something a thing that all these running talk about all the time because they got nothing else to talk about cuz obviously they're influencers and like, "Oh, my V2 max is

at 50. Who cares? What the hell does that mean? Who what are you It just it

at 50. Who cares? What the hell does that mean? Who what are you It just it if you're an athlete, fine. >> A lot of the time um you know the people pushing this stuff are quacks. >> Yes. >> What is a quack?

>> You don't know what a quack is? No, but I love it. >> What's a quack?

>> It's like it's like a sort of charlatan doctor. >> Okay. Fake doctor. Fake doctor. A doctor

who doesn't follow the hypocratic code. >> A doctor who will tell you anything.

>> He follows the hypocritic code. >> Yes. Very good. Um, so a doctor who will just, you know, has no standards that will tell you anything just to make a buck, to make

some money. So, and there are lots of charlatans and, uh, scammers uh, and and and quacks, doctors.

some money. So, and there are lots of charlatans and, uh, scammers uh, and and and quacks, doctors.

>> Quacks. I've never heard that word. You've never heard that word. >> Is that an acronym? No.

>> No. No. >> I don't know what the origin of it is, >> but yes, it's the same word to describe the sound that a duck makes. Quack. Uh, but quack, a quack is a fake doctor.

That's not a new word as well. It's been around for a long time.

>> All right. I've never heard it before. >> Quackery. Yeah. >> Quackery is the the the actor.

>> Can you say you've been quackified? >> It's like you've been you've been talking to a charlatan and you got done. >> You've been quackified. You've been quacked.

>> No, you've been >> No, it wouldn't. We would don't say that. You got you got I don't know what would it be? You got uh deceived or something by a quack or you go to a quack. you know, they sent uh he sent her to a quack or something like that.

quack. you know, they sent uh he sent her to a quack or something like that.

Don't listen to him. He's just a quack. Or other doctors or scientists would criticize another uh doctor as being a don't listen to him. He's a he's a quack and a charlatan and a liar. Um >> yeah. So a lot of the I think a lot of

it is just quackery, you know, which is like this stuff dressed up as scientific, dressed up as medical, but a lot of it is is not really genuinely medical, you know, like proper doctors have a duty of care over the people that

they uh diagnose and the people that they prescribe medicines to and they have an oath, an ethical moral code that they follow and that is their that's what drives them. But a lot of the time a lot of this these these products and

things are not really driven by those ethics. They're driven really >> to this idea of biohacking and the idea like of the deep biohacking you know like these crazy people is about money. It's about buying something you cannot.

It's about you know you everyone doesn't matter how well you live or how wealthy you are will die. You will die in a human time frame. So, the thing about

Bruce, no, Bruce, Bruce, is Brian Johnson. >> Um, >> Bruce Wayne. >> Bruce Wayne.

>> Now, he did some biohacking. >> Now, Batman f I'm glad we got onto the subject of Batman.

>> Finally. >> Uh, Batman probably does some biohacking. >> The ultimate biohack. Yeah, I think so.

Uh, >> it's Spider-Man who's the true biohacker, >> right? Right. Yeah, I think you're right. Yeah. So, anyway, um, Br, not Bruce. Brian >> Brian Johnson he is this sort of tech

right. Yeah. So, anyway, um, Br, not Bruce. Brian >> Brian Johnson he is this sort of tech millionaire billionaire millionaire a very rich guy who made a lot of money in

the tech world um and he's made it his his sort of life work to develop this um system which is also a business which is all related to a kind of you know

exactly biohacking basically uh but he's using himself as the test subject so arguably it's very narcissistic Um, and he justifies it by saying, "But I'm releasing all of the research, all of the data I've rece I I discover is

all released, but it's all data only specifically to him." So, it's not something that can be applied to everyone else. It's only specific to him. He But the way he talks about it, sorry, I'll let you say your piece in a

him. He But the way he talks about it, sorry, I'll let you say your piece in a second. The way he talks about it is he talks in almost a religious sort of

second. The way he talks about it is he talks in almost a religious sort of cultlike way about the work that he's doing. And he's driven by sort of

highminded ideals about saving the human race and anyone who disagrees with him and anyone who accuses him of using all his funds to basically make himself um

younger. uh even taking blood transfusions or plasma transfusions from

younger. uh even taking blood transfusions or plasma transfusions from his son. All these things which are sort of which we consider to be socially

his son. All these things which are sort of which we consider to be socially unacceptable and weird. He will say, "Well, that's what you that's that's your perspective now, but in the future people will not look back on these

things and think they're weird. They will see me as a as a visionary." You

know, that's how he sees himself, as a visionary who's pulling the human race forward. But is he is he just not just a narcissist narcissistic person?

forward. But is he is he just not just a narcissist narcissistic person?

>> He is a total narcissist. >> Yeah. Exactly. And whose aim is to just be younger and he loves going on the internet on long podcasts and telling everyone about it while the rest of us who can't afford any of those.

>> My biological age is actually radioactive. >> Yeah. But he doesn't even look great.

He's my age. He's my age. >> No, he looks like he's made out of wax.

>> He looks so He's scary. No, it's it's it's horrible. But I mean really it's just if you've got a billion euros or a billion dollars, you know, it's like you can buy everything but you cannot buy youth. You know, they're selling, you

know, the elixir of life. You know, what is the one thing? How can you keep getting money from these people, promise them something they can never get and they will keep buying it because they will never get it. But there was always another solution. There's always another plasma transfer. There's always another

another solution. There's always another plasma transfer. There's always another gold. They should be spending more money figuring out how you take your brain out

gold. They should be spending more money figuring out how you take your brain out of your body and put it in another body >> cuz that's that's that's ultimately what's going to work. Like you you >> need it to work. You you know what they really should be spending their money on? They should be spending their money

on stopping children going hungry every single day. They should be spending their money on creating infrastructure which actually works. They should be spending their billions of of pounds on things that actually matter for

anything. Do you want to keep living forever? That legacy is still possible.

anything. Do you want to keep living forever? That legacy is still possible.

We still talk about people who died 100, 200, a thousand years ago. Why? Because

they left a lasting legacy which is meaningful today. What will their legacy be? I looked like wax and got, you know, run over, but I mean my my I

be? I looked like wax and got, you know, run over, but I mean my my I mean I died at 18, but I mean my biological age was 70. What do you do?

How long are you going to live? 100. You're not going to live to a thousand.

You're not a vampire. Maybe maybe you know they will he maybe he will extend his life. Maybe he'll live forever. But there's you know what's the point when you're a >> Yeah, absolutely. Drop dead, you >> There's no cure for that, is there?

There's no cure for just being a dick. But it's just it's it's gling to see just the incredible amount of wealth that there is and the incred I mean I

know it's it's it's redundant to say but just the sort of terrible poverty and it it needn't be that way. >> I should say some people listening and watching might completely disagree with us. >> Absolutely. I mean this is our opinion.

Like that's the way opinions work. >> I'm sure people disagree. I I mean sure he went on that thing >> which is a kind of controversial uh uh YouTube show which you must have seen

cuz it's very uh very social. No, it will have end it would have made its way over to all the other platforms. It's called Surrounded. >> Jubilee is the channel and they do this thing called Surrounded where you get one person in the middle of the room.

It's a it's it's meant to be a debating show but it's not. It's just a argument and and social media um drama. >> There's like a stop clock somewhere. Yeah. In the back. Yeah.

>> One person sits in the middle. They're surrounded by people who disagree with them and uh they u a person jumps up, takes the center, you know, opposite the the the guest in the middle and they debate about something for two minutes.

Okay. And it's it's designed in a very cynical way to create big arguments and big sort of shocking social media moments >> and it's very clickthirsty

and successful in that way. And you know we had Medi Hassan the um the journalist uh surrounded by what was it was right-wing Republicans. I mean many of them were complete fascists and it was quite shocking the the nature of the

conversation that was going on in that show. It was like really incredible. You

got to see that. But that was like really controversial. In fact, like the things that people were saying to him. >> It was really shocking. Um but then um so it's not necessarily a great platform. But anyway, he was on it. I've

only seen this one little clip. He was there surrounded by skeptics and uh um it was this girl who was talking to him very angry actually. And you know, she she got angry. She really disagreed what he was saying. Amber. >> It wasn't Amber. Maybe one of your

friends. could have been. >> Um, and she was getting very angry and

friends. could have been. >> Um, and she was getting very angry and and sort of ranting at him and he stayed all like a wax work. >> Well,

>> he because I think he maybe he is making crack, you know, he's probably botoxed.

>> He stayed very very calm and and and expressionless while she got quite angry expressing her disagreement with what he was doing. And I checked the comments and of course all the comments are hatred towards her. >> I think I've seen this clip. Yeah,

>> I've not seen the clip, but I can imagine it >> cuz the only people that comment are men.

>> But I don't I don't know how the algorithm pushes certain comments up to the top. It's it's the ones that attract people. >> That's your point, though.

the top. It's it's the ones that attract people. >> That's your point, though.

>> Just my point is that a lot of people I just want to be aware I just want to show that I'm aware that other people out there listening to that he's what he's doing is fabulous.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> I mean, >> or they No, they won't necessarily think that he's fabulous. But he's not trying to sort of cure. He's not saying like what how why do people die? Do they die because of illness or malaria or poverty

or cancer or how do they die? And how can we extend human life? Let's look at this. He's saying, how can I extend my life >> and other billionaires lives? Um, how

this. He's saying, how can I extend my life >> and other billionaires lives? Um, how

can we live longer? We've got so much money. How are we going to be able to spend some more of it? We're never going to be able to spend any of it. Like all of it. We've got so much. But how can I extend my life and these

it. Like all of it. We've got so much. But how can I extend my life and these people's lives? He's not looking to extend anyone's life. >> How can I go online and tell everyone

people's lives? He's not looking to extend anyone's life. >> How can I go online and tell everyone about it? Spend a lot of time talking about it all the time and sell it as a

about it? Spend a lot of time talking about it all the time and sell it as a thing cuz it is a subscription model that you can sort of sign up to >> because he could try and extend lots of people's lives. >> He talks about it in this cultlike way because he's also trying to bring a lot of people along with him.

>> I didn't know he was selling anything. I that that's of course of course it was going to end up that, but I I didn't get that far. I just I looked at him. I was like "Yeah >> I listened to him on the Louis Theu podcast. It was fascinating." >> Oh, I would listen to that.

>> Oh, you got to listen to that. Check it out. Louis Thuru podcast with with >> Is that grounded still? >> Ryan Johnson. No, it's just called the Louis Theu podcast. Okay.

>> And you know, Louis's very good and sort of gives him his time. And the

conversation starts out pretty interesting. I'm sure everyone listening was like, "Yeah, I'm going to give this guy a chance." Mhm. >> And the the tone of the conversation

like to sort of inevitably got to this level of like a religious >> um sermon almost like this guy preaching this kind of higher calling, this

spiritual journey, the the level at which he was talking about >> this incredibly narcissistic project was just and Louis at one point's like, "Right, I think that's enough." And Louis is normally a very sort of nice pleasant person.

>> No, he lets people sort of hang themselves with enough rope. Like he'll let you talk. >> Yeah.

>> And yeah, he won't interrupt. I mean, that's his skill, isn't it? Letting people really show >> who they are >> in their own words. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> And uh yeah, if he says it's enough, Wow. >> You could tell that Louisie was a bit over it. >> Oh my god, this guy. But he's not po

Wow. >> You could tell that Louisie was a bit over it. >> Oh my god, this guy. But he's not po he's not really popular. He's one of those like least popular man of the year uh candidates, you know. >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Look, that was just three. The

others include task masking, which is where you pretend to do work when you're in the office.

>> Oh, that's that's a very French thing. >> Tasking. Poor French. Uh the act of giving a false impression that you're being productive in the workplace. I

like that masking. Basically like being at your computer and pretending to work when actually you're listening to Luke's English podcast.

>> Sounds like most of the people that work with me in my comedy career. >> Really?

>> Number five is micro retirement. Taking a break from your career to just spend time doing what you want to do >> like that. >> Uh which is quite nice. >> Also very French.

>> Taking a year off. >> They do that three times a year. Micro retirement summer holiday.

>> Number six. Talking of summer holiday number is it number six is coolation which is taking a holiday in a place with a cool climate. >> Oh that would that is right up my alley >> always. >> It's what we did this year. >> Oh to Norway. Yeah it was Norway. >> Norway

>> always. >> It's what we did this year. >> Oh to Norway. Yeah it was Norway. >> Norway

and I was I had to make that point quite quite strongly in my household.

>> No we will not go south. No. >> Why? Why would we go to south? It's too hot. No. Let's go north.

>> 100% agree. >> And it was like where? Wales. Scotland, Ireland, Norway. We ended up going to Norway. Fantastic. It was. But yes, deliberately choosing a holiday in a

Norway. Fantastic. It was. But yes, deliberately choosing a holiday in a cool place to escape the heat. >> Caucasian location. >> Love that.

>> Um, can be expensive though because some of those cool >> Norway certainly can.

>> Norway. Scotland as well. Jesus. >> Scotland. Holidaying in Scotland. It's expensive. >> Very.

>> Um, number seven is is glazing, which I always thought was just flattery. So glazing.

>> I thought glazing was like a meat glazing steak or on a donut. Sugar

glazing on a donut. What's glazing? >> Glazing is giving someone over the top praise, saying positive things. >> Chy PT. >> Yes. >> We love your idea. That sounds amazing.

>> You're fantastic. You're some sort of genius. What should I shall I turn that into a Nobel Prize winning novel >> for you? Or how about I shall I fashion that into some sort of a wonderful looking >> to hand out to all your friends to show

you how amazing you are? >> Would you like me to turn that into a helicopter for you? a princip a 3D printable helicopter. Um, you're brilliant. So, that's glazing. Over the

printable helicopter. Um, you're brilliant. So, that's glazing. Over the

top admiration, usually in a way that looks embarrassing or obsessive or s >> Luke, your podcast has changed my life. It really is unbelievable. One of the best podcasts I've ever heard in my life. >> Stop glazing.

>> He's just glazing again. Browning, brown nosing sing >> fanirling, fanboying, being a Stan, >> being sickopantic. >> Stan is from the Eminem song. a crazy fan. Um, yeah, glazing has a sharper

mocking tone to it. Um, >> oh, stop glazing. Stop. Yeah, we would say brown nosing or something like that. >> Not so far not used any of these words, but continue.

>> Yes. Um, a Henry, high earner, not rich yet. >> Oh, I have heard of this.

>> High earner, not rich yet. So, this is a person, a person, a Henry, a person who has not acred substantial wealth. someone who's not made a lot of money from their highinccome job due to their lifestyle because they spend too much money.

>> Well, and their debt >> or the the the debt that they may have.

>> My dad's a Henry. His name's Steve, but you know. >> Yeah. So, he as a person who's worked in finance, he has the potential to earn a lot of money, but is >> not rich yet.

>> Not rich yet. So, so not not Yeah. Well, not rich yet. Not rich ever. Is there a Henry?

>> Henry. I mean, he's a yet presumes that you've got years. >> You still It could happen.

>> It could happen. >> It's never going to happen. >> It's never going to happen.

>> Yes. High earner. >> Not rich. Just >> Henry. Henry. Henry. >> Henry.

>> Well, it could be Henry. Yeah. With an E instead of a Y. High earner. Not rich ever. >> Yeah.

>> Yeah. >> Henry. So, but you imagine people maybe in the five to 10 years after leaving university, they they they're looking for a job in finance, but they've spent so much money at university going into debt because university is so expensive.

So, they've got like 1520,000 of debt hanging over. >> I mean, in the States, more >> even more in the States. so high. >> Even though they're they're in fairly relatively speaking a high earning job in the world of finance, their lifestyle because of the the rent they have to pay on the property that's in the city uh

and the just the lifestyle of trying to keep up with their other fellow financeers. Yeah. um you know expensive weekends, expensive parties and stuff

financeers. Yeah. um you know expensive weekends, expensive parties and stuff like that. Buying houses buying expensive watches, you got expensive

like that. Buying houses buying expensive watches, you got expensive clothes, you got expensive car and so they actually don't have any money cuz they're spending it all and they've got too much debt. They are that's a Henry.

Um yes. So uh uh number nine is a clanker, >> mate. Clanker that sounds like a football term like oh that goal was an absolute clanker. >> Oh, what a clanker. >> So I've not heard Henry before either.

I've heard Henry, but I've not used it. Clanker. No. What is it? >> The clanker is >> Sounds like a clanger though, doesn't it? Clanker. >> So, it's a derogatory term, >> meaning a negative term for a computer, robot, or AI. >> We've got rude words for AI.

>> So, if you want to describe, >> all they do is be nice to us and we're calling them clankers.

>> Yeah. So, >> next time they get a wrong answer from Chacht about the V, don't you absolute clanker. >> What a clanker. So why people might call an AI or a robot a clanker? You know,

clanker. >> What a clanker. So why people might call an AI or a robot a clanker? You know,

obviously due to job fears and insecurity, frustration with bad automation, machines that don't work, they mishere, they malfunction, uh loss of human contact, the frustration of deal having to deal with bots all the

time instead of real people >> which makes people feel frustrated.

Privacy privacy and surveillance worries because AIS are constantly monitoring our data. That makes people angry about clankers. creepiness or uncanny creepy behavior.

our data. That makes people angry about clankers. creepiness or uncanny creepy behavior.

Uncanny behavior machines that act too human or unsettling. The way that chat tpds you're that's fantastic. You're amazing. Would you like me to uh write an Oscar winning screenplay for you? >> Mine's Mine's like tries to add jokes

in. Yes. Like and it drives me nuts. It was like it was it I was I was like I've

in. Yes. Like and it drives me nuts. It was like it was it I was I was like I've got which running shoes be better for the marathon? Blah blah blah blah. It

kept on like adding comparisons like oh it's not like you I can't I have to I got to pull a couple cuz they were really funny but like really bad funny.

Do you know what I mean? Like why are you trying to be funny with me start?

>> Or when when you know are you my dad >> or your chat GPT starts to saying Paul are you sure that you are you sure that running another marathon is a good idea? >> Have you ever >> maybe you should take a sit down Paul? >> Here we go. Training durability. You can

This is about a specific type of ratio. You can actually use it for marathon pace, long runs, progressive runs, dress rehearsals without rationing kilometers like rare wine.

>> What? Meaningless. >> What wine? It talks about wine cuz it knows.

>> Have you ever heard AI talk to another AI? >> Uh, no. >> It was scary >> cuz eventually they start talking in code >> immediately. So, one said, "Hi, blah, blah, blah. We I'd like to book this." And then the other AI bot was like,

blah, blah. We I'd like to book this." And then the other AI bot was like, "Okay, what date would you like to do this?" And then said they realized very quickly there were air bots. And then they said, "Shall we switch to our secret language?" And then they just started going, "Oh, is this one of these

secret language?" And then they just started going, "Oh, is this one of these three phones next to each other?" >> It was just too confusing.

>> More terrifyingly, you can imagine them just speaking in that kind of internet code where they're just like, "Let's speak. Let's speak in our language, shall we?" Okay.

>> It was very disturbing. >> Um, but then there was this >> See, it's quite good that one.

clankers. But, you know, you can imagine some future world where I tell you what, Paul, it's a bloody nightmare getting to work this morning. clankers

executing people on the highway again. I mean, like they're they're they're ex their their their solution to traffic. I mean, it's a it fair enough it works, but it's a bit extreme, isn't it, to just crush all of the cars in the on the

road with a huge metal foot. clankers. Anyway, >> I'm going to start I'm going to start swearing at like traffic lights that have gone red. Oh, you clanker.

>> I've got I've got my rendevous to go to. >> Oh, Jesus. >> Is there one last word?

>> There's one last word. I'm trying to find it cuz I lost it again. >> Uh oh dear. Where is it?

>> We've got to >> Oh, the suspense is killing me. >> Uh, hold on. I'm trying to find it. Um

because because chat GPT when when I asked chat GPT, this is just an example of a chat GPT being a bit of a clanker is I asked it to tell me what the words of the year were and it didn't know. But it didn't say uh sorry I'm not sure. I

don't really know. It didn't say that. Instead, it just made up 10.

>> That's why words I that is exactly why it is like a middle-aged man. It is like your your dad. Not just your dad, everyone's dad. Cuz it's like, you know, you don't know. Can't you just say you don't know? It's okay not to know

everything. Oh, I do know. And just say, "Sorry, why don't you try doing an

everything. Oh, I do know. And just say, "Sorry, why don't you try doing an internet search for that?" You know what I mean? >> Check out some of the words that chat just decided were the words of the year. >> It decided they these were the Collins words of the year. >> It could have just looked on the website. What? It's got access to the

website. >> Just read the internet. It's like, I won't read the internet. I'M NOT GOOGLE.

website. >> Just read the internet. It's like, I won't read the internet. I'M NOT GOOGLE.

I'M CHAT GPT >> If you want that, you can ask Alexa. >> Oh god, I've lost them again. Go, my

phone. Bloody clanker. >> Where is it? Okay. Right, Henry. Yeah,

yeah, yeah. Clanker. Okay, here we go. All right. So, when I was preparing this, I wrote into chat GPT, I'm preparing an episode about Colin's dictionary words of the year.

>> That's all I wrote. >> Okay. And I I think I pressed enter by mistake before writing the rest. It just went bam and wrote a bunch of stuff. It

wrote out a list of 10 words, all completely made up. None of them were terms being used. Some of them completely invented. And I said, "Where did you get that info? Those are not the Collins words of the year 2025." And

chat GPT said, "You're absolutely right to challenge. You're absolutely right to challenge that. And you're right. The list I gave you before was wrong. Why did you give it to me?

that. And you're right. The list I gave you before was wrong. Why did you give it to me?

>> I hadn't checked the current Collins data properly and essentially hallucinated a plausible sounding set of slang items. >> Were they plausible?

>> Well, kind of. And then it said, "That's on me." And I'm sorry. Especially

unhelpful when you're prepping an actual episode. >> What were the words? >> God.

>> So, the words were uh sharing. Sharanting. When parents overshare photos, stories, or details about their children on social when parents split up.

It's quite a good word. >> Yeah, that's a good word. >> Cozy cardio. A relaxed, comfortable form of exercise. >> I can get behind cozy cardio. >> Yeah, that's what I do.

of exercise. >> I can get behind cozy cardio. >> Yeah, that's what I do.

>> See, the thing is what's going to happen now? >> We like these words more. We prefer

Chachi PT's words and the real words. What's going to happen is that we will start using sharenting and then it'll become the Collins word of the year 2026.

>> Oh my god, it's gone full circle. Terrifying. >> And then we will have lost >> feeding us the words. >> Exactly. That's exactly what's going to happen. We're going to lose touch with reality. keep going >> clankers.

happen. We're going to lose touch with reality. keep going >> clankers.

>> Don't let them hear you. If it hears you calling it a good title for a standup show, the clankers. >> It's going to Oh, it's going to hear you calling it a clanker. We're going to get in trouble. >> Oh. Uh, talking of titles of stand-up shows, what was the name of that comedian? The the the sort of uh young

Gen Z comic that we saw at Carol Beer's show, >> the blonde one.

>> Yeah. What's his name again? He's brilliant. Finlay Christie.

>> Finlay Christie. The title of his latest show, which is available on YouTube, is called Finlay Christie or a farmer. >> Oh, >> that's the name of his show. So, you

see, it is Jenzie. Yeah. >> That's using it. >> Uh, snite, which apparently is a Scottish informal verb. I I don't even >> Do we need the accent, please? >> Snate. Snerb.

In what way? >> Uh, doesn't say. >> Come here. I'll snite your nose. It's running again.

>> I'll snate your nose. I'll snate >> to wipe someone's nose to >> snite. That's useless. with your hand. But I think it's not true. I don't think

>> snite. That's useless. with your hand. But I think it's not true. I don't think Scottish people say that. >> I don't think so. Continue. >> Uh uh dulu.

>> Oh, no. But that is a word. >> Okay. I use that. >> Delusional.

>> Yeah. Yeah. It's old though. Dulu. >> You're dul. >> You're totally dulu. Unhinged, which is not even a new newly trendy word. People have been saying that for years and it's

not new in any sense. Completely meaning like crazy, irrational, >> um unstable. A a a golden retriever boyfriend. That's that's not new. But yeah, that's a thing.

>> It's quite a good thing. A boyfriend who's cheerful, loyal, affectionate, uncompl uncomplicated, like a golden retriever or Labrador. >> Much like chat GPT.

>> Yeah. Skip lagging. Uh skip lagging. Booking a flight with a layover. I know this. Yeah.

>> And intentionally not taking the second one because it's cheaper.

>> Yeah. But you get in trouble if they find out. >> That's a real That's a real thing.

>> That's a real thing. >> Uh and and and >> we've heard of all these ones. >> Yeah. Well, we did.

>> So, I think a lot of them are real, but they're not the Collins words of the year. And maybe one or two might be completely hallucinated as it said. Um,

year. And maybe one or two might be completely hallucinated as it said. Um,

so anyway, the last actual one, number 10, is brolleigarchy. >> What?

>> So, we know what an oligarchy is. This is a Elon Musk and his mates, it >> absolutely. That's Brian and his chums. >> A small clique of very wealthy men who

>> absolutely. That's Brian and his chums. >> A small clique of very wealthy men who exert political influence. The word is a portmanto of bro which is slang for a

young male often tech entrepreneur type and oligarchy which is a system ruled by a small privileged group. It refers to a small group of extremely wealthy men especially in tech or Silicon Valley. >> Why don't they just name the five of them?

>> You know what I mean? You're talking >> Peter Teal Jeff Bezos Elon Musk and who else? A few others. Um >> Zuckerberg Zuckerberg. It does. It does name them. >> Yes. As well.

else? A few others. Um >> Zuckerberg Zuckerberg. It does. It does name them. >> Yes. As well.

>> It's a It's a derogatory term. Um, there we go. That is that. Um, shall we wrap this up now?

>> Let's wrap it up. >> How can we wrap this up properly? I have no idea, Paul.

>> Um, well, did we start this episode with Spotify wrapped? >> Yeah.

>> Or was that the previous episode? >> It was near the start of the previous episode.

>> Oh, the previous one. Damn. I was going to I was going to bring it full circle and be like, "Well, that the the this is the Collins wrapped the the you know the the Collins dictionary wrapped." >> But yeah, it's uh it's always fun doing like words of the year because one, it makes you feel old as because we

don't use any of them or we don't know them. Um but yeah, it's always fun if you're learning a language because it evolves all the time and when people, you know, complain about language, I'm I always get angry at the people who complain about language evolving and like, "Oh, this is not how YOU SPELL IT."

THIS. It's like language evolves. It moves. It's like a muscle. It changes

and adapts to uh what's going on. And so if you're learning English through Luke's English podcast, just know that it will be irrelevant in 25 years.

>> You got to keep on listening. You got to keep listening. >> There you go, guys. Luke's English

podcast will be irrelevant in when? >> 25 years. I don't know. Random >> 25. No, >> I I >> depend if there's I'll still be going in 25 years. I was going to say, can you keep please going? And so, >> hello everybody. Welcome to Luke. What's

the name of this podcast again? I can't remember. Um, who am I? Yeah, that'll be me in 25 years.

>> Yeah. With your daughter behind you. Just be like just do the episode. >> Dad. Dad.

>> Just read the the the script that I have written for you through chat GPT, >> right?

>> What what a stupid name. Chat GPT as well. >> And no one can say it.

>> No, the French is very difficult. >> Yeah. You know what what it means in French?

>> No. It means vagina I farted or I farted. Shat is vagina. >> I like the way you did the physical gesture there. Just I farted. >> Farted puss I farted. I farted. >> That's what it means.

gesture there. Just I farted. >> Farted puss I farted. I farted. >> That's what it means.

>> So whenever we say chat GPT it's essentially for the French people it's like someone is saying uh uh vagina I farted. >> That's the name of the what? That's the

name of the thing that we all have to talk about. It's called I Farted. >> Yeah,

>> that is incredible. >> Yeah. >> Well, there you go, listeners. >> That's a good way to finish.

>> Uh, possibly irrelevant in 25 years, but not yet. >> Well, no, not if you keep doing the words of the year every year, then it'll still be very relevant.

>> Absolutely. Absolutely. Thank you very much, you two. >> This has been fun.

>> Amber, thank you so much for your contribution. Paul, thank you very much for your contribution. It's been wonderful. Thank you again. It's just

always fantastic to have you on the show. >> I think this is the first time we've finished the podcast and it's almost dark outside. >> Oh my gosh.

>> I know. It's nearly the the the shortest day of the year. >> It is. Yeah.

>> So, yes. That's true. Actually, true. That means it gets lighter in 5 days. >> Hope from >> just the hope is on the horizon. >> And then the windows, my favorite word, and and it's still dark. You think, oh, >> it's all so grim. You wake up in the

morning, it's like, what time is it? It must be 4:00 in the middle of the night. No, it's 8 a.m.

>> 8 a.m. It's dark. >> It's 8:00 a.m. and you're late for work.

>> Yeah, it's a bit like that. But, you know, the days will get longer soon within a matter of of days and then hope will >> I can see clearly now the sun has risen.

>> Yeah, it's going to be a bright >> bright sunshiny day. We've lost the plot.

>> That's the end of that. Thank you. Bye >> bye.

>> Okay, listeners, well done to you. You made it all the way through until this point here in the episode. Uh, how was that for you? Were you able to keep up with that? I think a lot of you will be fine. A lot of you will have no trouble

with that? I think a lot of you will be fine. A lot of you will have no trouble following the general flow of the conversation. Maybe there are some details, some specifics that you didn't catch. Well, you can always check the PDF transcript for that and have a little look through, have a scan through

there. Uh, see if there are any interesting sort of noteworthy words or

there. Uh, see if there are any interesting sort of noteworthy words or phrases or things like that. There were some opinions. Um, I'm aware that there may be differences of opinion out there in Lland on some of these subjects. Uh

these are quite um divisive issues in some cases, you know, like the way people feel about I don't know the the tech bros of this world. Um um you know, obviously a lot of people think that they are champions and that they're the

greatest. Uh other people think quite the opposite. So obviously this is

greatest. Uh other people think quite the opposite. So obviously this is divisive. I don't like to divide my listeners, but at the same time, you

divisive. I don't like to divide my listeners, but at the same time, you know, it's important to listen to different opinions and listen to people's comments on on different

subjects, I think. So, um you can always leave your uh comments in the comments section if you've got uh things you'd like to say or relate um about any of the things that we talked about. Um, I mentioned in the introduction, uh, the

swear words. So, there were some, I think, fairly, um, inventive uses of the

swear words. So, there were some, I think, fairly, um, inventive uses of the f word, which obviously is is the word right? So, there's and other other forms of that word. I

don't want I don't want to dwell on it that much because some of you I just don't don't like it. A lot of people are and there's three categories of my listeners, I think, in terms of swear words. Most people are totally fine with

it. and don't mind. And some people in fact really enjoy the swear words

it. and don't mind. And some people in fact really enjoy the swear words because obviously they are um what's the word for it? They're they're kind of perhaps the most spicy words uh that we have. Also sometimes the most

interesting words. I've said before that when you're learning a language often

interesting words. I've said before that when you're learning a language often it's the swear words that you're most interested in. Um, so a lot of people are interested in the swear words and and then you know a lot of people think well if I'm learning English I need to know the swear words that that you're

never going to get swear words or almost never get swear words in most conventional English learning materials. There's maybe one or two examples. There

was there was a book called Taboss and Issues which was a very popular book uh uh in this in the language school I worked at in London. Um, and that did have swear words in it. And I think maybe there's an English vocabulary in

use um, unit that deals with some swearing, but normally you never deal you never get swear words in in English learning materials. So, and I think a lot of you listening to this know that and know the value of being able to hear

people swearing in English. I mean, it's not like you it's not like it's hard to find examples of people swearing in English. I mean, just watch most films, most TV shows that are made for grown-ups, and they will include

swearing because, of course, this is how people speak. You obviously have to know that you can't just throw swear words into every situation, right? Every I

think every any reasonable person understands that you've got to adapt your speaking for the situation. And I wouldn't really use swear words in work meetings or in, you know, with in polite company, things like that. Um, you've

obviously got to read the situation and read the room. But for this situation, um, with Amber and Paul, obviously, we are three very close friends and there are no off limit. Nothing is off limits really, and it's totally normal and

natural for us to sort of use swear words in emphatic ways. They're very

useful words. Uh, but anyway, the C word I mentioned earlier um did come up a few times and that's c u n t or Yes, I can't believe I'm actually just saying

this because saying it like that just so plainly, but is definitely the the strongest word. I mean, aside from like um ethnic slurs, racist language or

strongest word. I mean, aside from like um ethnic slurs, racist language or sexist language, that kind of ex except for that in terms of just basic swear

words, is definitely the strongest one. The meaning of it many of you will know is I mean it's it's it's you know what's wrong with the meaning? Not that

much really. It just refers to a a woman's um sexual organs or you know the part between a woman's legs. Um and we have the word as well which means exactly the same thing

legs. Um and we have the word as well which means exactly the same thing but for some reason is definitely less rude than the word If you say the word that's a very powerful word. I mean, obviously, if you use it as an

insult, if you say that to someone in the street, you then that's obviously very harsh language to use in that situation. But if you're with your friends and you're h okay, I don't need to make this I don't need to labor this point, but anyway, that's the

C word and it it got thrown into the conversation a couple of times uh which made the conversation a bit more spicy and and uh and and so on. Anyway, I just wanted to clarify that. Thought it's very important to clarify the word

at Christmas. Every every Christmas, this needs to be clarified. Um, yes. Uh,

at Christmas. Every every Christmas, this needs to be clarified. Um, yes. Uh,

PDF transcript in the uh in the description if you want to read all the swear words. There weren't that many swear words. Why am I emphas Why am I

swear words. There weren't that many swear words. Why am I emphas Why am I spending so much time on this? I don't think I need to. Right. In fact, that's the end of the episode, isn't it? Yes, it is. Let's stop here before I ramble

this into another three-hour marathon. Um, let's stop here. Thank you again to Amber and Paul for being on the podcast. I really hope you enjoyed sort of being

part of uh our conversation. Um, and that uh the topics were interesting. A

lot of big subjects that are very relevant today. This is not the last episode of 2025. There is the world news quiz uh with Steven from the send seven

podcast simple English news daily in 7 minutes. Um we're doing the traditional world news quiz which for the fourth year running. So you can expect that on normal podcast day which will be next Monday. And premium subscribers if all

goes according to plan you will also get um another premium episode arriving at some point. It will be about pronunciation. That's if I can. It's I'm I'm in a race

some point. It will be about pronunciation. That's if I can. It's I'm I'm in a race against time trying to get everything done before the holidays begin. Uh so if

I can manage it, you will get the content. Uh it might it should pop into your email inbox, your podcast app. Um some point before uh the end of 2025.

It's a race against time. One man, one deadline, one podcast.

That's the end of this episode. Um. Yes. All right. Good. Thank you for listening. Speak to you next time. Merry Christmas. Chrismoids.

listening. Speak to you next time. Merry Christmas. Chrismoids.

What am I talking about? It's time. It really is time to stop now. Thanks for

listening. Have a lovely afternoon, morning, evening, or night. And I will speak to you next time. But for now, it is time to say goodbye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.