Zelensky’s Press Secretary Reveals All: Cocaine, Cover-ups, and the Only Obstacle Preventing Peace

Thank you for doing this. Um, I'm

amazed. I never thought I would speak to anyone uh around Zinsky. So, and and I know you're doing this at some great risk to yourself, so thank you very much. So, you were uh President

much. So, you were uh President Zilinski's press secretary.

Yes. First of all, thank you for having me. And I never expected to see myself

me. And I never expected to see myself here talking about my former boss, Walinski.

I used to work for him for two years since 2019 till 2021.

How did you wind up working for him?

Uh well uh Wim Zalinski announced uh the job via Facebook and everybody started applying and I didn't want to apply first because I thought he would take someone you know nepotically.

Yeah.

But um there was an open application and I went through 4,000 of applicants. um

it's not a joke and then actually I need to prove myself that I can do a job and that he can trust me but uh yeah we found the common ground and I think I was very faithful towards him you know

yes and um I supported him and I supported him in 2022 when Russia made its large scale invasion

as millions of Ukrainians I was grateful that he stayed in the country yes that's why it's so so strange and desperate for me to be here and to talk

who he really is. I don't have personal vendetta but I believe that he is one of the biggest obstacles towards peace today. So I wanted to tell the people

today. So I wanted to tell the people who he is.

Who is he?

First of all, he's not a person whom you see on camera.

He's a very different person. He changes

masks all the time. He is emotionally uncontrollable.

emotionally uncontrollable.

Yeah, he doesn't control his emotions.

He's often hysterical and he thinks that every person is disposable.

He doesn't have empathy that he plays.

He's absolutely insanely great actor and that brought us a lot of support in 2022.

But his acting doesn't have any substance and everything that he's saying it's so detached from the reality and majority of the things that he's saying

it's either manipulation or it's a fact that is being taken from the context or it's a pure lies and millions of people still believe that supporting Zilinski means

supporting Ukraine but today it's different and Tucker I would like to say I'm not here to justify Russian invasion. I'm

not here to justify Putin.

What Russian army is doing in Ukraine equals crimes against humanity.

But this war is not black and white anymore. It's dark and even darker. We

anymore. It's dark and even darker. We

just see Putin as an evil.

But Zilinski is also an evil. He's just

a hidden one. He plays such a teddy bear, you know, on camera, but then when the light goes off, he's a grizzly bear and he destroys the people.

It's almost surreal to recollect that almost every western leader and western delegations that were coming to Ukraine before the war, they treated Zilinsky as a political novice. They saw he was low

educated, unqualified and low depth. But

then overnight he just turned into this great face of democracy.

Yes. But it feels like the west created the myth fell into it and you know doesn't see doesn't that the west keeps ignoring the fact that this beneath that

Zilinski's rhetoric heroic rhetoric he keeps accumulating power and I'm not afraid to say he keeps hollowing the

very same people he claims to save.

It's pretty strong to say. I know that.

But I believe that, you know, people need to understand that if you want to support Ukraine, the only way to support Ukraine today is to push for the peace deal.

This is the only way that Ukraine can survive because I believe we are on the verge of extinction. Somebody is talking about two, three years of war anymore.

it just like doesn't come up with numbers, with demography, with anything, with all those suffering that's happening in the country.

Tell me, no, no, thank you. Thank you

for saying that. I I agree. I'm not

Ukrainian. Uh, but I I don't understand the point of this. I mean, I many questions about how and why it started, but what's beyond question is Ukraine as a nation is being eliminated. That's

obvious to me. Biggest country in Europe. So, it's a big deal. What are

Europe. So, it's a big deal. What are

since you mentioned numbers, what how many people live in Ukraine?

So when you started working for Zilinski, you worked for the government of Ukraine 2019, how many Ukrainians were there in Ukraine?

So officially Ukraine is the country of 40 42 million people. But we had the last census I think in 2000 or 2001 and we did not manage to organize another

one. So when I was working for the

one. So when I was working for the government um government officials including Zalanski were telling the numbers that they believed there are 34 37 millions of Ukrainians in the

country.

Now with around 10 or plus 10 plus million of Ukrainians turning into refugees going to the west some stay in occupation you know eastern countries

and even some in Russia. Perhaps there

are around 25 million in the Ukrainians in the country and the worst thing is that 11 million of them are retired

people and this retired people live for the pensions from 75 to 180 $200 per month and Ukraine is not

that super cheap country where you can actually survive for this money. Just uh

two weeks or three weeks ago, there was a terrible story when one director, movie director of Ukraine who was a retired person died at

his home and uh his neighbor wrote that he died from hunger and cold. There were

the severe temperatures in Ukraine and he didn't have anyone to help him. I

just like wonder if ever we will know the statistics how many people died from this cold and from having no opportunities to wait. You're saying

that the Ukraine right now has maybe 15 million maybe fewer working people working people actually who are who are working in the entire country.

Well, you don't count children. Children

are not working right. So I don't know how many children under 18 are there but perhaps if we have around 10 million of working people that would be fine.

Wow. That's amazing.

Yes.

How many have died in the war do you know?

uh the numbers are very different and it's very difficult to count. Right now

the official UN verified statistics is around 15,000 of civilians. Uh the

numbers of uh of of those who turned into military are not known. So um it's very hard to know but only in Marupople it is known that there are graves for

around 20,000 of Ukrainians. So I guess the right list is hundreds of thousands of those who died and we will just never know the the the numbers. I'm sorry it's so painful to talk about.

Oh it's well it's absolutely awful but I'm wondering why well my government which has funded a lot of this uh war why we can't get a straight answer from the US government

from the Ukrainian government the Russian government. I mean no one seems

Russian government. I mean no one seems to have an interest in finding out the real number of dead.

Yes. Well, it's very difficult to do because how do you do this in occupation, right? there is no any any

occupation, right? there is no any any relation with that side that would allow to to learn this information and the other side which is Russian side obviously is interested in hiding the numbers right

yes I don't believe in verified numbers and obviously look uh many people who are military now they used to be just

ordinary civilians right engineers IT guys journalists working their everyday life and then they turned into military so of course they are soldiers but they're also people right and they are

dying. Um, and there are a lot of these

dying. Um, and there are a lot of these things I've heard from the front lines when a person was killed and the body is brought and he has a bullet in his head

and uh the government officials, you know, local officials just don't want to put him as a dad from the front line. So

they say he died from a heart attack for instance. Yeah, it's war and I think it

instance. Yeah, it's war and I think it was happening in every war. Yes, it's

just like I think we will never know the true number but there are so many people who are suffering there and you know I told you this terrible

story about retired people and that they live for such absolutely outrageously new low pensions

just when I talk about Zalansky I'm an insider I talk to so many people who used to work for him or even those people who work for him

and to be just you know to be clear I believe that he stands behind many schemes of money laundering and one of the stories is that I have a friend who

was shortlisted for the position of the ministry of social policies during the large-scale invasion and uh he was called and he said that he was one of five candidates

and he would be interviewed by Zalanski and Mr. year mark then chief of staff of president Zalinski and uh he was told that during the interview he would need to come up with the schemes of money

laundery so that they are financed from the ministry of social policy and ministry of social policy is the ministry that is responsible for pensions.

So when we are talking about those poor pensioners, you know, and knowing the fact that Zalinski himself approves the schemes of money laundering, I mean, is

he guilty? I want your audience to

he guilty? I want your audience to respond to that. Okay.

Do you understand the desperacy of mine?

Well, here's a pretty awful statistic.

Over 85% of the so-called grass-fed beef sold in this country comes from other countries. It's not American. That's no

countries. It's not American. That's no

good for our farmers. It's a tragedy for them. And that's why it matters to be

them. And that's why it matters to be intentional about where you buy your meat. That's why we buy our meat from

meat. That's why we buy our meat from Good Ranchers. Good Ranchers partners

Good Ranchers. Good Ranchers partners with local farmers and ranchers deliver 100% American meat delivered right to your house. It's pasture-raised, has no

your house. It's pasture-raised, has no antibiotics, no added hormones, nothing awful or bad for you. It's quality meat, and you can feel good about eating it and serving it to the people you love.

We use Good Ranchers meat for dinners here. It's awesome. We could eat it

here. It's awesome. We could eat it every day and never get bored. It's like

a dog eating dog food every time. You

are thrilled. We are anyway. Start your

plan today and you'll get free meat included with every order plus 100 bucks off your first three orders. Use the

code Tucker to get that. Visit

goodranchers.com.

The code is tucker. That's free meat with every order and a h 100 bucks off your first three orders when you start your subscription plan this month. Or if

you just want to try it out, you can get $40 off your first order with the code Tucker. gooders.com.

Tucker. gooders.com.

American meat delivered to you. I think

most people watching assume that Ukraine is corrupt and has been for a long time and that the Zilinski regime is especially corrupt. I think Americans

especially corrupt. I think Americans believe that. But there's almost no

believe that. But there's almost no evidence that has come out in the American press. The American media has

American press. The American media has not written very much about his corruption. Why do you think that is?

corruption. Why do you think that is?

Uh you know I saw good pieces uh about corruption, but you're right that there are not too many of them. It's very hard first of all to prove it. But I think

there was also some kind of agreement, not official one, right? An official

agreement that we all need to support Zalinski because this means to support Ukraine. We all united,

Ukraine. We all united, you know, to to support Ukraine. But

Zalinski abused this unity. He abused

our belief in democracy. He abused our fight. He abused our sacrifice,

fight. He abused our sacrifice, Ukrainian sacrifice. and what the

Ukrainian sacrifice. and what the Europeans and Americans were doing for us. He abused actually the trust of so

us. He abused actually the trust of so many people. I believe that you know

many people. I believe that you know millions who still support Zalinski, they were you know looking for some great guy in politics. They wanted to

believe that there is someone you know Churchill or whatever historic guy who would really do something good for the people. And is amazing actor. He's going

people. And is amazing actor. He's going

to give you what you want.

Exactly. And that's that's what's happening. He still plays on camera this

happening. He still plays on camera this great guy. But believe me, behind the

great guy. But believe me, behind the camera, he's very different.

I was working for two years. For two

years, this guy was repeating two phrases which are very vocal about him.

One of them he was saying Ukraine is not ready for democracy and this is a quote.

Another quote was dictatorship is an order. So, how on earth a person who

order. So, how on earth a person who believes that Ukraine is not ready for democracy and that dictatorship is an order actually can can be the face of

democracy?

Someone who's canceled elections, who's not actually elected president, I couldn't agree more. So, what um in 2019 2020 2021

what was Zilinski saying about Russia?

Zilleski came uh to the presidency uh as the president of peace.

Yes.

Uh during his electoral We've seen this before.

Oh yeah. He's the guy who made himself in Russia. The first biggest money uh he

in Russia. The first biggest money uh he made was in Russia. Millions of dollars.

He was working for Russian propaganda channels and he was fine with that.

Furthermore, he was of course he made all his career tens of years. He was everywhere in Moscow. By

years. He was everywhere in Moscow. By

the way, when the first Russian invasion in Donbas happened and Russia next Crimea, he was spending time in Russia.

He was finishing his movie for which he got a lot of money and he even recognized this in August 2019. I think

he wrote yes, I was in Russia. I was

finishing the movie. It was 2014. The

war was going on. Uh furthermore, I'm writing a book right now and uh it's a different book. It's it's a book about

different book. It's it's a book about real Zilinski and I learned a lot of facts and talked a lot of pe about to a lot of people and this information was

nowhere but it happened that he had uh several properties in Crimea and when the war was happening in Donbas already he was spending time in Crimea having

weed wheat uh with with um I mean Marihana with his uh friends from 95thal and making facilities there and enjoying

time and he didn't care that Russia next Crimea while it was Russian controlled yes it was under Russian control it was he was vacationing in Russian controlled Crimea

yes it was May 2014 I talked to a person who was working for him a person who was helping him put the windows into the house and a person was telling different

details about how Zalinsky was behaving uh so everything that Zilinski is saying is really is really very different truth you know very different truth

so he was the peace candidate he came promising that he would stand on his knees in front of Putin and beg Putin to stop that's what he was

promising um he was saying that Ukrainian and Russian languages are both languages that need to exist that people speak both languages and you know it makes

people stronger that we need to be friends with Russia. He was saying all this stuff and that's why people voted for him. They didn't want war. Nobody

for him. They didn't want war. Nobody

wants war. There is nothing good in war.

And now he totally adopted some nationalist ideology that is not natural for Ukrainians and he really plays it well. And uh

what what happened? How did

I mean most people in the United States were not paying attention.

Yes. And we sort of look up to the TV and there's Joe Biden's vice president Kla Harris at the Munich Security Conference in January 2022 with Zilinski

saying you need to join NATO and he says great that's not the behavior of someone who wants to avoid war.

You know one thing is that he has been escalating the rhetoric. Another thing

you know I was present at his meeting with Vladimir Putin in 2019 in Paris.

There were very few people near him who knew the truth. He had private conversation with Putin where he promised Putin that Ukraine will never join NATO. So his record

join NATO. So his record in 2019, yes, it was December 2019 and there was a personal conversation. There were very few people know what he promised. He he

he said no NATO because that Ukraine has never you know Ukraine has never was was never close to to NATO for for for being the part of NATO. First of all, we need

to have market economy and be reformed country. It's not like just Trump

country. It's not like just Trump doesn't want Ukraine in NATO or Biden doesn't want Ukraine. It's not about names. It's just like we're not ready

names. It's just like we're not ready for NATO. There is no consensus to be

for NATO. There is no consensus to be NATO. It's it's imagination. It's it's

NATO. It's it's imagination. It's it's

lies. He stick to this fact of joining NATO knowing that it's impossible. He

was pushing the impossible agenda and making it a condition for peace. In

October 2024, uh he presented to the parliament victory plan and he said that joining NATO is the most important thing and long range missiles for Ukraine are

the most important thing and and you know he made this the plan victory plan but it's ridiculous. It's impossible.

And look how he uses it. He uses

impossible things to justify his own agenda and actually creating his hero image. For instance, remember after he

image. For instance, remember after he left Donald Trump, he said, "It's not so easy to get rid of me." He said this to

the journalists. Um, if Ukraine is taken

the journalists. Um, if Ukraine is taken to NATO, I'm ready to step down knowing that Ukraine is not going to be taken to NATO. So it's very easy to promise

NATO. So it's very easy to promise something under the condition of impossible things. Yes. Right.

impossible things. Yes. Right.

That's what he is doing. So this is one thing. Um

thing. Um the second thing if I can Oh, one of the most shocking moments for me

personally if for communications team uh in 2019 2020 was he was um really scared that his ratings started dropping down

and he was sure that communications team was guilty in that. So

he thought it was your fault not mine but all communications people but I was you know there the part of the team and he gathered us and he started saying that there are no positive news about

what he is doing in the country and uh my colleague started arguing with the president very diplomatically but she was saying look there are no so many positive things that are happening

you're promising something but doesn't happen she was of course very diplomatic she didn't say it like that but that was the thought and he said it doesn't matter what's happening. Um the most

important thing we need 1,000 of talking heads and if 1,000 of talking heads tells positive things then positive things are happening that people believe

that there are positive things and she kept arguing and she brought a very good example. She said there was a group of

example. She said there was a group of internally displaced people from Donbas, families who lost homes and Zalinski promised them apartments and we don't speak about thousands or hundreds. There

were like 10 apartments or something like this and nobody took care about that. So he promised the families were

that. So he promised the families were waiting nobody to care about that. So

she said if there are no those apartments people will know that there are no apartments and doesn't matter how many talking heads will say that there are apartments, right? And he said no if

if talking hats thousand people tell you that this is happening then this is happening. So she continued to argue and

happening. So she continued to argue and he became very irritated and he put his hands like this what he was doing. He

leaned to the table. He looked at us and he said very in a very irritated tone I need gobles propaganda if you want. I

need gobles propaganda. I need thousands of talking heads of gobble's propaganda.

Meaning Joseph Gerbles the Nazi propagandist.

Yes, that was Major Hitler's propagandist and we were like so shocked we we stopped breathing. But okay, the thing

stopped breathing. But okay, the thing is that I believe what happened in 2022 he's got his thousands of talking heads globally right?

And many of that of us were not supposed to be his heads. We just, you know, we were standing for the country. We we

believed that he would stop the war soon. That that, you know, we needed to

soon. That that, you know, we needed to be united. We believed in that. And four

be united. We believed in that. And four

years later, Ukrainians don't believe in Zilinski's agenda anymore. But still,

there are thousands of talking heads.

And many of them just get paid for that, you know. Um

you know. Um what do they get paid by?

Oh uh different stuff. For instance, if they asked to the conferences for moderation or for writing positive message, it's called positive message

about Ukraine. Uh some oligarchs can pay

about Ukraine. Uh some oligarchs can pay or you know it it goes from grants or something like this. In Ukraine

obviously the experts get paid from uh the structures that are close to the government those the biggest patriots or um you know grants from European Union for instance and you know I'm not saying

that these people are bad no they are not in many ways they just not are aware of what's happening they're calling they're talking to each other or to some experts or to the government they still

believe in the legend that Zalinsky has some ratings and by the way just a week ago I was talking to insider from the office of the president and again I was working for the office of the president.

I know there are different ratings, ratings that are closed just for the eyes of the president and few in the team and ratings that are presented to the government to to the public, right?

And the insider from from politics who saw the ratings said that Zilinsky is non-electable. His ratings are so low. I

non-electable. His ratings are so low. I

was looking at those ratings in 2023 and 2024 every month and his ratings were very, very low, getting lower and lower and lower. And here is another big

and lower. And here is another big revelation for you. When Donald Trump went out and named Zilinski a dictator and when he was talking about low

ratings of Zalinski, of course, Zalinsky said that Donald Trump is influenced by Russians and this is all Russian propaganda and Donald Trump was called

pro-Russian as every critic of Zalanski.

But in fact, uh, Donald Trump got information from a lot of Ukrainians.

These are former government officials and even current government officials.

These are people who close to President Zalinski. They provided evidence,

Zalinski. They provided evidence, documents, witnesses, what they knew, everything. Because when Donald Trump

everything. Because when Donald Trump came to power for the second term, so many Ukrainians hoped and still hope that he will help achieve peace.

I hope so, too.

Cost of living is already making it hard to live here and it's not getting any better. Unfortunately, it's likely to

better. Unfortunately, it's likely to get worse. And a lot of Americans fill

get worse. And a lot of Americans fill the gap with credit cards, not just for fancy dinners, but to cover things like groceries and bills. That is a disaster.

It's understandable, but don't go down that road because there is a tax in effect, a survival tax of 20% interest or more. Why would you do that? Why

or more. Why would you do that? Why

would you hand money to the big banks when you could keep it for your family?

Our friends at American Financing have a better way. If you're looking to buy

better way. If you're looking to buy your first home or refinance your current one, they're helping Americans achieve the dream of home ownership with monthly mortgage rates currently in the fives. American Financing saves its

fives. American Financing saves its customers an average of 800 bucks per month. That's nearly 10 grand every year

month. That's nearly 10 grand every year back to you. This isn't just a loan.

It's a total financial reset.

So, debt is tough, but there's a smart way to do it and a reckless, self-destructive way to do it. Credit

cards. And so, we recommend American Financing. They're salary based, not

Financing. They're salary based, not commission based, which means they actually work for you, not the banks.

They're called America's Home for Home Loans for a reason. Call 8006855696.

8006855696 or visit americanfinancing.net/tucker.

What was Zilinsk's relationship?

Like, I'm so angry, Mom.

It's okay. It's You have every reason to be. You have every reason to be. It's

be. You have every reason to be. It's

your country. Mhm.

Can't even imagine actually you can't.

No, I can't. I hope I never have to see anything like that here.

What was Silinsk's relationship like with Joe Biden?

Oh, so there is a very good American journalist who wrote a book and he mentioned that relationships. But I also met him and um he told me in private

conversation that Biden was thinking that Zalinsky was emotionally manipulative.

when I was there uh um he also described in the book that Zilinsky thought that Biden was weak.

Um when I was there, Zalinsky had several interviews to push Biden for some agenda and I remember that I met one American

diplomat. He was pissed off with this

diplomat. He was pissed off with this interview. He was shouting at me so so

interview. He was shouting at me so so much and it was a party and I was not the organizer. Mr. Yarmmach was an

the organizer. Mr. Yarmmach was an organizer and diplomat knew he's just so pissed off that he couldn't stop shouting and he shouted that that

interview was uh kind of either stupid or unprofessional and it shouldn't be like that. Um when I was leaving and I

like that. Um when I was leaving and I resigned that there there are BS who are spreading the rumor that I was fired because I worked for Russia. This is not true. Uh we departed on good terms.

true. Uh we departed on good terms. Zanski thanked me. He wished me good luck. They wanted me to continue as an

luck. They wanted me to continue as an adviser to the office. So we defied it in good in good terms. Um the thing is that um

uh Zilinski actually uh was destroying relations with multiple actors in the west including with the United States.

And uh one of the things was that since 2020 till 2021 for a year uh there was a reform agenda and Zilinski literally was

destroying every reform and it was happening like one by one like and that was disastrous and um what kind of reforms?

Uh what kind of reforms? Uh so there was an agreement with the IMF in 2020.

Ukraine was as often on the verge of uh default and we needed money and obviously IMF doesn't provide you money for free. So there was like 10 or 12

for free. So there was like 10 or 12 positions of the reforms that needed to be done and uh um as soon as as so Zilinski really did a miraculous job

with two the most difficult reforms. He pressed the the parliament to vote for it for them which actually means that he could go through this agenda difficult

agenda and push for the reforms. He just didn't want to. As soon as two reforms were pushed through, the IMF approved $5.5 billion.

And I remember I was present at the conversation between Zilinski and Cristina Gorga. They spoke in Russian

Cristina Gorga. They spoke in Russian because Cristina Gyorga is Bulgarian and they had such trust and understanding you know but as soon as the money came

through and the first branch was 2.1 billion more than they wanted to give uh at the beginning in few days Zalinski uh violated the first reform he fired by

political reasons the head of the national bank and it was a big scandal.

Curselina Gerorgva called back and she never spoke uh in Russian to Zilinski anymore because she was undermined. She

promised to the boat that he was a reliable man that he agreed for reforms that he proved that he could push reforms through and then suddenly as soon as he gets first money he uh fires

the head of the national bank and the head of the national bank said that he was fired via political pressure and you know that was a scandal.

Um Zilansky explained her this. He said

there will be another independent head of the national bank but he will just be our he will be just our head of national bank. He will be professional and

bank. He will be professional and independent but he will be coming from us. He doesn't understand what he is

us. He doesn't understand what he is saying right it it it's hilarious. Do

you understand me?

I do. I do.

Okay. So then after that there was uh justice reform. There was a scandal in in the courts. Then there was another another another like every reform and

the last one that was really that that was really blowing up it was uh corporate reform actually the reform that was needed to be destroyed to make corruption.

So uh the United States helped Ukraine to establish the corporate reform s in the United States. There is the board of independent people who looks how

actually the state enterprises are working and looking so that there is no corruption there. There is a big

corruption there. There is a big Ukrainian uh oil and gas company NAFTA gas in Ukraine and Zalinski just

dismissed the uh independent board and put his own people there and um um yeah this is something that hasn't been public but we were talking to

anti-corruption activists and um there was money laundering at some point from NAFTA gas. So Zilinski just wanted to

NAFTA gas. So Zilinski just wanted to turn this state oil and gas company in in Russian gas prom. So when there is your own person there and there are doc

offices and the money is laundered from there and that's when the United States was so pissed off that they did not uh uh they did not prolong uh the sanctions

against Nordstream. I'm going really

against Nordstream. I'm going really deep here. I don't know if your audience

deep here. I don't know if your audience is going I mean I I I don't know if your audience is going to understand everything but Nstream was a pipeline that uh Russia

was building to bring its own uh gas to to the European Union and it was sanctioned by by the United States and uh so when Ukraine when President

Zalinski was actually violating all the reforms that uh he had agreed with the United States at some point Biden's administration was so pissed off that

They decided to allow Russia to finish this Nstream pipeline.

Doesn't make sense.

It does. And then they blew it up in the end anyway.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

We pray that the war with Iran ends immediately, but the truth is it doesn't seem to be. If you're the head of household, you need to think through what this could mean for you and the people you're in charge of. Don't wait

for disaster to strike to ensure that you have the basics covered. Food,

water, light, energy. And that's exactly why we started a company called Last Country Supply. It's our store that

Country Supply. It's our store that carries the same preparedness products that we have well in this barn, for example. The products that give any head

example. The products that give any head of household peace of mind knowing that if something bad happened, you could take care of the people you're responsible for. So continue to pray for

responsible for. So continue to pray for an end to war and violence, but also at the same time make sure that your family is ready. Stock up on the products that

is ready. Stock up on the products that we trust at lastount supply.com/tucker.

Is Zalinski himself corrupt?

So there was one minister I I don't name the people, okay? But um uh he had good connections with the United States and that's why Zilinski appreciated him. And

there was this absolutely ridiculous story that uh you know Ukrainian ministries get very low salaries like $12,000 per year.

Yeah. Yeah.

That's why there is corruption there, right?

Yes. And uh he said, "Look, I don't need much, but I will need like $5,000 per month, so 60,000 per year." Yep.

Like, you know, really didn't want much, but that would guarantee that he did not make corruption. Zalinsky, of course,

make corruption. Zalinsky, of course, promised him in his first interview and obviously did not do anything for that.

Uh so uh the minister just started writing himself premier bonuses and uh opposition was attacking him like oh my god $5,000 per month for the

ministry that was such a scandal you know Zalinsky obviously didn't like that so when the first government was dismissed this guy was invited and Zalinsky said look I like how you work you have good relations with the west

maybe you want to continue in the other government but you cannot have $5,000 of official salary because it causes so much scandal and when the guy entered the room there

was President Zalinski here, Mr. Yermak here and another person whom I know here and there was a bag of dollars on their table and the guy said I can give you

5,000 of official salary but I will be giving you 5,000 of you know dark money every month. So you can get your salary

every month. So you can get your salary but it's not going to be official. Okay,

which means if Zilansky knows it, it's not corruption. Of course.

not corruption. Of course.

You see, does he take Do you think Zalinski and his family have gotten rich since the war began?

They have always been rich. He's playing

this poor guy in his this cheap uh sweater. He is rich, obviously. Um,

sweater. He is rich, obviously. Um,

look, I don't know where the money goes, but I was meeting one veteran of politics who has known Zilinski for dozens of years, and the first thing he asks me, "Where is the money?" I'm like,

"What?" He's like, I know Zanski for

"What?" He's like, I know Zanski for many years. He has never lifted a finger

many years. He has never lifted a finger for free. He would never do anything for

for free. He would never do anything for free. So, you know, I'm not a law

free. So, you know, I'm not a law enforcement. It's something for the law

enforcement. It's something for the law enforcement to prove. But I've just told you already two stories, right? There

was another story from another minister who just called us recently and he said uh when he was um on the position uh

those very close people to Zalanski were actually taking percentage from some some governmental uh programs I mean illegal percentage.

Yes. And uh he told Zilanski that they are taking really too much already like really they're insisting on very big

amounts. And Zilanski smiled and said

amounts. And Zilanski smiled and said good job guys. Good job guys. And he was not joking. The minister says he was not

not joking. The minister says he was not joking. He was really happy it was

joking. He was really happy it was happening. And then the minister thought

happening. And then the minister thought oh we are not going far with this. Yeah.

He resigned later. Uh now in the government there are very uh few people who are professionals. They are there but very few. Uh mostly the landscape

puts the loyalists who will never say no and who create the agenda that absolutely is out of mind. uh he just wants something like if he is writing

his scripts you know of of the servant of the people and then he just wants he he demands this and people go and you know they just make up some reports and

he goes with this reports and says that this is true this is how it works unfortunately he's a PR guy and PR only PR he's not the the guy of substance

who does he listen to who are his adviserss you said was his chief of staff for years. I don't know that he still is, but he's identified in the west as Zalinsk's closest friend and adviser. Is that true? And who who is

adviser. Is that true? And who who is Yermach?

Uh Mr. Yermach started his career at the strip club. Uh long ago. Yeah. Like not

strip club. Uh long ago. Yeah. Like not

stripper but as a lawyer. Um

at a strip club.

Yes. a lot. That was a strip club where there were a lot of those people who later would become uh uh politicians in the pro-Russian uh uh party and uh he

was a lawyer there and I was talking to a first employee of first employee said he had so many ambitions and he had no absolutely talents for those ambitions.

That's that's just you know a quote.

Uh yeah so he started like that and he met there a lot of people who would later join into politics. um

at the strip club.

Yeah, it was very famous strip club. Uh

it was '9s I think or early 2000s. Then

he was working for uh a a store of luxury brands uh that mostly are brought uh not officially via uh smuggling and

that's where he also met a lot of uh rich people, oligarchs and 95th quartile is also buying clothes there. So

officially Mr. Mark says that he was a lawyer at one of the biggest Ukrainian channels and that's where he met Zalinski who used to be a general producer of that channel but I'm not sure where they met. Uh so it's possible

that they just met through you know some other entertaining uh stories. Uh

Yermach also made some movies about smuggling which is very symbolic for me since he used to work in that business.

uh he was involved in some dark affairs of uh mafia stuff uh on the level of KFC city and um that's what how you know he

knew a lot of politicians and from the point of view of not politics but how the things can be

done he could be helpful to Zalanski.

Um their relations was very strange, very different, very very difficult, very strange. Uh Yermach knows that he

very strange. Uh Yermach knows that he is personally narcissist and he knows that Zalinski is narcissist and these are two malign and paranoid

narcissist. Oh my god, what I'm saying

narcissist. Oh my god, what I'm saying that, but that's true. Um

Yermach and Zilinsky are both malign narcissist.

Your M and Zalinsky are both malignant and very paranoid narcissists who are both on defensive mode. And

they're both paranoid.

Your Mac more.

Yeah.

How paranoid?

Oh, your Mac, he just creates the stuff from nowhere. He just like

from nowhere. He just like you don't need to do anything while he can come up come up with something. I

don't know. It's it's really some kind of a sick mind to be frank frank. And um

it was some kind of a symbios and uh Zalinski had the vision and Yermach had the tools to implement the vision. Uh it

was not about politics or policies. It

was more about what they wanted for themselves.

It's important to say that sometimes Zilinski didn't know how to make what he wanted how how to make it work.

Yes. So he was just saying the desires and Vermach was finding the way and often and often it was happening that Zalinski then says to do this but your

mark calls and say don't do this because he saw doing this in this way and in general that was so chaotic like no professional could work there. I'm I'm

saying that it's it's not possible because they just like keeping saying different things, keeping changing the strategies, keeping changing the moods, keeping changing everything all the time

and they create this feeling that there's so much work and everybody works works works, but no, nothing is done.

Sounds awful.

It's it's really strange, but I I'm not the one who knows that.

What what what do you think Zalinski wanted? like what were his goals?

wanted? like what were his goals?

Uh well, I definitely know that uh he thought he came forever.

Uh his first chief of staff said it once he laughed to the minister and said we came forever.

That's um so he liked being the dictator.

Well, he is a dictator.

Uh the closed the borders are closed now for four years. It's illegally. The

human rights violations is enormous. The

persecution of the people. In 2024, when Donald Trump came to power, there was a member of parliament who wrote on telegram, "Zilinsky, now you need to stop this war." And yes, you will lose

the next elections, but stop this war.

Like Trump will push you, stop this war.

And uh he was in jail in 3 days. He's

still in jail. And I talked Yeah. And I

talked to security services and they said he he never talked to Russia since 2021. No connection but he is uh accused

2021. No connection but he is uh accused in treason and there are a lot of people who are people are persecuted. Um obviously

there are dirty campaigns. Everyone who

criticizes Zilinski is just uh pro-Russian Russian pro Kremlin. You're

pro Kremlin. I will be pro Kremlin after this interview. You know, I believe that

this interview. You know, I believe that American special services do their job well and if there were any programming payments or contacts, obviously they would know that, right?

Um yeah, so in general this is it. But

uh you know for me personally the situation in the country is inhuman because I never would think that my country would be the one where people are

grabbed on the streets and forced to the front lines. I never would think that we

front lines. I never would think that we all agree and uh stay silent to the fact that Zalinsky uses front line as the punishment like and

he uses the war as a punishment, political punishment.

Yeah. He even was uh open about that. He

was saying if somebody does something bad, we need to punish them and send to the front line. That was his statements.

Uh but uh there are people who are sent there just because they're critics of Zilinski, you know.

Do you know anyone who's been sent for criticizing Zanski?

Uh there were people from the security services who were sent uh publicly and there were a few people who were sent there.

What's it like the front line?

There are different front lines. Some

people find front line, you know, in a cozy place just wearing the uniform and uh playing the role of some bloggers.

But I know people who survived when their units were killed.

It's terrifying. Uh my mother was treating soldiers who were sent in bad uniforms uh during winter uh to another

side and um their fingers and limbs were cut off because they were frozen.

Every year Ukrainians are collecting money for their uniforms, you know, necessary stuff. Women are cooking food

necessary stuff. Women are cooking food for for the soldiers. No, I'm not kidding. There are a lot of volunteers.

kidding. There are a lot of volunteers.

But the West has sent hundreds of billions of dollars and they don't have gloves or food. Where all the Well, they have some of them have food.

Some of them are looking for more, you know, and uh yeah, usually people are collecting even money for weapons or for starings.

What about all the hundreds of billions from the Yeah, you need to track it. You need to track it. But look uh there is a scandal

track it. But look uh there is a scandal right now in Ukraine when the minister of energy was fired and uh it is now known that uh he helped money launder

112 bill million dollars uh $12 million and those uh money should have been used for the shield for energy sector and it's a huge scandal in Ukraine. There is

proven stuff by the law enforcement and behind the whole scheme is the guy who worked with Russian mafia.

That's amazing. You you should go and look into it. But there is the whole scheme with the offshore companies with the names behind and the minister of

energy himself got $12 million for this.

So it's around 10%.

And 10% is usually paid for those who help establish the scheme, right? So

where is the 90%.

That is the question. I'm just I know I've said this before, but I'm amazed that more people from Zilinski's government haven't come forward to say

this in the West in English.

Why is that?

Why haven't Because people are afraid.

What are they afraid of? on Netflix

there is a movie a series how to become a tyrant.

I didn't know about that unless one governmental official came to me and said, "I watched that series. It's

what's happening in the country and it was before the war. I mean large scale war. Everyone is afraid. Zilinsky has no

war. Everyone is afraid. Zilinsky has no limits. That's the problem. I am sitting

limits. That's the problem. I am sitting here because I know that he is in a weak point today. And I know that there are a

point today. And I know that there are a lot of people in his government and in his vertical of power who want peace.

And I'm I didn't want to put [ __ ] on him. I'm sitting here because I want

him. I'm sitting here because I want peace, too. And this guy is going to

peace, too. And this guy is going to come up with any condition. He's going

to change the positions all the time just to prolong this war and to get more money. He doesn't want to have political

money. He doesn't want to have political suicide. Finishing war for him is a

suicide. Finishing war for him is a political suicide. You see,

political suicide. You see, I do.

So, I'm sitting here having this belief that if he is furiously ordering the people to arrange something against me,

maybe in this vertical of power would be people who will not agree now. But even

two years ago, they would do whatever he want.

What do you think he would do to you for saying this if he could?

Look, I'm risking everything. I cannot

return to Ukraine after this interview.

Okay.

Um, I know people who get threats a month ago there was um a banker in Milan who fell out of of of the window in Milan.

Yes.

Milan, Italy.

Yes. And Italy is investigating it. But

there was one guy, a story that nobody paid attention to, who died when Zilinsky was traveling to Mr. Biden in September 2023.

Uh the guy used to be a governor of my region, Herson region where I'm originally from.

If you think about the governors, they are usually very rich local, very successful, strong people. Perhaps

processes, have a lot of money. It's

very strange that he died behind garages by making suicide of poisoning himself.

And I talked to one very deep insider in top position in security service. And

the guy told me this is a very strange death because this guy was negotiating with Russians. He was getting his orders

with Russians. He was getting his orders from Yermach. I know the middle man. And

from Yermach. I know the middle man. And

then he was passing some information to Russians when Russians were occupying her son and then back. And then when Zilinski travels to Biden, this guy

makes suicide behind garages and security service explains that he had he had a depression.

He had depression.

He had depression. A rich guy, strong guy, used to be a governor of he he had depression and he decided to poison himself behind garages.

I mean, this all just doesn't come together.

No, it doesn't. So people who work for Zilinski believe that if they were to criticize him they could be killed or jailed or jailed.

I told you just about the member of parliament but there are also those people who sit there for years and the courts cannot the general prosecution cannot prove the guilt that they accused

in. It's also treason you know

in. It's also treason you know collaboration with Russia for it's it's for for Yeah. And it's for criticism. It's it's just, you know,

criticism. It's it's just, you know, political fight, nothing more.

What are jails like in Ukraine?

Oh, they're awful.

Oh, they are awful. Um, a lot of people in one place. Uh, uh, now, by the way, there was the news that, uh, diseases are being spread. It's very cold. Uh,

the food is terrible. It's it's it's a terrible place to be. It's not like in American jail. No, it's a terrible place

American jail. No, it's a terrible place to be.

So Ukrainians can't speak up for fear of being imprisoned or killed. But why do you think Western media hasn't spoken up

here? I would like to say uh the thing

here? I would like to say uh the thing that the freedom of speech in Ukraine is in bad shape, but I believe that it improved when

Donald Trump came to power for the second term because there are more and more news coming up and uh despite that some journalists are also sent to the

front lines or attacked still you know there are materials that are coming up and uh when this freezing When winter was happening, terrible winter when

people were freezing their homes without light, without water, the whole in revolution on Instagram, Ukrainian Instagram started. And I

wanted to tell you two trends, just two of multiple trends that are happening on Instagram right now that will show you that Ukrainians are suffering under

Zilinski. They don't support what

Zilinski. They don't support what Zalinski is doing. One of the trends is they are burning the books with Zilinski

speeches in their fireplaces or fires saying, "Huh, finally we figured out why we needed those."

The second thing is very politically incorrect and I'm very sorry in story.

Okay, I'm very sorry, but um I try to describe the desperacy and the dark humor that Ukrainians use. A driver is

uh parking on the parking lot for a place for a disabled person and another person is coming with a telephone asking why did you park on the place for a

disabled person and the driver responds respond responds and the driver responds I'm going to vote for Zanski for the second time.

You mean mentally disabled? Yes.

So these are trends. This is not like one reals or two reals. These are trends and they're going viral and this is the way how people are trying to shout out

we are desperate. Please stop this war.

Please stop this nonsense. Please stop

this autocracy. There is no reason why to fight this war. It's senseless. You

see people lost all sense of this war.

Like if this war is for NATO or against NATO expansion, then Ukraine has no chances to be in NATO. If Putin conducts this war against Zilinski, then Zilinski

is the main beneficiary of this war.

It's true.

If this war is for returning territories, then we have been losing territories for three years. If this war is for democracy, then we have no

democracy in the country. Now people in the frontline regions they tell terrible things. One person told me I don't know

things. One person told me I don't know what we are fighting for. What's the

difference between Ukraine and Russia right now? There is autocracy there and

right now? There is autocracy there and autocracy here. There is no anything

autocracy here. There is no anything that would would be democratic now. So

what's the fight for? This is not what I'm saying. This is what people from

I'm saying. This is what people from different regions are saying.

Yes. And I believe that Zilinski had two chances of finishing this war in 2022.

Two chances. Now he says that 90% of Ukrainians will not forgive him giving up Danbas.

Where does he come from with this numbers? Like there are no such numbers.

numbers? Like there are no such numbers.

Realistically no such numbers.

And I was talking to people who represented Ukraine at negotiations in Istanbul in 2022.

Yes. The famous negotiations where they came pretty close.

Oh, they were almost done. Yeah. And uh

I was explained in details that they agreed for everything and furthermore which is very important.

They said that Zilinski personally agreed to give away and I I was shocked at that moment. It

was a shocking news and I said really did he and the guy told of course he is he is okay with that because he will

stop the horror of war. He he agreed for giving away the territory because because that would mean the war is over.

And now he is standing in front of millions of audiences telling I cannot give away Donbas. You see he he is inconsistent. He is changing the

inconsistent. He is changing the positions all the time. The second time when he could and the office of the

president planned he would finish the war was the end of 2022. And as I read uh the New York Times who actually

confirmed my insights that um the Biden administration decided to go with his plan to continue that war. That was Mr. Blink who was advising you know if

Ukraine wants to fight then Ukraine needs to fight despite all the evidence that we could not win that war.

Of course not.

Um you know there is this thing also everything that he said against Zilinski is being pro-Russian and now um you know

this Mr. Johnson Prime Minister Johnson thing Boris Johnson Boris Johnson is a a big friend of Zalansky. He's an evil man. Ah

so um remember BHA BHA is a small town in Kiev region and uh it was occupied by Russia and there are a lot of terrible things and terrible deaths happened

there and Zalinski came to Bha after it was de occupied uh on April 4th 2022 and I remember him standing in front of the journalist and he had this you know

terrible face and terrible terrible you know look And he was it it it felt like he he he went through pain

while seeing all those bodies there.

But he was asked if he was going to continue the negotiations with Russia and he said yes yes yes I am going to continue that that's fixed on a camera he was going to continue

and then you know they had all the agreement by positions about Donbas about language about many many things they agreed upon

everything and then Boris Johnson came and now it is said that this is Putin's lies but this story was told by Ukrainian Ukrainians. It was not told by

Ukrainian Ukrainians. It was not told by Russians. Ukrainians who were trying to

Russians. Ukrainians who were trying to bring peace knew that Boris Johnson influenced the decision.

And Zilinski was promised to have everything. Weapons, influence, fame,

everything. Weapons, influence, fame, you know, and he will fight Russia and he will be a great hero. And that's

everything that Zalinsky wants. He

doesn't care about people. He cares

about staying in power. He cares about being the great hero in the history.

So I believe there were two two moments where he could finish this war but he chose the war of attrition.

I don't know how 25 million of Ukrainians who stay in the country can have war war with attrition with with Russia that has the population of 140 million people.

uh with Russia who by the way in four years has not even borrowed for this war and Ukraine has the debt of 100% of GDP

with Russia that awaits sanctions still tries to sell you know it's and Ukraine has no market economy I mean

Russia is so much bigger than Ukraine that Ukraine could never win it's just too big Russia's too big you know the New York Times wrote a story that was scandalous in 2023 and

the title was Ukraine will need to choose between people and territories and we are indeed choosing and our leader is choosing territory but it's not I mean look I'm not an

expert at all on on Eastern Europe but I have Wikipedia I looked up land mass population industrial capacity you don't need that much information to know this

country cannot beat that country in a land war which is I it was obvious I don't understand I think it's obvious for Zilinski, too.

But he thrives on this war. He thrives

on this war. Why would he finish it?

Well, because it's destroying his country.

I don't think he he thinks about that.

In 2024, I was talking to a very smart guy who knows Russia and knows Ukraine very well. He used to be an adviser to

very well. He used to be an adviser to the presidents.

He's an American, by the way. And u he said me that Zalansky would finish the war till the end of 2024.

I said no he won't. He said why? He's

losing the territories. Russians will go to Nepropet and other regions or sum. He names all those regions of

sum. He names all those regions of Ukraine. And I'm like this is not the

Ukraine. And I'm like this is not the reason for him to stop.

And the guy could not understand like he could not he's like but why? You're

going to lose the territories. You're

going to lose more. And I'm saying this is not not how he thinks.

He he he imagines the lives like he his thinking is limited with thinking of what he sees of of his beautiful golden office you

know and and and and the guy was like okay they in the I'm like not a reason they're in not a reason they're there they're there and then the guy says okay there needs to be somewhere a point

where he will understand that Russians are winning maybe when Russians are with the hands in his office. I'm like, yeah, that's where he will understand there.

So, it sounds like he doesn't care very much about Ukraine.

He never cared. He never car he never cared about the people. That's the

point.

There are, you know, there are I I tried to come up not only with the insights. I

think the things that I told you are quite terrible, but this is who he is.

But let just check the facts online.

Okay. At the Munich conference, Zalinsky insisted that ceasefire is the condition for peace, for negotiations, and for elections. He's keeping pushing for

elections. He's keeping pushing for ceasefire again knowing that Russia is against ceasefire. It's like the NATO

against ceasefire. It's like the NATO story right?

Yes.

If you go online and check his speech for the UN General Assembly September 2024, he was saying that no ceasefire is possible, that it's very irresponsible

to ask Ukraine for a ceasefire, that a ceasefire will lead to a frozen conflict and he was going against a ceasefire all the time.

Then second thing uh in June 2024 there was a peace summit uh where Ukraine uh presented Zilinsk's peace formula. There were 160

peace formula. There were 160 delegations coming from different countries and I truly believe that those delegations wanted to discuss peace. Uh

there were discussions about the energy security, returning children and something else and Switzerland suggested that they invite Russian delegation maybe even

Vladimir Putin.

Yeah.

And office of the president was very much against it and office of the president of Ukraine even organized a media campaign saying that it is

absolutely morally impossible to talk to Russia to Putin. we need just to pressure no negotiations with Russia.

You see at the same time when he was presenting the formula of peace, Ukraine was organizing the Kursk region operation and how do actually you offer

the world to have peace and at the same time are planning operation to invade Ksk region. You see these are very

Ksk region. You see these are very inconsistent things. Then after his just

inconsistent things. Then after his just formula where he suggested one things he offered victory plan where he suggested

completely different things. Then in

November 2024 he said that he would agree for temporary occupation of some territories if another government controlled territory of Ukraine will be

included in NATO. Then in several days he said that he was misinterpreted.

I'm telling you so many examples when he has been changing the conditions preconditions to end this war because he doesn't want to end the war because he doesn't want to end this war.

I counted with my insights around seven attempts to finish this war where he used different mediators. He used

different countries. We promised those mediators, he promised those countries, those leaders that he would start negotiations that he would agree for

conditions and he always lied.

But it's I'm not giving him a pass. I'm

not making excuses for Zalinski.

But Ukraine has got, you know, 100% debt to GDP ratio, limited industrial capacity, like it it can't fight a war without Western aid, period. And so it's

France, UK, United States that are paying for all this. Why would

the Western countries want to keep the war going? Obviously, they do.

war going? Obviously, they do.

This is a very good question. To be

frank, I think that uh the approach that Donald Trump team offered is a very constructive approach. In any way,

constructive approach. In any way, Ukraine wouldn't survive without aid.

But one thing, one thing is to plan the investment, right? To boost businesses,

investment, right? To boost businesses, to provide jobs, to play taxes, to to recover economy, and to have returnings,

right? And another one just to to

right? And another one just to to provide the money for the war. And I

believe that um the governments gave so much money and um some of those governments they just um cannot back up now. They cannot say that we gave those

now. They cannot say that we gave those money for a dictator because they're afraid about their ratings and their own situation. Right

now some of the Europeans were saying Ukrainians members of parliament that Ukraine was undermining them because of corruption. Ukrainians are begging.

corruption. Ukrainians are begging.

Please just open your eyes. Help us stop this war. It's It's not about your

this war. It's It's not about your ratings. It's about people paying with

ratings. It's about people paying with blood.

Of course, but it sounds like that's not going to be possible as long as Zalinsky is there. The war won't end as long

is there. The war won't end as long I believe that he will finish this war.

I don't It sounds like it. If there are seven attempts to finish the war and his only position has been the war needs to continue, he's clearly not the guy to

end the war. So, how do you get Zilinski out?

That's a good question and I'm not the one to answer it.

Well, there no elections. So,

but we are in a legal trap here and uh he the last time when he was planning elections uh he actually didn't want to leave the martial law and wanted to have one round elections so that he can

manufacture them. And this is the

manufacture them. And this is the article on a very reliable Ukrainian media outlet. Um the journalists talk to

media outlet. Um the journalists talk to insiders from from the office and from the parliament.

Just another example. Look, there was this Munich security conference and um Zalinsky assaulted uh the prime minister of Hungary, Mr. Orban.

That's so interesting. Just like

I'm saying so many bad things. I feel so bad about that. But just like if you're a rational person, think about this.

Yes.

The leader of Ukraine standing in front of all the leaders and keeps assaulting one of the European leaders. In a week, this European leader will need to vote

for a 90 billion loan for Ukraine.

And obviously Orban just blocked everything. And everybody is like

everything. And everybody is like pointing fingers to Orban. How bad Orban is, how bad Orban is. Perhaps he is. I'm

not justifying urban here, but if you are a leader of a country, how on earth are you assaulting a person from whom you will need a support of 90 billion of

a loan without which Ukraine just cannot go further?

So that's a great question and I watched him do the same thing to Donald Trump.

Absolutely. Can I finish?

So what is that?

Yeah. Can I finish this moment? The

thing is that um the conflict that has escalated recently is about a pipeline oil pipeline. Uh Hungary was getting

oil pipeline. Uh Hungary was getting Russian oil through Ukraine and it's damaged and Zilinski made this again performance huge performance as if he is a brave

hero who is fighting against Russian oil, Russian gas, all Russian etc etc. At the same time Ukraine on technical level is repairing the pipeline. The

European Commission is insisting that we do it as fast as possible and Ukraine is sending the explanation to the European Commission. You know it will take some

Commission. You know it will take some time but we are offering you another pipeline so that there is no energy crisis. So the work is there right and

crisis. So the work is there right and Zilinski is just performing some stuff in his head. And the other important moment in this, do you know that this

was France, not Hungary, who bought the biggest number of Russian energy products last year, including Russian LG that it's selling to Germany. So why

doesn't Zilinski go against Macron? I

don't understand that.

Well, it's a great question. I I'm I'm aware of this. Um,

and Donald Trump, uh, you know, I was watching that thing that that Oval Office situation.

For me, it was so painful. It is so painful. Every time when I'm posting on

painful. Every time when I'm posting on my Twitter videos of ruined Ukrainian cities, every time I have this quote

from Zanski, we've got beautiful cities.

Come and see. I'm like how you can say that these ruins are beautiful cities.

The thing is that many people who know Zanski they characterize the situation that this is what's happening behind the camera

usually such hysterical behavior no control of emotions this manipulation attempts to prove

himself. This is the landscape. This is

himself. This is the landscape. This is

how he looks all the time.

Is he a drug user?

This is an open secret. Um,

the thing is that I've never seen him taking drugs. However, for writing my

taking drugs. However, for writing my book, I met a lot of people who confirmed that they saw him taking drugs in different clubs.

Um, only one saw him taking drugs. In

2021, I learned who is the supplier from 95th quartile. Um, and I met that person. And

quartile. Um, and I met that person. And

you met Zilinsk's drug dealer.

I'm not saying he's a drug dealer. He's

a guy from 95th quartile. And uh,

what's 95th Cortile?

95th quartile. Uh, it's it's it's entertaining company of Zilinski. Uh,

uh, 95th quartile where he comes from.

Uh it's it's the guy who who is an actor. Um and uh he he behaved really in

actor. Um and uh he he behaved really in a strange way. His eyes and his behavior.

Is it is Zilinski using cocaine?

Again I I have not seen that. So uh the thing is that u all these people are talking about cocaine. Yes. The second

thing is um every time when we were preparing to uh the interview you know I was bringing in the notes explaining who is the journalist what he needs to say

the messaging the questions he does not like reading to be frank usually he's more you know like tries to

listen to you and then uh he takes his like 15 minutes in the bathroom and I'm telling you that I was always surprised ized um that he was going out

a different person. Like really always a different person.

So you'd be briefing him.

Then he goes to the bathroom. He spends

there 15 minutes and he's going out energized full of you know action ready to say everything sniffing.

So I don't want to say something that I didn't see. But but I met too many

didn't see. But but I met too many people. I met doctors. I met you know

people. I met doctors. I met you know people who spent time with him in the clubs and I talked to the people who has

been knowing him for like 20 25 years and they say he's a cocaine and also I don't know if you followed that but there was an allegation

accusation that he's a cocaine uh user during his electoral campaign and that's why he invited his opponent President Poroshenko at that moment uh to take

analysis this on drugs and he went to the clinics of his friend and when the analysis was presented it happened that the analysis were was dated by different date when he gave

those analysis.

Ah that was a big scandal. I mean this is everywhere. The allegation is

everywhere. The allegation is everywhere. There are many people who

everywhere. There are many people who for a long time.

For a long time. Yeah. And you know there is this very strange behavior obviously. You know the there are a lot

obviously. You know the there are a lot of things that point out to it but I personally have not seen that.

But you spoke to his cocaine supplier from 95th cortile.

Not for the book. I met him in the office of the president. I didn't know about cocaine back then. But I was very surprised of his behavior. His eyes were

sparkling and he was so happy and slow and he was trying to make some jokes that I didn't understand. I was like

this is a strange guy and I didn't know what he was doing there because he didn't have any position. He just came to the office of the president.

What's Linsk's wife like?

You know, many people who know her respect her.

Many people were saying that she was the only human who stayed nearby him.

She really didn't want him to go for the second term. She even said this

second term. She even said this publicly, but I believe she changed.

And um I don't know if she still has that positive influence on him that she used to have, but Zilinsky never thought that

women are equally important.

He is the one who respects his woman, but not as she if she's like really equal. That if it makes sense,

equal. That if it makes sense, it does.

Once I was in this very weird situation, I was in many weird situations with Zilinski. It's just a norm. Uh but there

Zilinski. It's just a norm. Uh but there was this situation where there was his friend from 95th Bartal and Zalanski. We

were three of us.

I don't know for which reason this guy started telling a very funny to his mind situation that Orlando Zalinska was running after

Zalinski for eight years to make him marry her. And he he was a strong guy.

marry her. And he he was a strong guy.

He didn't want to marry. Haha. It was so funny.

Well, definitely Zalinsky was smiling a lot and he liked the story. I still

don't understand uh what was funny about that. Um I think Zalansky is a smart

that. Um I think Zalansky is a smart person, but she does not care and doesn't know anything about politics and she doesn't want to be involved.

She tried to stay human.

I'm not sure what worked out through when when did you leave the country Ukraine? I

Ukraine? I I would prefer not to talk about that.

Okay.

I stayed in the country in 2022.

We were shelled. By the way, when Russians were leaving BHA, we were shelled. It's just pure luck that he

shelled. It's just pure luck that he didn't hit the house. We were My husband went to the front lines.

We stayed in 2023, majority of 2024.

beginning of 2025 and I had so multiple sources that were saying that Zilinski is not going to finish this war. People are going crazy

there. I was going crazy. You're like in

there. I was going crazy. You're like in the closed cage. You're being shelled and bombed. You can die any moment from

and bombed. You can die any moment from Russian drone or Russian missile. At the

same time, you can't do anything. There

are no economic opportunities. There is

no freedom of speech. Anything you do can be you know treated in a different way. The country is full of bans.

way. The country is full of bans.

Everything is banned. There are strange rules like there is this very strange rule that

all the uh all the uh cars need to stop at 9:00 a.m. on the roads uh to listen to to the hymn. Uh it's just uh yeah

like if you drive and then there is 9:00 am and there is Ukrainian hymn you need to stop it there are really strange agenda and it looks like surreal the country I don't recognize Ukraine

anymore everything is banned what does that mean like he uses bans like like there is this culture that he developed the

culture of banning cancelling people artists you know um churches, poets, poets, churches, writers, you

know, like anything he can connect to Russia somehow. Sometimes it doesn't

Russia somehow. Sometimes it doesn't have any connection to Russia. It always

makes us weaker. Sometimes these are Ukrainians from the past, but yeah, they used to live under like Russian Empire or the USSR. There is this whole culture

of cancellation. uh he counelss

of cancellation. uh he counelss bloggers, journalists, not personally but but he has this tendency, he has

this orders like for instance in late 2023 I learned from the security service that Zilinski collected his guys and told them that they needed to go against

critical bloggers. At the end of at the

critical bloggers. At the end of at the beginning of 2024 there were like purchase of bloggers. Bloggers were

called to the security service having conversations why they did that, why they said that, that they will be accused in being pro-Russian. There was

a bunch of bloggers that went against the war and they said we don't need the borders of 1991.

We want to stop this war and all of them were called for a security service. One

guy needed to leave the country. He was

threatened. You know, every story can become a bigger story. can become a story with security service. You see,

can become a story of a treason. By the

way, the cases of treason rised multiple times in in four years. Multiple times.

Treason is just another punishment. You

see, he sounds like a bullshik.

In many ways, it feels like it's the USSR that we read about.

In many ways, it is.

So, just to restate the question, is there any way to get rid of Zalinski?

That's a good thing. You know the problem uh how to do this in a legal way

and who is going to be next? Who's going

to be who's going to fight with the landscape on the electoral field and how to restore the electoral field in general? You see?

general? You see?

Yes. And there are so many questions there that are not being solved at all.

And I'm not sure he wants to solve them.

So one big question to all the Ukrainians and Westerners who have resources, who have the power, who are

strong enough is actually how to make it in the legal field, how to finish this.

Yes.

And that's the answer to your question.

Why are Ukrainians silent? Rich people

are afraid of being sanctioned. By the

way, it's also a legal instrument that Zilinski uses. He sanctions his own uh

Zilinski uses. He sanctions his own uh citizens and it's absolutely anticonstitutional and people like that.

How can you sanction your own citizens?

Yes, he he he uses he sanctions his own citizens. That's uh pretty public and in

citizens. That's uh pretty public and in on his website for for I don't know, he comes up with the reasons working for Russia or whatever.

And what happens when you're sanctioned?

um your businesses can be closed, your uh accounts frozen. Um the former president is sanctioned. Uh so he says he cannot use his money anymore.

So just to go back to something you said earlier that I should have followed up on. When you were uh working for

on. When you were uh working for Zalinski, he told Putin, I think you said it was 2019, that Ukraine would not join NATO.

Then you fast forward a couple of years, three years, and he's telling the world that Ukraine does plan to join NATO, which you said is impossible. But what

do you think changed his mind? What

changed?

Well, I definitely know that he wanted to influence uh the American administration.

Um he really did want and um influence the American administration in what way? Yeah, I mean he wanted to get

what way? Yeah, I mean he wanted to get something. He wanted to get some

something. He wanted to get some support, friendship, you know, to get something. I remember the interview. I I

something. I remember the interview. I I

remember whom that interview was given when he first said uh why are we not in NATO? So it was a TV interview and I was preparing

messages. It has never been in messages.

messages. It has never been in messages.

We never discussed that actually. It was

not at the table at all. And uh he was sitting there and the journalist asked him so what would you tell or ask Biden about and he said why aren't we in NATO

and I started like looking at the messages and there is no this NATO thing he just came up with that and Zeleleski is the kind of person if you applaud he's going to continue and there were a

lot of nationalists who applauded who felt oh that's great stuff guy do it and so he saw the applaud because he saw the reaction and since his ratings were

dropping down, you know, and there was positive feedback, he just started pushing through this agenda, you know.

Again, I read the book uh about Biden and there was the description of the meeting in 2021 that was after I left few months and it happened that Zalinsky

insisted on this NATO issue from Biden thinking that that was only Biden who was the obstacle to this and if Biden said then they will be NATO. He didn't

want to listen to any arguments, any facts, nothing. And then when Biden

facts, nothing. And then when Biden said, "Look, there is no consensus for this," the guy said, "But NATO is outdated organization and it's going to

fall apart. Germany and France are going

fall apart. Germany and France are going to leave NATO now." And um as the journalist explains, um even those who

really liked Zilinski, they were blown up by this. They they thought he went too far. But this is, you know, this is

too far. But this is, you know, this is who is Zilinski. He's always escalating.

He's always demanding. He's always

proving himself.

You know, I was talking to one guy who used to work under two or three presidents and he said me that he's telling everyone that these two guys, Zilinsky and your mark, they are just

six year olds. He meant because they were six years in power, now they are seven year olds. And I myself was thinking that they behave more as teenagers. But we never had argument

teenagers. But we never had argument that they behave as adults. You see, so I believe that Zalinski, if that journalist who was an insider at

the White House says that Zalinski thought Biden was weak, I believe Zilinski thought Biden is weak and he can pressure and get the NATO thing

because Zilinski actually doesn't have much understanding of how things are working in his own government and globally.

Why are there so many Americans always in Ukraine? Always Americans in Ukraine.

in Ukraine? Always Americans in Ukraine.

American officials are always talking about Ukraine. No offense to Ukraine,

about Ukraine. No offense to Ukraine, but it's a very small country. It's a

very big world. But the US government was very focused on Ukraine for a long time. There were always journalists in

time. There were always journalists in and out of there, think tank people in there, US military. Like what was that?

Well, I think we are lucky that there are journalists there. Um, but it's a small country, you say, but it's comparatively big. Well, it's a large

comparatively big. Well, it's a large land mass for sure. But so is Kazakhstan.

Oh, yeah. But in Europe, it's like the second biggest country in Europe.

Well, if you don't count Russia, it's the biggest.

And so, um, I don't I've never understood You should ask Americans why they're Well, I've never understood it. I mean,

I think moneyaundering was part of it for sure.

I think Americans I mean, the pres former president's son was on the board of a Ukrainian energy company. I never

did you know that.

uh you know that I was a co-author of that very famous article about Hunter Biden and after that Biden's administration didn't give interview to the New York Times and I think that was

a very infant behavior from the communications people I was just a freelancer in Ukraine if for six years after that the biggest democratic president doesn't provide interview to

the biggest democratic media because of some freelancer you know having evidence of of you know some connected topics that's really ridiculous.

I remember that piece with that was with Ken Vogel, I think, and Yula Mandel.

Yep. Who was you? Um, so for the for whatever it's worth, for those who don't remember the piece, can you just summarize it? Tell us what it was about,

summarize it? Tell us what it was about, what it said. Uh well it was long ago but uh yeah Hunter Biden was invited to be on board of energy company that uh uh

was owned by big oligarch uh who is accused in money laundering and um you know big big guy really mafia guy and um

uh there was a general prosecutor who um opened 11 uh criminal proceedings uh against uh this company and Hunter Biden figured somewhere that he was he was

somewhere there but I was talking to general prosecutor and he told me that he reopened the cases but uh he could not prosecute Hunter Biden because Hunter Biden is an American and uh as as

Ukraine we just cannot do that but that was the whole story about you know that Hunter Biden was on the board uh and obviously it was not liked by Biden

administration very much um and there was a huge scandal and uh I did just my job, you know. I talked to the general prosecutor. I I went to to different

prosecutor. I I went to to different people. I asked the questions. I read

people. I asked the questions. I read

and translated the law. You know, I verified the information. I mean, Ken was doing major job. I was helping him.

And the New York Times stands for that piece. So, why should I be, you know,

piece. So, why should I be, you know, feeling bad about that?

Well, I don't think you should be at all.

Yeah. Yeah.

What was your reaction from the Zinsky government to you when that piece came out?

Oh. Oh. Uh, first of all, that was the transition moment.

Yeah, I bet. I'm sure it was.

Um, so he never actually reacted much. It

served more like a concern for him. He

didn't understand much what was happening. He just asked what was the

happening. He just asked what was the buzz about. His people asked me. I said,

buzz about. His people asked me. I said,

"Well, there was this piece, you know, I checked it. The New York Times stands

checked it. The New York Times stands for that. That's it. So they they had

for that. That's it. So they they had just the concern what was what was happening. But it was 2019 before Biden

happening. But it was 2019 before Biden came to power, right?

To be frank, yeah, I know that for Americans, it's a big story about corruption.

Um, for me as a Ukrainian, I still cannot understand what would have happened that Biden administration would allow Zilinski to continue this war.

I agree.

It's just like it's very hard to talk because you don't understand what's happening really. When people are being

happening really. When people are being hunted by drones. When people wake up to death and destruction. When are they being abandoned? When they are being

being abandoned? When they are being searched by law enforcement of their own country. When they don't have heat or

country. When they don't have heat or light or water. When they have no almost money and they have no help and they're not heard and they cannot leave their

country. It's such a trap. And this has

country. It's such a trap. And this has been happening for four years of a large scale and for many for 12 years. And the

only solution that is being presented today is just to say that Putin is a monster. Well, maybe he is. His army is

monster. Well, maybe he is. His army is doing terrible things.

But here is the point.

Keeping just offending Putin will reach nothing.

And my point is we need to do something as the country. We need to do something to start taking the decisions. We need

to start putting people first. And what

I see from Zalinski is just yes, I'm taking care about the people. Yes,

people are first. And then always there is but after this but there is the whole bunch of misleading information.

I don't believe that President Zilinski is really very constructive, let's say. So, I

believe he has some kind of mental challenges.

And so when I'm thinking about his meeting with Biden, who as has been proved by Alex Thompson and Jake Tapper had really already mental problems, I'm

thinking where did this world come to that there is one person leader with mental challenges and another person with mental challenges

actually deciding on the fate of the 40 million nation or 37 million nation. You

see, I just don't believe that Ukraine is just being destroyed. I believe that Ukraine is on the verge of extinction.

We have huge brain drain, enormous problems with the demography.

We do you know that that was the Ukrainian who actually made the program to send the first person to space Yuri

Kagarin. Now children in Kharkiv region

Kagarin. Now children in Kharkiv region in the fourth grade cannot read. You see

my nation is being deteriorating.

Yes.

So there is no but in this case people either go first or they go first and then but but but but a lot of conditions why not to stop this war. And you ask me

why all those think tankers and journalists come to Ukraine. I think they come to every

Ukraine. I think they come to every country and they were interested in the relations with Russia. But unfortunately

there is this I think absolutely destructive contribution to very unhealthy nationalism that has become a shield for the beneficiary

group in the country.

Of course, of course that's of course that happens every time. I just know a lot of the policy makers in the United States who promoted this war. Um, and I think that some of them wanted to

destroy Ukraine. I think that I'm sorry.

destroy Ukraine. I think that I'm sorry.

It's very inhuman. The propaganda that we hear, it's very inhuman. It's very

cynical. I mentioned to you this stuff about um, Russia is collapsing. This is

like already a Twitter joke. Russia is

collapsing for the fourth year in a row.

Mark Rut said few weeks ago that Russia in super bad shape. You need like three four months of war more to win. Where

does he come from that? Tell this a Ukrainian who is dying. Tell tell this to the mother who buried her son or a child. Tell this to a father who lost

child. Tell this to a father who lost three children and wife under shalling.

It's impossible to explain to the people how politicians come up with the conditions to justify this absolutely unjustified war because it's not their country and they

don't care. It's evil. I couldn't agree

don't care. It's evil. I couldn't agree more.

Many Ukrainians believe this already.

Many Ukrainians and again correct. I'm

not I'm not justifying Putin here. Okay.

There's nothing I I agree.

It's just like repeating that he is a monster doesn't help the situation.

No, I agree. It's like telling us that Iran's going to get a nuclear weapon in 3 weeks, you know, telling us that for 25 years at a certain point. I don't

believe you. Um, so you have asked to end with a message to the Russians, to Vladimir Putin, Russian president, um, in Russian and of course I can't

understand Russian. So, uh, but, uh,

understand Russian. So, uh, but, uh, you've done us, I think, us, the United States, a great service by this interview. And so I would be happy to

interview. And so I would be happy to turn it over to you to speak directly in Russian uh to the Russian president.

Thank you.

Of course.

It's actually quite a moving moment.

Shall I look there?

Look there.

Ukraine.

forch.

Propaganda.

telephone bill.

Russia army for stupid mirror. Fore

stupid mirror. Fore stupid.

for I don't know if he will hear me.

It's uh you know I'm actually grateful that I didn't cry so much. I usually cry so much when I'm

so much. I usually cry so much when I'm talking about the war.

Well, I appreciate everything you've done and I hope this is widely seen.

Well, thank you very much for giving me the platform and uh for allowing to have this frank conversation. I feel like I took a lot of from myself and that my

silence could be a contribution to to this war. But now I feel like I did

this war. But now I feel like I did something real and good. Thank you.

I think you did. Thanks very much.

Thank you.